Ohio passes 'heartbeat' abortion bill

[Belisarius565]

Your own link disagrees with your assertion that it's "just because they don't want them." In most cases, it's because they don't feel confident in their ability to provide for the child and fulfill their current responsibilities simultaneously.

No my point was that many times other than hurt to the mother or rape, or other horrible cases, they just want to murder their children and not take care of them.

[Chrysia]

No my point was that many times other than hurt to the mother or rape, or other horrible cases, they just want to murder their children and not take care of them.

Murder is a legal term. It is factually not murder to have an abortion.

No, they don't want to kill the child, they feel unequipped to care for it given their current situation.

[Jtbrig7390]

And by this you don't give a damn about the most innocent people in the world that are dieing to abortions because most cases they "just don't want them." Stop your damn holier then attitude when innocent babies are dieing, being ripped into pieces and stabbed through the head to kill them.

After the baby is born, are you going to help take care of it? Walk it to school? Teach it how to drive and so on?

If not then your opinion on the matter means nothing. The only people who's opinion matters is the "Father" and "Mother" of the unborn child.

The fetus is not a child, the fetus does not feel pain,is not sad or happy. It is no different then a tumor. You nore the Government have any right to tell someone what they can and can't do with there tumor.

[ReleaseDay]

During the early phases, it's no more alive than a tumor, but /whatever.

And I'm an athiest/agnostic, yep. Raised Presbyterian/Catholic but ended up changing my views over time.

I actually have a big problem taking lives, it's why I voted to end the death penalty in California (which sadly remains a thing) and voted against the proposition to limit the number of appeals death row inmates can make to cut down on the costs to taxpayers (which sadly passed). I'm also largely anti-war.
.

Yep, way to embrace the stereotype. See, theres a quite distinguishable difference between abortion and death penalty, the most obvious (or should be..) is that, most people on death row deserve to be there, while not a single child deserves to die.


I'm very much pro death penalty, but definitely anti-abortion.

[Halyon]

You wouldn't want anyone to flush you anywhere and die, so why do you want unwanted humans to do too?

Good thing there's a pretty significant difference between me and what's ostensibly just a clump of tissue. It's developing tissue, sure, but it's not developed to any meaningful degree, so...yeah.

And no child is harmed...because a zygote/fetus is not a child, otherwise it would be called as such, outside just emotional attachment...

You calling it a child doesn't change medicine/science mate.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm very much pro death penalty, but definitely anti-abortion.

You realize this is the exact stereotype of a pro-'lifer' yes?

[Belisarius565]

Your own link disagrees with your assertion that it's "just because they don't want them." In most cases, it's because they don't feel confident in their ability to provide for the child and fulfill their current responsibilities simultaneously.

- - - Updated - - -



Because no human has the right to survive at the active expense of another's right to bodily autonomy.

This is not a case of body mutilation, its another human being inside of that body, that will have a life, sure their might be complications all life long, but its the choice of terminating the baby.

- - - Updated - - -

Good thing there's a pretty significant difference between me and what's ostensibly just a clump of tissue. It's developing tissue, sure, but it's not developed to any meaningful degree, so...yeah.

And no child is harmed...because a zygote/fetus is not a child, otherwise it would be called as such, outside just emotional attachment...

You calling it a child doesn't change medicine/science mate.

- - - Updated - - -



You realize this is the exact stereotype of a pro-'lifer' yes?

You were that zygote/fetus, that is most 100% a person, as it will continue to grow older and develop, and you want to stop that process.

[Halyon]

You were that zygote/fetus, that is most 100% a person, as it will continue to grow older and develop, and you want to stop that process.

So? Had I been aborted, I would never have known, nor cared. Yeah, I'm somewhat glad to be alive now, but only because I even able to comprehend the scope of it, which took maturing well beyond the age of 10 years old...

Fetus don't gove a damn...because it can't.

[Masark]

You were that zygote/fetus, that is most 100% a person, as it will continue to grow older and develop, and you want to stop that process.

So is a miscarriage manslaughter?

[Edge-]

Yep, way to embrace the stereotype. See, theres a quite distinguishable difference between abortion and death penalty, the most obvious (or should be..) is that, most people on death row deserve to be there, while not a single child deserves to die.


I'm very much pro death penalty, but definitely anti-abortion.

A. Fetus. Is. Not. A. Child.

Please remember that, it's kinda important.

Also, our justice system is deeply flawed, so we honestly can't be reasonably sure that everyone on death row is in fact guilty (we've seen plenty of convictions overturned), and I'm more than happy to pay my taxes to help house them for the rest of their lives away from society, or give them the chance to have their convictions overturned if they're innocent.

And I never said children, or fetuses, deserve to die. But I will still hold up a woman's right to choose what to do with her body, and if that means aborting an unwanted and unexpected pregnancy because they don't feel that they are capable of raising that child with the love and support and home any child growing up deserves. I think that's a hell of a lot better than forcing both mother and child (and possibly the father) to go through a shitty few decades while they deal with raising the child that they may love to pieces, but weren't ready for or may not have even wanted.

Not sure what stereotype I'm embracing, and don't really care either.

So is a miscarriage manslaughter?

Using that logic, yep : P

And if the mother did anything to endanger the child, like smoking or drinking, that could be assault and battery, or a host of other charges.

This rabbit hole is fun to go down, because the further down you go the less of a human the woman becomes as she's stripped of more and more rights as the number of things that become illegal for her to do increases : D

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

A fetus will most likely develop into a child. You are just playing semantics.
This fetus is a creation of a man and a woman and to end it with an abortion would bring me a lot of guilt.
Imagine the life it could have had?

But it isn't a child. That thinking is on the same level of thinking sperm is sacred because it has the potential to be a child. Most pregnancies fail by themselves anyway. They don't even get to a noticeable stage. I wouldn't say a fetus will "most likely" do anything of the sort.

- - - Updated - - -

There is many complications to prevent you from growing to an old age, but you still should not have someone make an effort to murder you either.

Well good thing I'm already a sentient being, and a fetus is not even close to being.

[Chrysia]

This is not a case of body mutilation, its another human being inside of that body, that will have a life, sure their might be complications all life long, but its the choice of terminating the baby.

Who brought up body mutilation?

Bodily autonomy is the control of your body, and that includes whether other people get to use your body to survive.

Completely ridiculous, not-quite parallel analogy here: Say you do something that causes someones kidney to fail. You, and you alone, are available to provide a kidney to that person within the time frame to save that person's life. You are not legally required to donate your kidney to save that person's life.

Your right to your own organs is absolute, to the point that they can't even be harvested after your death without your explicit permission beforehand. A woman's uterus is not an exception. If the woman doesn't want her uterus to house a fetus, regardless of the circumstances that led to that fetus being there, she cannot be compelled to house that fetus in her uterus.

[Slybak]

Can't you basically get all the way to the six week limit while reasonably unaware that you're even pregnant if you aren't expecting it?

Yes. Plus the overwhelming majority of OB/GYNs won't even schedule an office visit for a pregnant woman until she's at 8+ weeks because there's a reasonably high chance that she'll miscarry before that time. At 10 weeks the first prenatal blood screening tests are done to check for severe birth defects and chromosomal abnormalities. Additional sonograms and blood screenings occur over the subsequent 10-11 weeks, after which the possibility of severe defects/abnormalities are ruled out.

This law would effectively ban abortions in nearly all circumstances, which is what its designed to do.

[lavaalamp]

A fetus isn't a Human...If Anyone thinks a Fetus is a Human They should Also think Twice about beating their monkey stick because by their uneducated logic Sperm is a Human also. Stop trying to control things you don't know shit about.

[Sargerasraider]

So is a miscarriage manslaughter?

Is someone dying of some natural cause manslaughter? Your statement makes no sense.

A. Fetus. Is. Not. A. Child.

Please remember that, it's kinda important.

For consistency, do you believe in abortion up to term? If not, where do fetal personhood rights begin to exist and where do they trump bodily autonomy rights?

A fetus isn't a Human...If Anyone thinks a Fetus is a Human They should Also think Twice about beating their monkey stick because by their uneducated logic Sperm is a Human also. Stop trying to control things you don't know shit about.

Fertilization produces a genetically distinct entity. Gametes are not this. Your statement also makes no sense.

[Jtbrig7390]

Fertilization produces a genetically distinct entity. Gametes are not this. Your statement also makes no sense.

Based on scientific fact his statement makes perfect sense. The problem is you just don't like it because it defeats your argument. There is also religions that agree with his statement and those religions are anti-abortion.

[Espe]

Is someone dying of some natural cause manslaughter?

To put this unhinged rant in perspective, remember this is a guy who just a few pages back admitted he would force young girls or women to carry the products of rape and incest to term. Someone who clearly doesn't give a fuck about the constitutional right women have to bodily autonomy or the mass harm Republicans want to cause.

[Sargerasraider]

Based on scientific fact his statement makes perfect sense. The problem is you just don't like it because it defeats your argument. There is also religions that agree with his statement and those religions are anti-abortion.

It is patently obvious that there is a difference between haploid gametes (derived from the genetic material of a single individual) and a genetically distinct entity produced following fertilization.

[Masark]

Is someone dying of some natural cause manslaughter? Your statement makes no sense.

How do you know its natural causes?

[Jtbrig7390]

It is patently obvious that there is a difference between haploid gametes (derived from the genetic material of a single individual) and a genetically distinct entity produced following fertilization.

Once again, A fetus is just a fetus, It doesn't feel its just a sack of shit. You nore anyone else has the right to tell someone to keep the fetus.

Yes there is a difference in sperm and a fetus. But by ur logic jacking off is also killing future children.

[Sargerasraider]

How do you know its natural causes?

People die. It is a fact of this world if you haven't noticed. The vast majority of these are not due to any sort of foul play. Most cases of fetal demise are not due to any person's intention.

Yes there is a difference in sperm and a fetus. But by ur logic jacking off is also killing future children.

I really don't understand what you're trying to get at here... those two sentences don't logically follow each other.

I do find the dehumanization statements in this thread eerily reminiscent of other times in history.