Need help, Guild having problems in Heroic.

[Alextros]

So am looking at your Holy Paladin, who is quite frankly doing not the best of jobs, considering the gear the he/she has. Look at the logs from the last attempt at Nightmare Dragons (https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...aling&source=3). we have a grand total of 15 casts of Holy Shock over a 4min and 22 second long fight. With about 10% haste, that means Holy shock was unused 50% of the time (about 8.1sec CD, with 15 casts equals about 121 seconds of being on CD).
On the same time, there are 17 casts of Light of the Martyr instead, where as I can only question that, seeing that Holy shock has such a low rate of use.

Just look at this:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...4false%2420473
Around 2.30 he died. He used what looks like a single Light of the Martyr (LotM) right before. He has a dot on him/her, which is not taken care of, and then starts using LotM? Ressed a few moments later, fine... And starts using it again right off the bat... With half health. About a minute later it is spammed, which I assume is panic spamming. Poor choice of spell casts, especially because Holy Shock was not even on Cooldown. The whole period between 2:57 and 3:37 is empty of Holy Shock, while it is chuck full of LotM. That's a total of 3 casts losts atleast. Even the first LotM cast, Holy shock was not even on Cooldown.
LotM should not be demonized, but in this case, you should tell him to remove it from his Actionbars till he/she knows how to use it. Used in all the wrong ways in this case...


Abit gearwise -> Unenchanted and gemmed items is what I can see on the Armory, might be outdated, dont know.
Mark of the Ancient Priestess is what is on the Necklace. Tell him/her to get rid of it. Trained Soldier, or even the 75 stat enchants from WoD are better (Litterally did less that 1% of the healing so...)
Heightened Senses is not the best of trinket, yes it gives Intellect, but the haste is low and useless. A Statstick around 850 with Crit or Mastery is more worth at the current point of gear (DmfD:Hellfire is pretty good).
A slight note, get your Retribution Paladin to use Greater Blessing of Might on 3 dps.... Greater Blessing of Wisdom is wasted, especially on a Holy Paladin.....(https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ce=3&spell=100)

On the board of Cooldown usage - Tyr's Deliverance (our Artifact ability), was used once. It has a 1.5min CD, and is basicly free healing.
Rule of Law is used 3 times in total. It has 2 charges and a 30sec CD, and increases your range by 50%, should be constantly on CD for this fight, if you know how to position yourself, you can basicly be healing both teams on Nightmare dragons.
He has Holy Prism in his talents. Not used a single time whatsoever. Same goes for Bestow Faith, not used a single time. He might aswell have used Divine Purpose instead of Holy Prism, might have yielded him/her something.
The first 2 casts of Light of Dawn is pure overheal. Why? Waste of mana and global.
Your Paladin is running Judgment of Light talent, but only casted Judgment 8 times throughout the fight. Unless he starts being able to focus more on using his short and long cooldowns better, he should be running with Sanctified Wrath as talent, as it would benefit him more...

This is all I have for now, getting too late now. But get your paladin to look at the his/her own logs. I could properly find more flaws that needs fixing. It is not to be a perfectionist, am making mistakes myself, but even some of the main mechanics of Holy Paladin is thrown out of the window here. Can't tell for positioning (but it does seem wrong as far as I can see), but cooldown management is downright poor and and tunnel visioning during high pressure moments is bad.

Edit: Didn't see you were the Holy Paladin in some of the posts, but same applies. You got some work to do

[psyquest]

get your guild together.

you want to do mythic? you are nowhere near ready.

1. everyone (I mean everyone) can learn more about their class. Your guys need to start from the basics. understand what dps is and what rotation is.
they also need to understand what talent to select for a boss and more importantly WHY.

The above 1 is true regardless. There should be no better satisfaction than playing your class to its maximum regardless of difficulty and gear.

2. whats the goal of the guild? if it is heroic then see 1, emphasize 1, keep on 1 until people start knowing their class and playing it at the required mastery whislt avoiding shit and following a strategy.

3. anyone can progress, IF they want to and are willing to put it a bit of reading a practice. Those in your guild that do not care and just want to "play as they want" will keep you from any progress. Your choice, eventually it might come down to progress or friends?

good luck.

note: I did not even brush on the importance of a good raid leader that can help the team progress and get better.

[Deleted]

I'm gonna focus a bit on your Blood DK here, as that's what I've been playing for the last 3 expansions, while clearing out all of the top end of the content.

First of all his/her choice of talents are a bit strange, especially since he/she seems to be quite new to the class and/or game. Now the first 5 talents are all good, but I'd personally swap away from Rune Tap in favour of Foul Bulwark, as Rune Tap is difficult to use properly and will generally lead to a net survivability loss as missused Rune Taps will drain runes which could instead be used to build more runic power and bone shield stacks.

Bonestorm is a fun talent, but generally does not have the same usefullness as Purgatory would, as you can't effectively use Bonestorm on many bosses, and even when you can, you're not likely to be taking enough damage to get the full use out of it.

Now, what goes for general gameplay, there's severe lack of usage of Marrowrend, which in this case lead to long periods where there's no bone shields active and he / she is taking the full amount of damage. I see 62 casts of Heart Strike but only 15 casts of Marrowrend, which over that duration is a horrible imbalance. If one is uncertain of how to execute it I would suggest over using Marrowrend rather than under using it, try making him / her focus on keeping the bone shield stacks between 6 - 10 at all times to begin with and as the general understanding gets better, focus on keeping it at ~6 stacks. Any runes left over can then be used to Heart Strike. It's not perfect execution, but it's a good place to start and it should make life way easier for the healers since there's unnaturally large spikes in damage intake in those logs.

There's a lot more underlying there but those are the most glaring problems. If those can be fixed you'll at least have a reasonably sturdy tank, once the basics are there you can dwelve more into detail.

[Joeydivision82]

I had a similar situation coming into Legion with some new blood after WoD and felt like we couldn't break through Heroic. After a while me and the officers took a step back and looked at our core and made some major changes. We looked and saw we had some people who were doing we're really low and looked into why. A few of them were just not happy or motivated with their class and we had them switch to what they were more comfortable with and their dps shot up considerably at a lower ilevel.

We looked up rotations and worked on them and ran sims to see what we should be doing different. It made a big difference and we started pushing through Heroic much quicker. We did get slowed down by a few people leaving, like our OT, and a healer but we managed to get through it.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm gonna focus a bit on your Blood DK here, as that's what I've been playing for the last 3 expansions, while clearing out all of the top end of the content.

First of all his/her choice of talents are a bit strange, especially since he/she seems to be quite new to the class and/or game. Now the first 5 talents are all good, but I'd personally swap away from Rune Tap in favour of Foul Bulwark, as Rune Tap is difficult to use properly and will generally lead to a net survivability loss as missused Rune Taps will drain runes which could instead be used to build more runic power and bone shield stacks.

Bonestorm is a fun talent, but generally does not have the same usefullness as Purgatory would, as you can't effectively use Bonestorm on many bosses, and even when you can, you're not likely to be taking enough damage to get the full use out of it.

Now, what goes for general gameplay, there's severe lack of usage of Marrowrend, which in this case lead to long periods where there's no bone shields active and he / she is taking the full amount of damage. I see 62 casts of Heart Strike but only 15 casts of Marrowrend, which over that duration is a horrible imbalance. If one is uncertain of how to execute it I would suggest over using Marrowrend rather than under using it, try making him / her focus on keeping the bone shield stacks between 6 - 10 at all times to begin with and as the general understanding gets better, focus on keeping it at ~6 stacks. Any runes left over can then be used to Heart Strike. It's not perfect execution, but it's a good place to start and it should make life way easier for the healers since there's unnaturally large spikes in damage intake in those logs.

There's a lot more underlying there but those are the most glaring problems. If those can be fixed you'll at least have a reasonably sturdy tank, once the basics are there you can dwelve more into detail.

As a Blood DK myself, I second this. I haven't had a chance to look at everything just yet, but I can say with certainty that those talents are not favored for any reason.

[blackstoise]

Hey, everyone else pointed out most of the issues already. I think your guild probably has mostly new players. Even if they read this thread, they will not get much information, and honestly might get discouraged from playing.

My suggestion to you is this: Ease them into the raids. Tell them to start looking up guides, because despite what newer players believe, this game is fairly complex. Have them set-up key binds for their abilities, and practice using them in Dungeons. Go through Normal Mode again, but tell them all to aim to do as close to 300k dps as they can. All of them can do at least 220k. After this, go into heroic. They are all lacking basic knowledge in the game, which is an easy fix.

[Haznomana]

So I'm the Elemental Shaman in the raid. I know i have some work to do, but is there any Ele Shaman that can look over my logs and help me out. I use Askmrrobot and ive used icy-veins and advise from other players and Noxxic and ive even fooled around with stat weights and pretty much everything i know about. i dont know if i am where i am supposed to be because dps logs change on pretty much a daily basis. Im hoping someone can criticize me in a constructive manner.

[zoomgpally]

Tl;dr most of the raid team is clueless and doesn't put in the minimal effort to raid. Everyone should google how to play their class, as they dont even understand the basics

Maybe they did google it and found noxxic?

[Doffen]

Maybe they did google it and found noxxic?

haha

Seriously tho, check the log, fire mages doing 100k. And they nerf fire on ptr.. Speechless.


To be even more serious, I am in a normal/heroic guild myself. Not enough people for mythics, and frankly the guild isn't good enough. We just overgear heroic content so much in the end, then we clear it. Thats a nice strategy(HC EN is too easy tho, but good for us) I think OP's guild is somewhat in the same state. My advice is to go do some more normals. Get some more gear. That will ease it up a bit, makes up for mistakes and so on. We don't stop guildies from playing either, tho we have some requirements. Makes some requirements, help each other with crafted gear up to 855 etc. People saying gear isnt a problem, but gear will make stuff easier anyway.

Of course, some changes in how to play your class/spec too. Try that on those normal runs, try out stuff and in the end you'll get better at playing Its just a little effort thats required, and you are set!

[Datenshi]

So I'm the Elemental Shaman in the raid. I know i have some work to do, but is there any Ele Shaman that can look over my logs and help me out. I use Askmrrobot and ive used icy-veins and advise from other players and Noxxic and ive even fooled around with stat weights and pretty much everything i know about. i dont know if i am where i am supposed to be because dps logs change on pretty much a daily basis. Im hoping someone can criticize me in a constructive manner.

if you want someone to check your logs and give tips and tricks for specific classes/specs it is usually best to go to the class forums on this site.
for shamans this is: http://www.mmo-champion.com/forums/276-Shaman

hope this helps