[7.0 Retribution Paladin] Guide and Discussion

[Lumineus]

You mean the trinket? It's OK for tanks I guess. Another PITA to watch out for in WPvP. Meh.

[Eon Drache]

So how do you guys like this Archimonde's Ret Ripoff Legendary cape so far?

You mean the one that does like 4x the damage with a shorter CD and extra stats?

[Morally Grey Storm]

You mean the one that does like 4x the damage with a shorter CD and extra stats?

Yes, that one.
Seems balanced and engaging and new and exciting to me.
How about you lot?

[Useful]

Guys I failed to find the answer by myself - can someone explain why we should TV on 4 hp. I use a g103 macro for rotation, and it works fine. but the macro uses TV on 3 hp. (or whenever its available)

[BrassTheRet]

870 WOTA relic or 885 Highlord's Judgment? +4 artifact itemlevel and an increase to judgment damage but I lose 2.5 second off WOTA. I had a friend sim my character and it decreases my mean dps by 8k even though my artifact is going from 903 to 907. Why is this the case? Crusade is a 2 minute cooldown whereas I can use judgment more often then the amount of times I can use crusade.

[Illuria]

870 WOTA relic or 885 Highlord's Judgment? +4 artifact itemlevel and an increase to judgment damage but I lose 2.5 second off WOTA. I had a friend sim my character and it decreases my mean dps by 8k even though my artifact is going from 903 to 907. Why is this the case? Crusade is a 2 minute cooldown whereas I can use judgment more often then the amount of times I can use crusade.

Because 2.5s extra doing 52.5% increased damage with 52.5% increased haste every 2 minutes is worth way more than 8% Judgement damage. Crusade is so key to our damage output that every extra bit of Crusade duration is worth its weight in gold. Single-target DPS with Crusade active skyrockets to very high values, whereas our non-Crusade output is mediocre at best. It's why the best parses on bosses like Nythendra and Ursoc are ones where you don't get targeted by mechanics during your Crusade and the fight ends just as Crusade does.

[BrassTheRet]

Because 2.5s extra doing 52.5% increased damage with 52.5% increased haste every 2 minutes is worth way more than 8% Judgement damage. Crusade is so key to our damage output that every extra bit of Crusade duration is worth its weight in gold. Single-target DPS with Crusade active skyrockets to very high values, whereas our non-Crusade output is mediocre at best. It's why the best parses on bosses like Nythendra and Ursoc are ones where you don't get targeted by mechanics during your Crusade and the fight ends just as Crusade does.

I think it's such a bad design that a 870>885. Also, I recently got a 860 Eye of command and I'm currently using FC(880) and Stat Stick with Versatility(875), but apparently eye of command is a 400 dps decrease from my median dps and a reduction of my maximum dps. Eye increases my minimum dps by 6k. Should I go with the Stat Stick or eye? 860 eye is supposed to be on par with a 880 versaility stat stick. Why is this?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=234468278

[Perkan]

Sup my fellow paladin highlords,

875 +2% to TV > 845 WoTA yeah?

My other two slots are WoTA relic equipped already.

[Deleted]

I think it's such a bad design that a 870>885. Also, I recently got a 860 Eye of command and I'm currently using FC(880) and Stat Stick with Versatility(875), but apparently eye of command is a 400 dps decrease from my median dps and a reduction of my maximum dps. Eye increases my minimum dps by 6k. Should I go with the Stat Stick or eye? 860 eye is supposed to be on par with a 880 versaility stat stick. Why is this?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=234468278

Eye is about as good as an ilvl 870 versa stat stick, according to the table. A 875-880 ilvl versa should be better than one due to having considerably more strength.

[elvor0]

Guys I failed to find the answer by myself - can someone explain why we should TV on 4 hp. I use a g103 macro for rotation, and it works fine. but the macro uses TV on 3 hp. (or whenever its available)

It partially depends on circumstance, but it's mainly to vent HoPo so that you don't have CS capping and BoW coming off CD at the same time thus wasting HoPo generation time. And if you have a TFoJ you're going to only spend 2 HoPo on your next TV, thus leaving you closer to 5 HoPo when you cast TV. You basically don't want any spell casts to be delaying the casts of other spells. Apart from the start of the fight and special circumstances, in an optimal world, only one thing should ever be off CD at once, unless of course you have 5 HoPo, judgement isn't about to wear off and judgement is off CD, in which case you should vent HoPo.

How exactly does this macro work? Is it just one button mash or....?

[Deleted]

don´t let this macro conversion get outside of this thread... Took me years to get people of my back with the "ret is one button macro class. lul!" BS.^^
that said please share our DK tank leveled his ret and I fear he will die of mental overload with out some serious help.^^

[S3nsenmann]

Hi guys, so I have a 865 Venom Fanged Barbute as Helmet right now (Haste/Mastery), but got a 855 PvP Head which has Haste/Vers.
Which one would you wear?

[Ulthane]

So i have a feeling the cape is gonna get nerfed : /

If they go on about changing legendaries to not be mando id probably do the following.

Final Verdict: Uses old legendary cape effect.

Cloak: Now buffs Divine Purpose % chance
Bracers: Lowers cd of Holy Wrath amd always causes Holy Wrath yo do Max damage
Helm: Causes HoJ to gen Holy Power.

[Piwielle]

Guys I failed to find the answer by myself - can someone explain why we should TV on 4 hp. I use a g103 macro for rotation, and it works fine. but the macro uses TV on 3 hp. (or whenever its available)

That macro isn't within ToS. I don't care, and you probably will never really get banned for it, but you technically could. Just saying it in case you're not aware.
On your actual question, it's better to use TV when every generator is recharging, to generate more holy power over the course of a fight. It's a slight increase though, and if you're using a macro I'm guessing you don't really care about minmaxing, so it's probably mostly irrelevant for you !

I think it's such a bad design that a 870>885. Also, I recently got a 860 Eye of command and I'm currently using FC(880) and Stat Stick with Versatility(875), but apparently eye of command is a 400 dps decrease from my median dps and a reduction of my maximum dps. Eye increases my minimum dps by 6k. Should I go with the Stat Stick or eye? 860 eye is supposed to be on par with a 880 versaility stat stick. Why is this?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=234468278

Eye is a very good trinket, if you can maintain the buff. It's pretty normal that it's on par with a 880 stat stick. I'd keep both, and use the Eye on fights where you won't switch and can have a good uptime on the buff.

Sup my fellow paladin highlords,

875 +2% to TV > 845 WoTA yeah?

My other two slots are WoTA relic equipped already.

Yes. You can sim it to be sure, but 99% yes. Too much of an ilvl upgrade.

Hi guys, so I have a 865 Venom Fanged Barbute as Helmet right now (Haste/Mastery), but got a 855 PvP Head which has Haste/Vers.
Which one would you wear?

Probably the higher ilvl one if it's haste heavy, if not, sim it. But sim it either way.


On the topic of legendaries, I'm hoping our cloak will be forgotten, they seem to have forgotten it for every legendaries iteration so far, who knows, they may keep it that way.

[Splatter]

On the topic of legendaries, I'm hoping our cloak will be forgotten, they seem to have forgotten it for every legendaries iteration so far, who knows, they may keep it that way.

The cloak isn't a huge dps boost the way many other legendaries are. Its closer to 4-5% which is in the acceptable margins.

[Michael000]

The cloak isn't a huge dps boost the way many other legendaries are. Its closer to 4-5% which is in the acceptable margins.

Lol if you think the cloak isn't getting significantly nerfed, it will likely have it's effect nerfed down to 5% maybe 10% if we're lucky. It's fits to a T the description of a legendary they want to nerf. If anything the belt and ring may be left alone because while there are no drawbacks to wearing it, the effect isn't active all the time.

[Ryuji]

If the front page's notes are accurate, are we only able to put 1 blessing on at a time? If so, wonder if it applies to Might. Cause that's a pretty big DPS hit if so.

[snackfeat]

If the front page's notes are accurate, are we only able to put 1 blessing on at a time? If so, wonder if it applies to Might. Cause that's a pretty big DPS hit if so.

This looks like the beginning of the changes that removes blessing of might.

I could be wrong, but the part below the blessings look like it could be a flat 12% dmg buff for ret, which would cover the loss of might. Then letting us keep the other 2 blessings but limiting them to one of each just to have a little bit of utility.

edit: from wowhead

Ashes to Dust Enemies hit by your Wake of Ashes take 20%15% increased damage from you for 6 sec.
Chain of Thrayn
Holy:
Avenging Wrath increases healing done by an additional 35%25% and increases damage done by an additional 25%
Protection, Retribution:
20%
Protection, Retribution:
Avenging Wrath increases healing done by an additional 70%50% and increases damage done by an additional 25%20%
Liadrin's Fury Unleashed While Avenging Wrath is active, you gain 1 Holy Power every 2.5 4 sec.
Whisper of the Nathrezim Templar's Verdict and Divine Storm increase the damage of your next Templar's Verdict or Divine Storm within 4 sec by 25%15%.

[Deleted]

Lol if you think the cloak isn't getting significantly nerfed, it will likely have it's effect nerfed down to 5% maybe 10% if we're lucky. It's fits to a T the description of a legendary they want to nerf. If anything the belt and ring may be left alone because while there are no drawbacks to wearing it, the effect isn't active all the time.

The thing about the cloak is that you don't have a 100% uptime on it. Under normal rotation it will drop off frequently after 3 or 4 TV's. By itself, it's not as strong as it looks. But with ring and crusade they both synergise off each other. Thats where it is strong.
Still... if it gets nerfed, we get nerfed as we are extremely dependant on the crusade burst for our viability. So, i hope theres at least a baseline damage compensation for it.

[Iphie]

According to WoWhead:

REMOVED Greater Blessing of Might Places a blessing on an ally that gives their attacks a 10% chance to deal 30% additional damage as Holy.
You may only have 3 Greater Blessings active at one time.

But nothing about giving some buff somewhere else.