Electoral College voted Trump

[Keltas]

If the EC doesn't vote for Trump it will be the end of decency and democracy in USA.

Well considering the US isn't a democracy, it's kinda hard to end it.

[Belize]

Atleast fucked according to rules.

Uh...

I'm sorry to have to break this to you, but the EC voting for anyone else IS according to the rules.

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Well considering the US isn't a democracy, it's kinda hard to end it.

DAMNIT. I should have said that! I keep forgetting to parrot "We're a Republic!!1!oen!"

[Choda]

The problem is that the opposite effect is occurring. In order to stop California from determining the election, fly over states are getting significantly more power behind their votes than someone in California.

It's creating a situation where you still only have a few states worth campaigning in while the voters in California are being worth less every year despite making up a massive amount of the federal tax revenue for a single state. Small states already even have representation via the House and they're 100% equal in Senate. California and New York are effectively losing representation and their voice each election cycle while giving money to others who spit on them.

California is worth the most EC points, no? So the exact opposite of irrelevant.

And let's not pretend that California doesn't spit on literally every other state there is. The fact that it has the most people in it shouldn't give it decisive power over the entire nation.

[Bullettime]

Atleast fucked according to rules.

Except voting for someone else IS in the rules and is the primary reason for even having the system; the ability to reject an unqualified populist or foreign demagogue.

[Mangusei]

Except voting for someone else IS in the rules and is the primary reason for even having the system; the ability to reject an unqualified populist or foreign demagogue.

I think it's unspoken social agreement for EC to vote for whoever won the election. Otherwise what's the point of voting at all.

[Bullettime]

California is worth the most EC points, no? So the exact opposite of irrelevant.

And let's not pretend that California doesn't spit on literally every other state there is. The fact that it has the most people in it shouldn't give it decisive power over the entire nation.

They have the most people, contribute the most in federal tax revenue, and are the largest drivers of industry, technology, medicine, etc.

California and New York are basically footing the bill for the welfare and infrastructure spending that has to get poured into the red states like Kansas and Mississippi to keep their people from starving to death.

[Belize]

I think it's unspoken social agreement for EC to vote for whoever won the election. Otherwise what's the point of voting at all.

Oh, so... I guess they'd be voting for Clinton?

I mean, it's a nice thought, but there's no chance that'll happen.

[Bullettime]

I think it's unspoken social agreement for EC to vote for whoever won the election. Otherwise what's the point of voting at all.

Then the system needs to be abolished. The reasons for its creation have been outlined. If it's not going to serve that purpose, then it needs to give way for the popular vote.

You can't pick and choose which aspects of the electoral college are "right" because it helps your team. It exists, literally, to stop unqualified populist demagogues like Trump, but the GOP won't repeal it in favor of the popular vote because then they owe their recent runs in the White House to its ability to bypass the popular vote.

If you want the popular vote, then Clinton wins.
If you want the college, then these are the rules are founders gave. Taking away that ability means it has no point, therefore popular vote.

[Deleted]

"Will of the masses" refer directly and is synonymous to popular vote.

Hence, the EC is not the "will of the masses".

Unless of course, it's the trumpets at re-manufacturing reality again, by reinventing the definition of words and phrases, something of which isn't new to them.

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The system the founders produced compels all candidates to pay serious attention to underpopulated states. In this election, highly populated states like California, Texas and New York overwhelmingly supported Clinton or Trump from the beginning. Smaller states like Nevada or New Hampshire became important. Without the electoral college, the idiosyncratic interests of small states would receive little notice, while a broad national marketing campaign, insensitive to significant regional differences, would decide the result. The centers of population along the two highly populated coasts, where many dismiss “flyover” states, would never have to face the realities of Michigan, Wisconsin or Nevada. In this election, flyover states were able to stun coastal America. They could not do that without the electoral college.

The United States is a geopolitical invention. The 13 original colonies were very different from each other. As the nation expanded westward, even more exotic states became part of the union. Constantly alienating smaller states through indifference could undermine the national interest. The Senate and the electoral college both stop that from happening, or at least limit it. Any state can matter in any election.

You might charge that this is undemocratic. It is. It was intended to be. The founders did not create a direct democracy for a good reason. It would have prevented the United States from emerging as a stable union. They created a republican form of government based on representation and a federal system based on sovereign states. Because of that, a candidate who ignores or insults the “flyover” states is likely to be writing memoirs instead of governing.

- geopoliticalfutures . com/the-electoral-college

I am amazed how many Americans are willing to tinker with the founding principles of their country. The system which has produced an unbelievable stability. Ready to throw it away for one-time political ego convenience.

Clinton and Co. fucked this one up. They have no one but themselves to blame. She thought she had states in her pocket.
Man, what a ''brilliant'' politician indeed.

[Xahz]

And let's not pretend that California doesn't spit on literally every other state there is. The fact that it has the most people in it shouldn't give it decisive power over the entire nation.

California spits on every other state? Are you kidding me? They're practically the only reason most red states even still exist.

[Choda]

They have the most people, contribute the most in federal tax revenue, and are the largest drivers of industry, technology, medicine, etc.

California and New York are basically footing the bill for the welfare and infrastructure spending that has to get poured into the red states like Kansas and Mississippi to keep their people from starving to death.

Starvation caused by them in the first place, no?

You know, this kind of attitude is exactly why everyone hates California in the first place. California wants to be the enlightened elite circle looking down upon the other redneck peasants, saving them from starvation.

Yeah, no.

[shimerra]

I'm going to level with you. I never read the article I vaguely saw it being talked about somewhere and posted it off google. I am honestly not concerned with anything Hilary post election I was just trying to get his goat.

So basically what we have proven today is that your ability to evaluate the credibility isn't worth a damn and probably falls more in line with what you feel about he evidence rather than if the evidence has merit. Good to know.

[PosPosPos]

Except voting for someone else IS in the rules and is the primary reason for even having the system; the ability to reject an unqualified populist or foreign demagogue.

Except they place too much faith in these electors to have the will to not be swayed by such "unqualified populists or foreign demagogues".

[Xandrigity]

The EC will vote for the will of the people who elected them to office. Maybe 1 or 2 will go faithless but I wouldn't hold my breath for anything drastic.

[Shadowferal]

The GOP won't ever agree to amend the Constitution for a president to win by popular vote alone.

[Bullettime]

Starvation caused by them in the first place, no?

You know, this kind of attitude is exactly why everyone hates California in the first place. California wants to be the enlightened elite circle looking down upon the other redneck peasants, saving them from starvation.

Yeah, no.

How exactly is it the fault of California and New York that red states are in such piss poor shape? States like Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, Kansas, and Oklahoma gave in to extreme trickle down economics that are brutally wrecking their lower class, while not having anything of value in regards to exports, nor have any attractiveness for industry to go there.

Their own politicians have destroyed their state economies and it's states like New York and California whose taxes pay to bail them out. But the red states then cry "evil liberals! evil socialism! I'll be rich too I swear!"

[PosPosPos]

Starvation caused by them in the first place, no?

In what way?

And on the off chance it's caused by them, isn't it one of the so-called pillars of Conservatism that if you are poor you deserved to be poor and not because the rich took from you? Better start pulling up your bootstraps and walking your talking, bud.

[Bullettime]

In what way?

And on the off chance it's caused by them, isn't it one of the so-called pillars of Conservatism that if you are poor you deserved to be poor and not because the rich took from you? Better start pulling up your bootstraps and walking your talking, bud.

Socialism is only evil when you're not the one benefiting from it.

[Tijuana]

How exactly is it the fault of California and New York that red states are in such piss poor shape? States like Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, Kansas, and Oklahoma gave in to extreme trickle down economics that are brutally wrecking their lower class, while not having anything of value in regards to exports, nor have any attractiveness for industry to go there.

Their own politicians have destroyed their state economies and it's states like New York and California whose taxes pay to bail them out. But the red states then cry "evil liberals! evil socialism! I'll be rich too I swear!"

As a Kansan, I find it offensive that you would say other governors are as stupid and inept as ours is.

However, I have no clue what you are on about that the local economy was destroyed by the Brownback tax cuts. It's fucking over the state budget, and it's the dumbest thing ever, but I have no idea why you think it would be bad for the economy. There is mathematically no way to cut taxes and have the economy negatively react to that.

[Bullettime]

As a Kansan, I find it offensive that you would say other governors are as stupid and inept as ours is.

Oh no Brownback absolutely takes the cake. This is one thing we'll agree on.