Immigration Simplified

[unbound]

Get the picture now? The USA cannot solve the problems of global poverty by letting a ton of people in. That just makes everyone's life worse off.

By NumbersUSA

Related Channels - The Alex Jones Channel, Right Side Broadcasting, Project Veritas Action.

So...either fake news or certainly extremist RW BS.

[Theodarzna]

Then don't bitch when Western countries do nothing.

What is the Left's solution other than keeping the train going? After all Obama got into more conflicts than Bush and doesn't seem willing to challenge his masters on the Google jet ect.

When will you realize you've been worshiping false idols?

[Aggrophobic]

Yes... If only it was that simple.

[nanook12]

You make it sound like there is a set amount of resources at all time and we have to juggle who gets what here in America. Those people "taking resources" are contributing (for the most part) back in "resources". It isn't some kind of draining. Your perception that "illegals come here to get on welfare" is wrong.

First law of thermodynamics energy is neither created or destroyed. In other words there is a set amount of energy in the universe and that is it. There is not more or less. And since energy is equal to mass via E=mc^2, then there is a limited amount of mass meaning there is a limited amount of resources and we cannot create more ever. We could use resources more efficiently, but that is a different argument all together. So yes, resources are limited. If a person wants to gain more resources on this planet, then someone somewhere has to lose some of their resources.

[Sunseeker]

nanook isn't here is debate with people in the the way you and I are used to. he has an idea, shits it out on the internet, and spends the next few pages or so arguing about why he's right without ever really discussing the issue.

I'm aware. He knows my position on things so I'm really not sure who he's arguing with, because I'm not arguing with him.

[The Stormbringer]

I think a discussion of whether the USA should even be trying to solve the problems of global poverty would be a worthwhile starting point.

If not the most successful country in the world, then who? Don't get me wrong, I think all successful nations should be working towards this goal, but to say the USA shouldn't help just seems unempathetic to me. It wouldn't just drop a lot of support that impoverished nations already receive, but it would set a poor example that others might very well follow.

[Theodarzna]

It was more of a series of rhetorical questions >_<. OP is pretending any pro-immigration policy to be aimed at solving world poverty, which is not the case.

At no point during the video is it suggested any party should stop helping.
Quite the opposite really: at the sight of continuous flooding in the area, they're proposing building a damn, rather feel good about what little we accomplish by picking a handful of people every time it floods.
Strategic investment abroad and all that.

IMHO, most immigration policies are designed so Sir. Richard Branson and company can have cheap maids and cheap restaurants to eat at and pretend their exotic and sophisticated.

[Sky High]

I will debate, but I am going to believe experts and data practically every time over a random forum poster. Stating what your opinion is and what you believe is not going to sway me much in the face of data and expert analysis.

oh so it's a matter of us doing the leg work for you or just showering you with links. I'll keep that in mind.

[Darsithis]

First law of thermodynamics energy is neither created or destroyed. In other words there is a set amount of energy in the universe and that is it. There is not more or less. And since energy is equal to mass via E=mc^2, then there is a limited amount of mass meaning there is a limited amount of resources and we cannot create more ever. We could use resources more efficiently, but that is a different argument all together.

Your argument fails since matter and energy are converted (on a global scale) constantly back and forth, like the ebb and flow of the tides.

There is not a set amount of energy for America and when one additional person comes here we suddenly all have less.

[Theodarzna]

Pretend? I've never been alarmist. You can try and find where I have been, but I've never once been in the WORLD WILL END camp.

I do think we should take action because I want to preserve what we have right now, I WANT to take action, but if the world changes, who's to say it will be the end of human life? It will be difficult. But that's all we really know. Calling something a cliff is fairly alarmist, since humans have always adapted to their situation. Not saying we shouldn't take measures to abate it, but again... cliff. Wut.

Tell me, do you have a kid? or one on the way?

I actually don't believe in preserving what we have now, I think the cost of preservation of THIS! will be self destructive and we will have to live with less.

[NED funded]

Its arguments are arguments nobody proposes. I don't speak of national identity, I mean jurisdiction and law.

But ignore the point, the only reason we import people at all is for a specific regions economic benefit. If there is no growing number of people, there is no cause for import or migration.

If their cultures are sufficiently compatible with ours then their laws will be as well.
It's arguments are made in terms of efficiency gains. As I told you open borders is not about importing people but to allow labour to move freely.

[nanook12]

By NumbersUSA

Related Channels - The Alex Jones Channel, Right Side Broadcasting, Project Veritas Action.

So...either fake news or certainly extremist RW BS.

I suppose you are going to deny hard data from The World Bank and U.S. Census Bureau also?

[Darsithis]

I suppose you are going to deny hard data from The World Bank and U.S. Census Bureau also?

Data is easily misinterpreted to fit a specific bias.

I'm not arguing that all immigration is good, and I'm not saying all immigrants are hard-working people. Some obviously aren't. There are also plenty of American-born people who are lazy as fuck and don't work either. It's not a matter of immigration, it's a matter of humans.

[nanook12]

Your argument fails since matter and energy are converted (on a global scale) constantly back and forth, like the ebb and flow of the tides.

There is not a set amount of energy for America and when one additional person comes here we suddenly all have less.

Good luck converting energy back to mass. Last I checked you will get a Nobel prize for making entropy flow in reverse from energy to mass.

[Endus]

Except for everyone single one we invite to our country it takes up that much more in resources for actual Americans.

As others have pointed out, resources aren't limited in that sense. More immigrants contribute additional labor and provide an additional market for goods; there is no 'drain on resources'.

At no point during the video is it suggested any party should stop helping.
Quite the opposite really: at the sight of continuous flooding in the area, they're proposing building a damn, rather feel good about what little we accomplish by picking a handful of people every time it floods.
Strategic investment abroad and all that.

People like nanook12 ARE proposing you stop helping. Hence my post.

Their proposals are less "build a dam to fix the problem" and more "build a wall so the flood victims can't escape and just die in their flood plains".

[markos82]

Get the picture now? The USA cannot solve the problems of global poverty by letting a ton of people in. That just makes everyone's life worse off.

But USA can attack countries that are 10k km away and that 98% of Americans have never heard of? Destroy their economy, infrastructure, basically crating chaos in a country in the name of peace thus making millions homeless?!

[nanook12]

Data is easily misinterpreted to fit a specific bias.

I'm not arguing that all immigration is good, and I'm not saying all immigrants are hard-working people. Some obviously aren't. There are also plenty of American-born people who are lazy as fuck and don't work either. It's not a matter of immigration, it's a matter of humans.

Well my side is winning. A very anti-immigration president has been elected. That speaks volumes about what Americans think is important, and immigration is clearly a big problems on their minds.

[Endus]

Good luck converting energy back to mass. Last I checked you will get a Nobel prize for making entropy flow in reverse from energy to mass.

The world isn't a closed system, and if you want to get into the physics of things, humanity doesn't "consume" resources to begin with. We just convert them. Like all life does.

[Theodarzna]

If their cultures are sufficiently compatible with ours then their laws will be as well.
It's arguments are made in terms of efficiency gains. As I told you open borders is not about importing people but to allow labour to move freely.

If there is no surplus of people, labor either won't have cause to move, OR the movement will be parasitic, one are trying to force a migration.

The falling fertility that Modernity seems to bring is still an unresolved problem for these models.

[Darsithis]

Good luck converting energy back to mass. Last I checked you will get a Nobel prize for making entropy flow in reverse from energy to mass.

We both do every time we eat food. Checkmate.