Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Vineri]

Debunked this retard statement

"Why do you think that a company that has deployed in the region of 400-500 servers and maintained them for over a decade would find implementing a legacy server (a task that a bunch of people managed to achieve without these benefits) difficult?"

Uh because they stated that it would be too difficult for them. They lost the code, then they found it. Then they are seriously considering the idea, all the while saying it is too difficult, requiring much planning and thought.

Having 400+ servers is a feather in their cap. Some customers aren't as uneducated as they might hope though, since they realize the vast majority are dead / dying / low-pop servers. When you can count 20+ different servers being represented with their X-cross tech (CRZ) in a single game experience, the reasonable person draws conclusions that there is a problem here.

Perhaps 400+ servers could be consolidated to 20. Heck maybe 10. Only Blizzard knows, but they like it when people advertise 400+ servers for free. Seems like a waste of electricity, honestly.

All in all, I'm not sure why you need to use strong offensive terms like "retarded" to somehow bully a point across.

[Deleted]

Back in Vanilla, Blizzard had a very different approach to class balance and content. Take Paladins for example, a class like many hybrids that had talent trees that were largely ignored. While Blizzard had focus on Holy and Retribution, but Protection was ignored. So much so that Reckoning had a hidden mechanic that players learned and created the infamous but quickly nerfed Reck Bomb. Other players got creative and even learned to utilize Protection in PvP to obliterate melee. If Blizzard were to implement Legacy servers, these talents would need to be adjusted just due to their much different approach to class balancing. There's also no way they'd put a Legacy server without LFR and the store.

It would be easier for Blizzard to take modern WoW 7.0 and just cut off newer content while giving classes old talents. Would this give players an accurate representation of Vanilla WoW? Hell no, and Blizzard knows that this effort will be rewarded with negativity. Blizzard wants the store and wants the LFR and etc, but not the people who want this.

Blizzard would also be shooting themselves in the foot. A Legacy Vanilla realm would give players much more content to experience than Legion, even when Legion releases the final content patch. Right now Blizzard makes far more money releasing expansions more often than content patches. Legion won't stick around for much longer, and eventually WoW will move onto another expansion. You don't want players to go back to older content where they stop playing for expansions. Then there's the issue on how much should Blizzard charge for Legacy servers?

The only way you'll see a Blizzard Legacy realm is if WoW is nearly dead, which won't happen for some time.

when saying vanilla had more content you mean the entire levelling process yes? But ofcourse it did. It's the core game, not an expansion. If you mean at max level then you are very wrong

[Daffan]

- - - Updated - - -


I just wanted to point out that "Badges of Justice" existed since The Burning Crusade launch.

Yes, but it did not get out of hand until when I posted. Who cares about a ZA quality wand for 25 badges or some other stuff, we are talking full sets of good itemized stuff and reputation vendors at exalted that absolutely dominated.

[Roadblock]

when saying vanilla had more content you mean the entire levelling process yes? But ofcourse it did. It's the core game, not an expansion. If you mean at max level then you are very wrong

It appears I have to link this every hundred pages or so.

1.2 (month and a half after release)
- Maraudon is introduced:
- Gurubashi Arena Event
- The first Feast of Great-Winter Event
1.3 (two and a half months since last major patch)
- Dire Maul
- Azuregos
- Lord Kazzak
1.4 (one month after last patch)
- Epic Priest quest introduced
- Epic Hunter quest introduced
- PvP Honor System introduced
1.5 (two months after last patch)
- Battlegrounds are introduced:
- - Alterac Valley
- - Warsong Gulch
- All members of both the Horde and Alliance are reporting low stockpiles of various textile resources! Donations of cloth are now being accepted in the following locations: Darnassus, Stormwind, and Ironforge for the Alliance; Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff for the Horde. Seek out an official Cloth Quartermaster for more information.
1.6 (one and a half months after last patch)
- Blackwing Lair introduced
- Darkmoon Faire introduced
- Battlemasters introduced
1.7 (two months after last patch)
- Zul'Gurub (new 20-player raid instance)
- Arathi Basin (15-player resource battleground instance)
- Stranglethorn Fishing Extravaganza
1.8 (one month)
- Dragons of Nightmare - The four corrupted dragons from the Emerald Dream.
- Silithus - Totally revamped zone for level 60 solo players and 5-man parties.
1.9 (two and a half months)
- Love is in the Air - Valentine's Day support.
- The Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj (outdoor 20-player instance)
- The Temple of Ahn'Qiraj (indoor 40-player instance)
1.10 (two and a half months)
- Weather effects
- Tier 0.5 armor sets, relevant questlines and new summonable bosses.
1.11 (three months)
- Naxxramas, (40-player raid instance), a massive necropolis floating above Stratholme
1.12 (two months)
- World Outdoor PvP enhancements
- Cross-Realm Battlegrounds

Vanilla had more content at end-game than WoD and Legion put together.
I mean if you count pet battles, selfie-cam and infinite repetition of +1 scaling hamsterwheels as content, it might come about even.

[Vash The Stampede]

when saying vanilla had more content you mean the entire levelling process yes? But ofcourse it did. It's the core game, not an expansion. If you mean at max level then you are very wrong

At max level, and I'm right. If you were to play Vanilla WoW with patch 1.11, you can't go straight to Naxxramas. Firstly, you need to gear up and that means clearing MC, BWL, AQ, and etc. Good chance you'll also do ZG because gear is gear. Then there's the whole AQ40 world event which takes time. Then there's getting into Naxx, which either requires a boat load of gold or max reputation with Argent Dawn.

If we assume Legion has the last content patch and it was lets say "Demon Hotel of Evil", as a new or returning player to the game you want to do that end game raid. You won't do previous raids of that expansion unless it's required by the legendary through LFR. And LFR is something any player of any skill level can do. You can clear LFR within a day. Modern WoW has catch up systems so players don't have to do things like clear old raids and get attunements. Everything made today is throw away content, just like your gear.

As pro as you might think you are, it'll take you a year to even step foot into Naxx, and that's not including you being able to clear it. That's also assuming that the realm opened up AQ40.

[Eapoe]

At max level, and I'm right. If you were to play Vanilla WoW with patch 1.11, you can't go straight to Naxxramas. Firstly, you need to gear up and that means clearing MC, BWL, AQ, and etc. Good chance you'll also do ZG because gear is gear. Then there's the whole AQ40 world event which takes time. Then there's getting into Naxx, which either requires a boat load of gold or max reputation with Argent Dawn.

If we assume Legion has the last content patch and it was lets say "Demon Hotel of Evil", as a new or returning player to the game you want to do that end game raid. You won't do previous raids of that expansion unless it's required by the legendary through LFR. And LFR is something any player of any skill level can do. You can clear LFR within a day. Modern WoW has catch up systems so players don't have to do things like clear old raids and get attunements. Everything made today is throw away content, just like your gear.

As pro as you might think you are, it'll take you a year to even step foot into Naxx, and that's not including you being able to clear it. That's also assuming that the realm opened up AQ40.

So I don't get it, is it a good thing or a bad thing I don't have to do old content to get into current content if I was a brand new player? Because if I joined toward the end of the xpac, and the xpac was ending in, say 6-8 months, I'd like to be able to do the current endgame and not be forced into outdated things just to be perceived good enough to get into a raid. Why perceived? Because there's been many players in this thread and multiple people I have met thru the years of playing since WotLK that have said the hardest part of 40 man raiding was getting 40 people attuned to actually enter. Mechanics in raids didn't really start showing until BC, and the only mechanics people had to really worry about in Vanilla was there own ability to play. Not saying they didn't exist, but let's face it, Vanilla was pretty barebones in terms of boss mechanics.

[Ielenia]

Oh, I see you were trying to be clever.

It's not 'being clever'. It's called 'addressing the question'.

No, I am not. It is good to see that your are now telling me what my argument is. That must be so much easier for you than worrying about silly, little matters like addressing what I actually write.

Speaking of "what you actually write", this is what you wrote:

No it is an assumption. You are the one who keeps bringing up a bunch of people

You are the one who took issue to me using 'bunch of people' when referring to those of the illegal server.

Customer service has nothing to do with creating an emulator I asked about creating it not whether it would need support once it was released.

I'm talking about establishing a real, official legacy server. And to do, Blizzard will need to get customer service, community managers and developers, all fully-trained and paid.

I have explained this to you before the line linking the two data points is just that a line.

And you know what that line means? A net increase. The average of all the subs gained and lost in that period. Sub count went up. That's a fact. I'm not sure why you're trying to argue against it.

[Vineri]

And you know what that line means? A net increase. The average of all the subs gained and lost in that period. Sub count went up. That's a fact. I'm not sure why you're trying to argue against it.

Expansions tend to do that. Also there was a lack of published data the prior quarter to the Cataclysm launch wasn't there? Although China subs were stated as rising, while loses occured for NA / EU.

[Ielenia]

Expansions tend to do that.

The line in question begins and end still well within Wrath of the Lich King expansion timeline.

[Deleted]

It appears I have to link this every hundred pages or so.



Vanilla had more content at end-game than WoD and Legion put together.
I mean if you count pet battles, selfie-cam and infinite repetition of +1 scaling hamsterwheels as content, it might come about even.

What you linked is mostly non endgame content. Vanilla had DM, strat and school as max level dungeons(unless you want to count strat and school as raids). It had BRS, MC, Onyxia, ZG, BWL, AQ and naxx as raids.

This was the endgame for vanilla.

I don't see how you can compare this to Legion and WoD put together.

Legion isn't even done with it's first tier and it's already leading in dungeons. 7.1 5 also brings back brawlers. We have viable dungeon content past fearing for raids. We have world quests. It's massive compared to vanilla

[Vineri]

The line in question begins and end still well within Wrath of the Lich King expansion timeline.

Was the line fabricated? Or otherwise extrapolated from China growth statistic projections? (If no data point was released)

China was in growth during WotLK. Investor reports show this. Rapid growth, while net subs plateaued worldwide.

I'm not sure when China received LFD, but they were delayed on all aspects, so likely not until the next year did they receive it. I remember it was a topic on MMO-C when they did finally get it.

[Deleted]

At max level, and I'm right. If you were to play Vanilla WoW with patch 1.11, you can't go straight to Naxxramas. Firstly, you need to gear up and that means clearing MC, BWL, AQ, and etc. Good chance you'll also do ZG because gear is gear. Then there's the whole AQ40 world event which takes time. Then there's getting into Naxx, which either requires a boat load of gold or max reputation with Argent Dawn.

If we assume Legion has the last content patch and it was lets say "Demon Hotel of Evil", as a new or returning player to the game you want to do that end game raid. You won't do previous raids of that expansion unless it's required by the legendary through LFR. And LFR is something any player of any skill level can do. You can clear LFR within a day. Modern WoW has catch up systems so players don't have to do things like clear old raids and get attunements. Everything made today is throw away content, just like your gear.

As pro as you might think you are, it'll take you a year to even step foot into Naxx, and that's not including you being able to clear it. That's also assuming that the realm opened up AQ40.

Honestly what a load of bullcrap

Late in vanilla when we needed people to switch mains or get new people geared we didn't run them through MC or ZG. Know why? Most of the gear from there was crap and pre raid gear could beat it most of the time. Examples include a green pair of leather boots from DM with 44 ap that was BIS for pretty much all physical dps well into BWL.

What you needed to enter naxx was to farm dailies for weeks and then get gear boosted in AQ40/20 plus stocking up from the GB. Catch up systems today are needed because of things like AK and AP. If you honestly think gear was a problem you have no business talking to me.

- - - Updated - - -

What you linked is mostly non endgame content. Vanilla had DM, strat and school as max level dungeons(unless you want to count strat and school as raids). It had BRS, MC, Onyxia, ZG, BWL, AQ and naxx as raids.

This was the endgame for vanilla.

I don't see how you can compare this to Legion and WoD put together.

Legion isn't even done with it's first tier and it's already leading in dungeons. 7.1 5 also brings back brawlers. We have viable dungeon content past fearing for raids. We have world quests. It's massive compared to vanilla

Also I've purposely left out world bosses. They suck today. In vanilla for a serious raiding guild they where an absolute fucking pain in the ass

[Ielenia]

Was the line fabricated?

You mean falsified? Can't honestly tell. It was the same graph that was displayed on MMO-Champion, so you can draw your conclusions from there, I imagine.

[Deleted]

I don't why there is this bickering on this subject. Nobody is going to convince the "other" side.

One fact remains: There are people (myself included) that are going to play Vanilla WoW. It is up to Blizzard to decide whether we do it legally or not.

[Deleted]

It appears I have to link this every hundred pages or so.



Vanilla had more content at end-game than WoD and Legion put together.
I mean if you count pet battles, selfie-cam and infinite repetition of +1 scaling hamsterwheels as content, it might come about even.

No. No.

Vanilla had a different content, was pure harsh grinding.

If you played during Naxx release you had to do all mc bwl onyx kazzak azuregos emerald drake aq 20 aq 40 to catch up with equip, money.

And this required a guild and a truckload of time

Now you can catch up with the last pve content with little time and still have enough content to enjoy.

What you linked is mostly non endgame content. Vanilla had DM, strat and school as max level dungeons(unless you want to count strat and school as raids). It had BRS, MC, Onyxia, ZG, BWL, AQ and naxx as raids.

This was the endgame for vanilla.

I don't see how you can compare this to Legion and WoD put together.

Legion isn't even done with it's first tier and it's already leading in dungeons. 7.1 5 also brings back brawlers. We have viable dungeon content past fearing for raids. We have world quests. It's massive compared to vanilla

Yep

[Deleted]

<moderator snip>

[Deleted]

Will be fun to see a spike for the first week and then 89% of player dropping

[Deleted]

Will be fun to see a spike for the first week and then 89% of player dropping

And after the 89% drop there will still be a 1000+ people playing, having an amazing time! Can't wait..

[Morbownz]

Will be fun to see a spike for the first week and then 89% of player dropping

Are you talking about retail or private servers?

[Deleted]

Are you talking about retail or private servers?

priv ofc since retail is still up no matter of you legacy troll can desire