Trump just pissed off Beijing in a major way

[Bullettime]

Its bs. ever since nixon it's been the exact opposite.

Actions from our politicians speak louder obviously but to claim free markets aren't conservative is idiotic when the entire core of conservatism is smaller government while the free market pushes change.

edit: Just saw your edit. That's a lot of the concern with this as well. Our current GOP crucified Obama over the bailouts but pull the same stunts when convenient to their cause. It also opened the floodgates for corporate handouts.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Say what? This has been their number 1 driving platform philosophy for fucking ever and the absolute core of conservative economics. They tried to fucking crucify Obama over bailouts because corporate welfare goes against their "beliefs."

Well they certainly don't care about free market principles now that Trump is president. They were sucking off Ron Paul and his "small government" serenades years ago, now they're cheering on the government expansion under Trump.

These people have no values, at least no CONCRETE ones. They are not conservatives. They are tribalists. As long as "their guy" wins they'll follow him into hell.

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Actions from our politicians speak louder obviously but to claim free markets aren't conservative is idiotic when the entire core of conservatism is smaller government while the free market pushes change.

Free market principles are very core to conservatives, which is why many of the Trumples aren't conservative.

[Barnabas]

Actions from our politicians speak louder obviously but to claim free markets aren't conservative is idiotic when the entire core of conservatism is smaller government while the free market pushes change.

edit: Just saw your edit. That's a lot of the concern with this as well. Our current GOP crucified Obama over the bailouts but pull the same stunts when convenient to their cause. It also opened the floodgates for corporate handouts.

those guys in washington say it but don't believe it. obama just finished what bush started. its all bs.

[Knaar]

He can piss China all he wants, if he get buddy with Putin then China wont say a word.

[Barnabas]

Well they certainly don't care about free market principles now that Trump is president. They were sucking off Ron Paul and his "small government" serenades years ago, now they're cheering on the government expansion under Trump.

These people have no values, at least no CONCRETE ones. They are not conservatives. They are tribalists. As long as "their guy" wins they'll follow him into hell.

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Free market principles are very core to conservatives, which is why many of the Trumples aren't conservative.

yet he talked pence into taking the crony capital deal to boost confidence in the upcoming team. the money comes from indiana.

[Kasierith]

This is actually extremely good, and out of his many escapades since the election the only one I resoundingly agree with. Taiwan is the lynchpin for China shoving a docile US out of the Pacific, a diplomatic safepoint for annexation. If this is a sign that Trump will not compromise Taiwanese independence in favor of ties with China, this is a very good thing.

[Tierbook]

http://www.visualcapitalist.com/chin...two-economies/

Comparatively the US holds a bit over 9 trillion foreign securities/debt

[jdbond592]

I find the whole thing fascinating. A conservative will tell you that we better play nice to Russia because they have nukes. Should we play nice to North Korea?


On the other hand, we owe a trillion dollar to China. It is our biggest trading partner. It is second biggest economy in the world and 100 times more capitalist than Russia.


So lets go to war with China! They have nukes too? Who cares! Trump is not marrying Chinese whores!

Again, there is a reason why globalization is causing economic woes for some.

[Kallisto]

The fault wasn't talking to Taiwan. it was his blatant acknowledgement of Taiwan as its own entity.

To China, that's a punch in the eye and the US, and the rest of the world, have avoided making "official" comments like that about Taiwan. Journalists, diplomats, etc aren't even to make comments about Taiwan having an official government.

Taiwan has largely only been allowed to stay around because of its foreign ties and it never being acknowledged as more than a rogue Chinese territory that's friendly with us.

It sounds ridiculous but that's been the way things are for decades now. And with China becoming a rival economic power, options have always been playing ball or taking a hard stance, not beating around the bush throwing jabs.

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Say what? This has been their number 1 driving platform philosophy for fucking ever and the absolute core of conservative economics. They tried to fucking crucify Obama over bailouts because corporate welfare goes against their "beliefs."

The thing about Taiwan is that they are also playing the game wrong with who is in charge. Long term the status quo will benefit them.

Sooner or later China will have to modernise politically allowing more political freedoms as the middle class grows and places like Hong Kong push harder.

When this happens Taiwan based KMT at least will be using the Taiwan constitution to attempt to gain a foothold. Taiwan isn't a breakaway. It still officially considers itself true China.

Also if China modernising leeds to a fracture of the country like it has done a few times then Taiwan is already in place to come out of it in the best position being separate and could be the push for the political reunion.

[Macaquerie]

The thing about Taiwan is that they are also playing the game wrong with who is in charge. Long term the status quo will benefit them.

Sooner or later China will have to modernise politically allowing more political freedoms as the middle class grows and places like Hong Kong push harder.

When this happens Taiwan based KMT at least will be using the Taiwan constitution to attempt to gain a foothold. Taiwan isn't a breakaway. It still officially considers itself true China.

Also if China modernising leeds to a fracture of the country like it has done a few times then Taiwan is already in place to come out of it in the best position being separate and could be the push for the political reunion.

The Chinese government isn't really under any serious domestic pressure to reform and certainly isn't in danger of collapse any time soon. The thing is, all the propaganda and brainwashing has worked, so the public tends to view political dissidents as cranks and traitors, not as heroic rebels standing up to tyranny. If anything, the masses are more nationalistic than the government, and are pushing the leadership toward more aggressive and extreme action. Most Chinese officials are career bureaucrats, boring and pragmatic types who would rather not upset the apple cart too much, but the greater mass of peasants and workers don't understand the intricacies of international diplomacy that well, and eager to find any way to stick it to America. Indeed, the Chinese public is quite similar to Trump voters in many ways. Except in our case, the campaign rhetoric about America being a once-great civilization that has fallen on hard times and needs a strong leader to bring it back to the top was complete and utter bullshit, whereas it absolutely would apply to China.

[BourneWolf]

Yes a nuclear armed high school freshman that owns all of our manufacturing and owns 10% of our debt.

You have the prebious Presidents and policies to blame for being owned.

Sounds like you need a new leadership style to sort this situation out?

[Barnabas]

The Chinese government isn't really under any serious domestic pressure to reform and certainly isn't in danger of collapse any time soon. The thing is, all the propaganda and brainwashing has worked, so the public tends to view political dissidents as cranks and traitors, not as heroic rebels standing up to tyranny. If anything, the masses are more nationalistic than the government, and are pushing the leadership toward more aggressive and extreme action. Most Chinese officials are career bureaucrats, boring and pragmatic types who would rather not upset the apple cart too much, but the greater mass of peasants and workers don't understand the intricacies of international diplomacy that well, and eager to find any way to stick it to America. Indeed, the Chinese public is quite similar to Trump voters in many ways. Except in our case, the campaign rhetoric about America being a once-great civilization that has fallen on hard times and needs a strong leader to bring it back to the top was complete and utter bullshit, whereas it absolutely would apply to China.

They don't possess a domestic economy like the US has. Because china instead chose to have a weird economy that allows them to buy other countries debt. It's the path they chose to go down when the us and china agreed that the top 10% should get all the money while fucking over labor. If trump wants to break this up a bit I'm all for it. If china ends up in a boat that other countries decide to not buy their goods then they are forced to pass those reforms that are sitting there waiting to be passed. I think it will be a gradual thing so nobody rocks the boat too much and ends up in a war.

[Heltoray]

Do you really not agree?

Please enlighten me. If we stop doing business with them, our ability to borrow will hurt. But if they stop trading with us, that ruins over half their economy.

no matter how much you believe it, the US isnt the center of the world. Nor is it the only important country to trade with. There are alternatives. The Chinese are a collective, they will go through great hardships if they need to and they have learned to accept it. In case it comes down to this level, the Chinese will prevail.

[Huehuecoyotl]

This is actually extremely good, and out of his many escapades since the election the only one I resoundingly agree with. Taiwan is the lynchpin for China shoving a docile US out of the Pacific, a diplomatic safepoint for annexation. If this is a sign that Trump will not compromise Taiwanese independence in favor of ties with China, this is a very good thing.

You are suggesting that this is part of a carefully thought out strategy by Trump, which is interesting if true. But far more likely that this is Trump blundering in with his tiny feet (are his feet as tiny as his hands?) doing things when they pop into his brain, without care or thought for the diplomatic impact of them.

I didn't see anything of Trump during the election that suggested he had the ability to plan beyond the next woman he was going to molest.

[ifrah]

They don't possess a domestic economy like the US has. Because china instead chose to have a weird economy that allows them to buy other countries debt. It's the path they chose to go down when the us and china agreed that the top 10% should get all the money while fucking over labor. If trump wants to break this up a bit I'm all for it. If china ends up in a boat that other countries decide to not buy their goods then they are forced to pass those reforms that are sitting there waiting to be passed. I think it will be a gradual thing so nobody rocks the boat too much and ends up in a war.

The domestic economies of US and China are surely different, but any political reform towards more relaxed side is hardly happening. Not until something massive has happened, such as... I don't even know. Meanwhile they will slowly but surely tighten the grasp on anything that's not perfectly aligned with the CCP agenda, which means that Hong Kong is pretty much shafted in the coming decades, don't know what will happen to Taiwan. The recently happened legco-fiasco in Hong Kong with the two localist lawmakers shows what China is all about. And it seems that the current president/dictator is looking to be the equivalent to Mao in the power rankings of their leaders.

[Blobfish]

Im glad Trump may have pissed China off
There are so many Chinese secret Agents in Australia. and House prices are out of reach
to Millineals due to the Chinese buying all the Houses..

That I cannot wait for a War.. Bring it on.. And I am with the USA

[Vyxn]

So Obama allows the sell of billions of dollars of military equipment to Taiwan
No problem
Trump accepts a phone call from Taiwan
OMG Trump is starting WW3
do you now how stupid you Trump haters sound

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Source: http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/02/donal...iwan-call.html

So yeah Trump just managed to piss on 40 years of US policy, piss off Beijing, and it was probably on accident....

lets ask China how pissed off they are

Wang Yi plays down the Trump-Tsai call as a "small action", will not change bedrock of the "One China" policy governing Sino-U.S. relations.

https://twitter.com/suilee/status/80...rc=twsrc%5Etfw

its a swing and a miss
you can go to bed tonight and not worry about waking up to WW3

[vetinari]

Say what? This has been their number 1 driving platform philosophy for fucking ever and the absolute core of conservative economics. They tried to fucking crucify Obama over bailouts because corporate welfare goes against their "beliefs."

Just because a group of 1%ers and their cronies call themselves "conservative" doesn't actually make them conservative.

Of course, since they have been running the "conservative" political parties in the west for longer than you've been alive, its easy to see how you can make that mistake.

[Deleted]

"I just pushed that red button once! Really, where is the problem, guys?"

[Vyxn]

The fault wasn't talking to Taiwan. it was his blatant acknowledgement of Taiwan as its own entity.

but allowing the sale of billions of dollars of military equipment doesn't?