Originally Posted by
Gunwolf
You are right, both haste and crit can be useful in a shorter window or target switching. And its true that we don't have as much crit based stuff as in the past like when it would proc flurry (kinda wish they added something like that back in).
I was trying to show how haste can be slightly overvalued in sims. When they give haste a certain weighted dps score it is based on several factors. For example... lets say haste reduces your CD's like SS and Ascendance. In a sim, it will use those cds asap and take full advantage of those reduced cd's. So in a 10 min fight, lets say with enough haste you can squeeze in an extra ascendance and like 5 extra SS's. That is obviously alot of extra damage and will result in haste having a high weighted value. But in an actual raid you have to delay your ascendance some for a certain mechanic or to burst down some adds (so you don't end up with an extra ascendance at the end), and you have to switch targets a few times which delays your SS by a few sec so it may have been available at 14sec instead of 16sec but you couldn't use it at 14 sec so that 2 sec reduction from haste was not taken advantage of (and at the end, you get 2 extra SS not 5). By not taking advantage of those reduced cd's right away, the contribution of haste to your dps isn't as high as it could be... so its weighted value can be misleading. The same logic can be used on SB procs... sometimes you get a SB proc but you can't use SS right away, either you have to refresh your buffs or throw out some heals or spam purge or you just made a player error and didn't use it right away. This is all stuff that a sim won't do, it doesn't make mistakes or do stuff like utility, so SB procs are highly valued because it can always take advantage of extra SS's.... but if you don't take advantage of SB procs right away, even just a few gcds, then that value from haste (or even mastery really) is wasted.
Now, I'm not saying haste is bad... its still very good, it still helps alot in those situations where you CAN take advantage of the lower cd's plus extra benefits like more melee swings for more SB procs or MS generation. Mastery is also clearly the best secondary, as it provides a passive damage buff to most of your abilities plus it increases SB procs which means that it indirectly also buffs SS damage.... I see alot of people complain that "our mastery should buff SS" or "our SS should do nature damage so mastery works on it".... and I have always thought that was a dumb suggestion since SS got plenty of buffs from weapon damage and AP already but now they fixed that issue too by actually finding a way to let mastery buff SS as well.
As for crit, it doesn't have as much synergy with our abilities as it did in the past with flurry but its still crit and does almost double damage... whether you are using SS, or refreshing imbues, or even throwing an offheal they can all crit and be more effective. Sure, its not as reliable as a flat damage buff like mastery or vers, but thats why getting a certain %crit can make a difference.... like 20, 25, 30, 33, 35% or whatever. Then it becomes more consistent and can multiply ur damage. In dungeons where adds can die quicker or you use more aoe, then benefit of crit can be more noticeable. Is that good enough to make it more useful then mastery or haste? No, not really.... but I personally don't think it should be ignored or undervalued to the point where you end up with <20% crit for example cause you want more haste... when that extra bit of crit might end up doing more for you then that extra bit of haste (esp if ur haste is already pretty high).
I admit this is pretty much "feelycraft" as people put it... its based on my understanding and experience with the game. I will try and test it out more once I have the right gear choices. Getting mastery/haste for all your gear slots is pretty obvious, but I'm thinking more like switching between same ilvl neck/rings with haste/vers or crit/vers to see how they compare in game (since the sims will obviously rate haste better). As for my suggestion, I prob should have worded it more like "Mastery is ur best stat, the priority is mastery>haste... but I try not to let my crit fall too low personally". I did clarify that in my next post... I wasn't trying to claim crit was more important then mastery or anything.