Russia condemns Netherlands over U.S. military cooperation

[Deleted]

Global peace? Not everyone is a warmongerer or a bully with nukes.

Peace? You were calling for Russia to "perish" hypocrite. Ofc the mods pretend u haven't broken forum conduct numerous times in this thread due to them being hypocrites n anti-Russian. No impartial moderation exists on this forum, that is plain..

[Mifuyne]

Peace? You were calling for Russia to "perish" hypocrite. Ofc the mods pretend u haven't broken forum conduct numerous times in this thread due to them being hypocrites n anti-Russian. No impartial moderation exists on this forum, that is plain..

Not standing up to a tribunal and veto'ing. so decent.

[Kellhound]

I said in another post I give a great deal of credit to Russia. Maybe take that chip off your shoulder? The FACT remains, you got steam rolled so hard, we had to make a beach landing to even help you. Nobody foresaw German power being that effective, or them being that aggressive, but EVERYONE can see what Russia is. How could you not learn from your mistakes, given the horrible, horrible outcome last time? It's amazing to us over here that you could be so flippant about it, given the level of suffering caused last time.

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Lol, ok. How many can you even land a jet on? One but, it has no jets yet. GG

One nuclear powered CATOBAR carrier with Gen 4+ fighters.

[Deleted]

He's pretty delusional.
Can't wait for that corrupt shit country to perish.
Pretty easy to figure out who is a Putin ass-licker on MMO-C

Hypocrite.

[Mifuyne]

Hypocrite.

Russian. 10 char

[Kellhound]

Unthinkable things have happened before, and will keep happening, especially when we're talking about Russia. Who knew it would actually become communistic back in 1900? Who knew it would rise to a nuclear superpower right after WW2?

Russia is only important today because of hydrocarbons, and those are on the way out. I do like how Russia=USSR when it makes them powerful and not when it would reflect badly on modern Russia.....

[Arunu]

I said in another post I give a great deal of credit to Russia. Maybe take that chip off your shoulder? The FACT remains, you got steam rolled so hard, we had to make a beach landing to even help you. Nobody foresaw German power being that effective, or them being that aggressive, but EVERYONE can see what Russia is. How could you not learn from your mistakes, given the horrible, horrible outcome last time? It's amazing to us over here that you could be so flippant about it, given the level of suffering caused last time.

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Lol, ok. How many can you even land a jet on? One but, it has no jets yet. GG

that chip is on my shoulder cause you claimed in your first post "we had to save yer butts " and yes, that pisses me off. Had you claimed before that it was a combined effort with heavy emphasis on Russia i would not have.
Nice of you to dodge many of the points in there though but fine.


you really think Russia has a desire and plan to go the "third reich" way ??????

[Strear]

That makes the only two countries that USA can't destroy or control. If you're so paranoid about anything that's independent from you, it's just unhealthy. Learn to live in a world where there's equals. To make deals and come to understanding with someone who's different from you, not just force conditions and views.

Sure, there's room for everyone. And you know what ? Before Crimea stuff, I even hoped Russia and NATO could merge in a new " Alliance ". But since Crimea stuff, and because USA and Russia still feel so much resentment since the cold war, I don't think it'll be for soon ...
You know what Haven ? We should depassionate the thing at a people scale, far from politics. We have to admit that yes, we may be wrong in some decisions, behaviors, and leaders have the balls to assume things when they are questionable in the eyes of the rest of the world, like with Syria, " Yes, he's using chemical warfare against his populations, but he's our ally and we support him anyway " instead of denying/contesting. And if they don't assume or disagree with things, they should simply deny to engage when it is so (like we did with the US WMD in 2nd Iraq war ... what a " social " price we paid for not engaging military with the USA ...). Like I said about the shot plane thing : if tomorrow you hear that yes, a russian missile shot it, will it change anything in the mind of those who always supported the fact it was a western lie ? I'm not sure.

Lol, ok. How many can you even land a jet on? One but, it has no jets yet. GG

Like for the nuke think, does one need to have 1000 nukes to definitively ruin another country, may it be in a nuclear ripost ? I don't think so. Nuclear warfare is not " if you have 10000 you're way more dangerous/stronger than if you have 100 ". European have enough nuclear stuff, may it be from land, submarines or bombers to be a rival threat for any other nation, even the USA.

[Mifuyne]

Sorry to all the Russians :P
Just annoyed by the fact that the people that shot down MH17 will walk freely without any kind of trial.

Not much point in discussing anything further considering the europeans will back up europa, american people will back up america and russian people will back up russia.
We'll have to wait and see what the future brings.

[caervek]

Stop drinking bath lotion, you Putin-tools.

Since when did laughing at fake news make somebody an alcoholic or a Putin lover lol XD

[Haven]

Not standing up to a tribunal and veto'ing. so decent.

What's the point of standing up to a mock tribunal? It was determined from the start that it was supposed to blame Russia. The very fact that the tribunal was supposed to take place before the investigation was finished should've raised suspicions...

Sure, there's room for everyone. And you know what ? Before Crimea stuff, I even hoped Russia and NATO could merge in a new " Alliance ".

Russia tried to enter NATO in 1954. The initiative was rejected in Europe without discussion. The reason is quite clear - the sole purpose of NATO at that time was to deter Russia. Not much has changed. Putin tried again in 2001, with the same result.

You know what Haven ? We should depassionate the thing at a people scale, far from politics. We have to admit that yes, we may be wrong in some decisions, behaviors, and leaders have the balls to assume things when they are questionable in the eyes of the rest of the world, like with Syria, " Yes, he's using chemical warfare against his populations, but he's our ally and we support him anyway " instead of denying/contesting. And if they don't assume or disagree with things, they should simply deny to engage when it is so (like we did with the US WMD in 2nd Iraq war ... what a " social " price we paid for not engaging military with the USA ...). Like I said about the shot plane thing : if tomorrow you hear that yes, a russian missile shot it, will it change anything in the mind of those who always supported the fact it was a western lie ? I'm not sure.

Thing is, by now the truth simply can not be established. Just like 9/11. Even if someone finds rock hard, absolute, undeniable proof, tons of it - it's going to be dismissed as "conspiracy theory" or "propaganda". Well, I suppose it means "welcome to the world of informational warfare". What can we do? Think critically and not let ourselves get consumed by hatred.

[caervek]

The court ruled that the treasure belonged to the Ukrainian government and not to the museum in the Crimea.

Well that's a horrific miscarriage of justice, giving Crimea's treasures to Ukraine just because they were occupying the reason at the time they were loaned is just stupid.

I.E if Scotland loaned the Scottish crown jewels to the Netherlands and then left the UK would the send them to England? Of course not.

Obvious political stunt is obvious.

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Before the US got there? Nope.

If you need massive help from another continent, your defense strategy has failed. Just sayin...

Not really, WW2 was already won before the USA finally joined in, the only question was how much of Europe was the USSR going to annex before the allies met them. As for WW1 most people don't know that the USA was even involved, it just replaced Russia for the final year.

[Strear]

What can we do? Think critically and not let ourselves get consumed by hatred.

Exactly, all these nations are great nations, proud nations (sometimes consumed by pride or moronic things like " I could beat you with my nuke "). Not more than 2 days ago, my wife was remembering me how we LOVED Moscow (and we'll be back ). What did we see in Moscow ? The same we have here. People going to work, kindly serving us great food (those potatoes fast-food yummies ), chatting, shopping with their families ... We all just want to live the best life we can (and can afford) for us and our families, everywhere in the world. It's the same. We must think about people first, even if what we see first is the consequences of politics (even when supported by people for the best and the worst).

I'm still hoping, truly, deeply, that we'll all calm down, be more reasonable, sincere and honest one with another, and leave room for all of us to live in peace with correct standards.

[Deleted]

I envy you!

What are you talking about? It's well-known among these forums that zEmini is widely hated by most people for his abrasive hostile attitude, rightfully so.

[Adolecent]

#Russiansdidit

Yeah, an investigation of a crash that was tasked to favor Ukraine from the beginning. Zero transparency, and headlines like "PUTIN'S MISSILE" the first minutes after the crash. Been there, done that. Not to mention that Uraine already has destroyed a passenger plane in 2001 by mistake.

The 10 reasons Russian media (aka your government) gave for the killing of 300 people with flight MH17:
http://listverse.com/2015/09/07/10-o...crash-of-mh17/
Bellingcat analyses of the official Russian version of MH17 crash:
https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-a...-were-exposed/
Why the Russian government can be called corrupt and thus can hardly be trusted:
https://www.transparency.org/country/#RUS
Preliminary results criminal investigation MH17:
https://www.om.nl/onderwerpen/mh17-v...ntation-joint/
Why the Dutch goverment can hardly be called corrupt:
https://www.transparency.org/country/#NLD

You're powerless. And since the next American president wants to be partners with Russia, you're going to be all alone with your paranoid vision of the world. Soon the official media narrative will change, and your opinion with it.

If you think we're powerless, you're making a grand mistake. Sure the populists in the US and in Europe are teaming up with Putin. Credit to him for luring them into his camp. But the rest of us, still a large majority in Europe and a small majority in the US, keep thinking. And analysing. And aren't as undereducated as the vast majority of the populists.

Another part of Europe, the former East-Block countries, experianced Russian influance first hand. Thats why they've democraticly chosen to be a part of the EU when they got the chanse. (and shot all the Russian tools that oppressed them for decades)


Ceausescu

The majority of the West did not forget, nor are we fools. The majority of the former Russian enclaves did not forget, nor are they fools either.

And military speaking: we are strong enough to counter any Russian attack on our soils.

A small tip: Start looking to Asia. (mabey you'll remember that i said that one day) Putin and Trump aren't teaming up for nothing, there is something to gain. China's infuance in Asia is a great concern to the USA and Russia. They're gonna try to stop China together and it will end in war.

As last: don't believe people like Putin will bring peace to the world. Look at how he took power and what he is doing to stay in power. Extend that line to the future and think.

[Deleted]

And military speaking: we are strong enough to counter any Russian attack on our soils.

Depends on how you look at it really. Many EU countries are very weak and underfunded. The US of course is very capable of defeating the Russians in a possible WW3.

I personally don't worry about if "we" can win or not, but about the destruction on the European continent and the nuclear aftermath for the survivors.

[caervek]

Depends on how you look at it really. Many EU countries are very weak and underfunded.

Have you seen Russia? Half their submarines have either sunk in port or been scrapped due to under maintenance. We outnumber their air force by more than three to one not counting half their planes don't work. Granted they have a lot of tanks but the war in Libya showed that ground forces are worthless when the enemy has air superiority.

[Adolecent]

Well that's a horrific miscarriage of justice, giving Crimea's treasures to Ukraine just because they were occupying the reason at the time they were loaned is just stupid.

I.E if Scotland loaned the Scottish crown jewels to the Netherlands and then left the UK would the send them to England? Of course not.

Invalid comparison. Scotland is internationaly accepted as a soverein country, Crimea isn't. Crimea is still seen as a part of Ukraine, occupied by Russia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...olution_68/262

The jewels were on loan to a museum in Amsterdam, not to the Dutch government. I know it's hard to understand for many people, specialy people who live in dictator-ruled-countries, but the Dutch government has nothing to say about that museum nor the independant courts... So blaming the Dutch government is just stupid populist crap. (go read a book!)
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-w...-go-to-ukraine

[Deianeira]

You are lucky the free ride lasted this long. At least you saved for the future, and now have the funds needed to buy modern equipment. Oh wait, you didn't? Well, you can always learn to speak Russian, I guess.

You do realise that if the US should ditch Europe you know who will probably join into NATO or make a similar agreement with the EU countries?
Yes that would be Russia, and Europeans working with the Russians could mean all sorts of trouble for the US.

Prolly not gonna happen though.

[caervek]

Invalid comparison.

Fine I will make it clearer, if Catalonia gained independance from Spain and some of it's treasures were on loan to a foreign museum, would they be expected to return them to the museum in Catalonia that owns them or to give the to Spain? Exactly.

This is nothing more than dirty politics, the west want to punish Crimea for choosing to leave Ukraine and so are doing this to hurt them.