There is no proof to either. The only thing found was Russian hackers got access to a decent chunk of states registration databases. There has never been any proof of wide spread illegal voting that would sway an election. Locally yes, but nothing large enough to effect a national election.
Let's hope its one /last/ time this time.
As for this topic itself, well, I don't believe Russia has any capacity to influence election on such a scale as to propell Trump into Presidency. This is just unrealistic. Mainstream media has reported over and over again that no one can technically "hack into" electoral process, as it is very decentralized and for this to have any real impact they would have to hack into many systems at once, which would probably be discovered by now and mainstream media would've gone total apeshit and blame Putin for Clinton loss and maybe demand another election, who knows.
Now there's the issue I just want to point out for everyone to know, since Clinton campaign has actively forced the notion that 17 agencies have admitted it was Russians. That is simply a fearmongering bait. There were no 17 agencies who made this statement, you'll find nothing about it except for references to what Clinton herself said, and let me just say this, she wasn't exactly honest about this, more like trying to get more votes, playing the Russia and Putin is to blame card.
What happened was two agencies, DIA and CIA made a pretty political and not factual statement.
Taken from https://www.dhs.gov/news/2016/10/07/...ector-national
I hope I don't need to compare "we believe" and "we have undeniable proof" for our liberal friends here. It was just another hogwash made to support Hillary's presidential ambition, with no proof whatsoever, if this was posted on this forum, mods would've been in full right to close the topic on the grounds that this is but a conspiracy theory.The U.S. Intelligence Community (USIC) is confident that the Russian Government directed the recent compromises of e-mails from US persons and institutions, including from US political organizations. The recent disclosures of alleged hacked e-mails on sites like DCLeaks.com and WikiLeaks and by the Guccifer 2.0 online persona are consistent with the methods and motivations of Russian-directed efforts. These thefts and disclosures are intended to interfere with the US election process. Such activity is not new to Moscow—the Russians have used similar tactics and techniques across Europe and Eurasia, for example, to influence public opinion there. We believe, based on the scope and sensitivity of these efforts, that only Russia's senior-most officials could have authorized these activities.
So I don't believe its something more than a Cold War era conspiracy theory. And its even more funny when we take into account how Russia's tech is outdated and sucks(according to media at least) but still they managed to hack their way into one of the most secure(which I hope it is, cuz I pay taxes) systems in the world.
But, apparently liberals just need that russian scapegoat they can shift their blame to, in order not to look completely ridiculous. What comes of this investigation, we shall see, I'm just hoping its not another one of this political statements along the lines of "We think its Russia, but we have no proof, but its Russia, you know, the USSR, the Cold War, bad Putin guy, so our guess might be true"
Last edited by The Emperor; 2016-12-09 at 08:06 PM.
Polls are polls, they are allowed to be wrong, becasue people lie when they are not confronted face to face, and in the case of being perceived as racist or bigoted, people tend to say they would vote for a minority or female. Plus, polls usually try to get likely voters, there is no guarantee that one those people will actually vote, and vote for who the told the pollster they would vote fore.
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi
2014 Gamergate: "If you want games without hyper sexualized female characters and representation, then learn to code!"
2023: "What's with all these massively successful games with ugly (realistic) women? How could this have happened?!"
You know what the really sad thing is? That you actually believe that.
No one sensible gives two fucks that Clinton lost. The concern is that Trump won. And yes, there is a massive difference between the two. Though I have no doubt believing that you won't be able to process such a difference.
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi