PTR Patch: Might removed, 12% skill buff except to TV!

[SilenceRedo]

Why should I buff failing dps instead of a tank?
Tank will have easier time, heler will have easier time.
Tank staying alive means higher chance of finishing boss off if things go south.

Hahahahaha omg. No, the highest chance of killing a boss is neither a tank being tankier nor healer being smooth with their mana; it's a bigger damage output. That's why any serious guild always gear their dps first.

You haven't done much mythic progress I can tell.

[Morally Grey Storm]

Hahahahaha omg. No, the highest chance of killing a boss is neither a tank being tankier nor healer being smooth with their mana; it's a bigger damage output. That's why any serious guild always gear their dps first.

You haven't done much mythic progress I can tell.

hahahaha omg why would I buff a dps who fails to step out of fire.

You fail - you die. Simple as that.
No mercy and no slack.


You haven't realise GBOK/GBOW does not increase damage output I can tell.

[Monzsterr]

Why should I buff failing dps instead of a tank?
Tank will have easier time, heler will have easier time.
Tank staying alive means higher chance of finishing boss off if things go south.

In a dungeon, sure.
In a pug, probably.
In mythic raiding, it's usually not tanks dying that leads to a wipe, tanks have all the suitability they need. I'd be targeting the specs that have less personal defensives and could use a helpful surviveability boost. And as it has been said, this shield is so minimal to tanks it hardly matters, but to someone who doesn't take the same heavy damage tanks do but has to survive a few damage spikes (standing on flowers while stunned by a cloud on mythic dragons for example) this may actually make a useful difference.

[Morally Grey Storm]

In a dungeon, sure.
In a pug, probably.
In mythic raiding, it's usually not tanks dying that leads to a wipe, tanks have all the suitability they need. I'd be targeting the specs that have less personal defensives and could use a helpful surviveability boost. And as it has been said, this shield is so minimal to tanks it hardly matters, but to someone who doesn't take the same heavy damage tanks do but has to survive a few damage spikes (standing on flowers while stunned by a cloud on mythic dragons for example) this may actually make a useful difference.

You could be very well right, but I somehow doubt a ~60k absorb once in 6 seconds will save a failure of a dps from getting gibbed.
We shall see, I suppose.
I don't like GBlessings . They are bland, unimaginative, unengaging, boring.
The only redeeming quality about GBLessings change is we're going to be in full control of our dps.

[Littlepwny]

Very glad for this change.

I'd also like the other two Greater Blessings to be removed because they are unfun mechanics. Bonus points if they are replaced with short duration alternative such as Blessing of Wisdom = Innervate but that might be too impactful on a DPS class.

[Monzsterr]

I'd rather just have hand of sacrifice back.

[Stk]

alternative such as Blessing of Wisdom = Innervate but that might be too impactful on a DPS class.

Wait, so boomkin is not a dps?! LUL

[Tanthoris]

I'd rather just have hand of sacrifice back.

This, give ret some useful utility like Sac, or maybe a Brez, everyone could use a Brez! OR a lust... But that's never gonna happen, so maybe just make the other greater blessings more useful.

The main idea of the greater blessings was a cool idea, but it's failed horribly, trash it and give us short CD blessings similar to what we had before.

It's kind of silly that Prot kept Sac yet the spec that literally is about punishing those who hurt them and their allies doesn't have it, it would make some of our talents and one of the legiondaries a bit more useful to boot.

[Zanyuki]

They should just scrap the entire Greater Blessings mechanic. After all, they've pruned our utility to oblivion, so retaining a stupid buff is pretty much inconsistent.

Instead of Kings, give us back Sacred Shield (or make Shield of Vengeance able to be cast on other party members, buff its amount--which I think is coming in 7.1.5)
Instead of Wisdom, give us back mobility increasing buff
Instead of Might... well, they've given us 12% damage across the board so yes, this is a step in the right direction already.

The only thing that remains is the stupid Mastery. The lore is there, certainly--we deal more damage to targets that we've Judged--but how about make it affect anything that's within a certain radius and increasing Mastery increases Holy damage on all affected targets plus increases radius.

[Emerald Archer]

yeah right, because every fight takes as much time as Ylginoth.
It's still pathetic and boring, fire-and-forget failure.

I'm happy for you and your giddy state, but I won't share in that, as I See nothing to be happy about regarding GBOK and GBOW.

Yeah it's a boring ability, but it is useful. Yes not every fight is that long, but even a 5 minute fight is over 25% mana, and that's more than the pot we use. Boring yes, pathetic/weak, no. Not at all.

[Hermisick]

Quick question:

845 FcM or 875 MoA trinkets ?

[Vuagnon]

They should just scrap the entire Greater Blessings mechanic. After all, they've pruned our utility to oblivion, so retaining a stupid buff is pretty much inconsistent.

Instead of Kings, give us back Sacred Shield (or make Shield of Vengeance able to be cast on other party members, buff its amount--which I think is coming in 7.1.5)
Instead of Wisdom, give us back mobility increasing buff
Instead of Might... well, they've given us 12% damage across the board so yes, this is a step in the right direction already.

The only thing that remains is the stupid Mastery. The lore is there, certainly--we deal more damage to targets that we've Judged--but how about make it affect anything that's within a certain radius and increasing Mastery increases Holy damage on all affected targets plus increases radius.

I agree with this. Wish there was some hope for the future of this spec. There are still too many broken things like the blessing issue and that sucker pony.

[Littlepwny]

Wait, so boomkin is not a dps?! LUL

Fair enough. Boomkins do not, however, have a very large amount of raid utility. Retribution would be too strong if it had the kind of mechanics I suggest (limited-Innervate or ally-SoV).

[Life-Binder]

idk about raids, but in dungeons doing 3 GBoKs now seems a no-brainer

healers wont care about the tiny mana replenish in dungeons and every little bit of survivability helps


Id say 1 GBoK on the tank, unless your tank is truly a godlike overgeared immortal

1 GBoK on the healer, because healer dead = wipe

and the last GBoK on the squishiest DPS or yourself (looking out for number 1 )

[SilenceRedo]

ahahaha omg why would I buff a dps who fails to step out of fire.

That is your fault for not knowing the people you raid with.

I'd never buff those guys who aren't reliable to have awareness and not die. Also, I'm on a guild where those players are always on bench.

[Morally Grey Storm]

That is your fault for not knowing the people you raid with.

I'd never buff those guys who aren't reliable to have awareness and not die. Also, I'm on a guild where those players are always on bench.

and your point being...?

ahahaha omg

[Svetyac]

That is your fault for not knowing the people you raid with.

I'd never buff those guys who aren't reliable to have awareness and not die. Also, I'm on a guild where those players are always on bench.

So much pro! Very want be like you!

[Meiffert]

idk about raids, but in dungeons doing 3 GBoKs now seems a no-brainer

healers wont care about the tiny mana replenish in dungeons and every little bit of survivability helps

The wowhead changelog says you can only use 1 BoK and 1 BoW.

Also, the 12 % aura affects all spells including Blade of Justice and Templar's Verdict, not sure if it said something else when OP was making this post.

[Matrlx]

well, the Op got a point it was hidden somewhere you need to click *see more* to see the buff for TV

[Wrecktangle]

Why is it too much?
Strong healer CDs? 30%HP over 10 or 15s isn't really much. That's easly achieveable with FoL.
The innervate could be too strong, but those numbers will be generated either way.

Why is the shield too powerful if every tank can get the leg shield trinket with 40% absorb on a 1.25min CD? oO

The reason its too strong is because you're giving 2 distinct types of cooldowns (Medium powered HoT and a full shield) to one specific spec, that's on top of having our shared utility of LoH, BoP, etc. Yes you can easily achieve using FoL by stopping DPS for 3-5s. That hardly compares to a one press powerful HoT.

The shield itself is fine, the reason its too powerful because it's not on a tank spec, you can put it on anyone, and you also have the above HoT cooldown at your disposal too. If you had to choose between one or the other it'd be fine, unnecessary IMO, but fine, because at that point it'd have been better just to split them up on spec like I suggested.

It's not an extra 3%. Even if TV is included. Auto attack, Old War, FC(Brittle), Satyr, Pepper Breath, SoV are 20%ish of our damage. 12% of 80% = 9.6%. Its a wash or a slight loss. So legendary nerf is not being compensated for.

This is a good point, but I think you two are arguing different things. He's saying we're getting an extra 3% buff. That's pretty close to a fact. The point you're arguing is that the 12% buff doesn't correlate to a 12% damage increase (thus not offsetting the loss entirely) which you clearly showed is also a fact.

Now the better question is do we think Blizz is aware of this? They're smart people no doubt, but it doesn't mean that they don't take things into consideration or have an oversight. Then there's the question of is this piece INTENDED to account for the legendaries? Did they ever specifically state it would?

The only thing that remains is the stupid Mastery. The lore is there, certainly--we deal more damage to targets that we've Judged--but how about make it affect anything that's within a certain radius and increasing Mastery increases Holy damage on all affected targets plus increases radius.

This is actually a really cool idea. I think that added some utility to Mastery is a neat idea and I actually liked how you presented it. It wouldn't be a direct DPS increase, you wouldn't need x % to do y content, but it'd be a passive benefit and a graphical indicator to support the increasing Mastery value.

In my Ret build way back in Alpha/Beta I designed I scaled our healing off of our Mastery value too, just for added thematics.

Yeah it's a boring ability, but it is useful. Yes not every fight is that long, but even a 5 minute fight is over 25% mana, and that's more than the pot we use. Boring yes, pathetic/weak, no. Not at all.

To be fair though while it may be an additional 25% mana, there's no guarantee you'll need that mana. I.e. if you end a fight at 60% mana, that 25% was 100% wasted. Even if you ended at 25%, you probably wasted an extremely large portion of it. There's also parts of the fight where regenerating mana slowly doesn't benefit you much, and a more rapid regeneration on a cooldown would be more valuable, for when you need it, not in case you need it.

This, give ret some useful utility like Sac, or maybe a Brez.

It's kind of silly that Prot kept Sac yet the spec that literally is about punishing those who hurt them and their allies doesn't have it, it would make some of our talents and one of the legiondaries a bit more useful to boot.

I like the idea of a Brez on Ret. I think it'd be the perfect utility to toss in. While I love Sac as a spell, I def think its better placed on either Holy or Prot, which it appears Blizz agrees with.

Someone else mentioned it, but the idea of putting SoV on others is actually kind of neat. I also kinda wish we could find a way to put the legendary bracers bubble on someone else too. No idea how to present it mechanically though.

Technically Ret's thematic is punishing those that hurt them, Prot is about protecting those around them. Mechanically I understand that tank classes are built on receiving and retaliating.