1. #36941
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Shad View Post
    hahaahahhahaahhahahahahha


    Go Tell to my old budds playing warrior dps during naxx, when they where getting this list of buffs pre raid to min max

    Elixir of Giants +25 Str
    Elixir of the Mongoose +25 Agi / %2 Crit
    R.O.I.D.S. +25 Str OR Ground Scorpok Assay +25 Agi (They dont stack)
    Smoked Desert Dumplings +20 Str
    Scroll of Strength IV +17 Str
    Scroll of Agility IV +17 Agi
    Winterfall Firewater +35 Ap
    2xElemental Sharpening Stone %2 Crit MH / %2 Crit OH
    Juju Power +30 Str (Horde only)
    Juju Might +40 Ap (Horde only)
    Juju Flurry %3 Attack Speed (Horde only)
    Fengus' Ferocity +200 Ap (DM buff)
    Rallying Cry of the Dragonslayer +140 Ap / %5 Crit / %10 Spell Crit (Ony/Neff buff)
    Sayge's Dark Fortune of Damage %10 Damage (Dmf buff)
    Spirit of Zandalar %15 All Stats / %10 Move Speed (Zg buff)


    or go tell people playing on vanilla atm doing MC runs in 30minutes due to massive melee class stacking + wf totem

    or go tell people using TheoryCraft addon back in vanilla pff
    All those buff (consumables and world bufff...aka no skill involved only g and killing some mobs outdoor and a 5 man dung) for only spamming 1111111111111111111111111
    Or as was My dps macro as Mage /castsequence arcane power (or whayever was The name) frostbolt-frostbolt-frostbolt-frostblolt and so on

    Much speels, many skills, Much wow

  2. #36942
    Quote Originally Posted by RickJamesLich View Post
    Yeah, you may be the one guy that enjoys the achievement system lol. Most find it uninteresting. If you go into any thread about great moments during BC.... you'll see stuff like Isle of Quel'danas pvp, karazhan, Black Temple, arena... you won't see anyone mentioning achievements.
    "most" people? LOL okay. I love that proof you brought. Achievement farming is a thing, people do it, how many do it and enjoy it is up to speculation. I would take a guess that more people do achievements than EVER raided in Vanilla though.

  3. #36943
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Merillo View Post
    All those buff (consumables and world bufff...aka no skill involved only g and killing some mobs outdoor and a 5 man dung) for only spamming 1111111111111111111111111
    Or as was My dps macro as Mage /castsequence arcane power (or whayever was The name) frostbolt-frostbolt-frostbolt-frostblolt and so on

    Much speels, many skills, Much wow
    Infact this is "micromanagement" like the one we have in legion, min max buffs/ min max theorycraft (not everybody simc) that is something "niche" or "surplus"

    but I was showing, as you stated out with the mage macro, that "hurr durr spam 3 skill in legion dungeon" is a bit retard when in vanilla there was literally 1 skill rotation.
    Last edited by mmocbfa8dc246d; 2016-12-25 at 08:23 PM.

  4. #36944
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickJamesLich View Post
    Again, many guilds weren't able to kill it in time lol, we can go back and forth on this all you want
    That's because you, for some reason, harping on a detail that does not belong to what I said.

    but all of the evidence points in my favor of it being a challenging fight. Do I need to remind you how many players actually killed a boss in Naxx once more?
    You can claim evidence is in your favor all you want, that doesn't make it true. Do I need to remind you how Naxxramas was released way harder than it was intended?

    Nah, blood lust really does just trivialize the most challenging aspects of a fight - usually the phase where the boss is close to death.
    Name one? I'm thinking your definition of 'trivialize' may not be what the really means.

    Naxx was meant to be *that* hard to the point where just getting there was a challenge.
    No, it wasn't. It was over-tuned. The fights were harder than they were intended to be.

    Yet still more challenging than the rep grinds that followed it.
    If you consider boredom a challenge, then yeah, sure, but damn, is your bar quite low...

    The difference is with rep grinds you can meaningfully advance your character outside of normal PvE content. With achievements you can't really do that. In fact the only thing you get out of them is awful looking mounts.
    "You can't do that with achievements, but yes, you can do that with achievements" is basically what you just said. From achievements you can get toys and pets, aside from mounts. Just like you can get with reputations back then. Gear? By the time you reach exalted, chances are, you're already sporting better stuff than they offer.

    Nah, they came out at the end of BC - the very last month in fact, in patch 3.02. Go ahead and check lol.
    I did. Patch 3.0.2 is Wrath of the Lich King. Pre-expansion patches belong to the expansion they precede, because they don't add any more content that belong to said expansion, but bring in the new expansion's data in.

    Yeah, you may be the one guy that enjoys the achievement system lol. Most find it uninteresting.
    I'd like to see some proof of that claim, please?

    If you go into any thread about great moments during BC.... you'll see stuff like Isle of Quel'danas pvp, karazhan, Black Temple, arena... you won't see anyone mentioning achievements.
    That's because achievements weren't introduced in BC, they were introduced in Wrath of the Lich King.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  5. #36945
    Deleted
    Tbh NAXX was over-tuned like TOV

    And some fight were really "heavy requirements" like 4donkeys because if you lost 1 tank, oh god, the horror.


    ---


    Also about "achiev"

    Achievements are self-contained goals that offer new challenges, satisfy goal-oriented players, and allow others to see your accomplishments in World of Warcraft.

    Introduced with Wrath, the system launched with exactly 749 individual achievements covering every aspect of gameplay, including world exploration, PvE, PvP, professions, and character development; from the purely whimsical to the truly epic, there is something for everyone. Some achievements come with in-game rewards such as mounts, tabards, vanity pets, and titles. All of these rewards are purely cosmetic and just for fun, but you’ll certainly stand out when you proudly display them.
    Patch 3.0.2

    http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_3.0.2

    WRATH PATCH


    Now stop with the bullshit and with the "ielenia plz rekt me"
    Last edited by mmocbfa8dc246d; 2016-12-25 at 08:29 PM.

  6. #36946
    Classic WoW for Christmas present?

  7. #36947
    For what it's worth, with everybody talking so much about Vanilla, I went ahead and created an account to check out the game on X server. I had played a bit back in the day, came all the way up to level 40 iirc, but never did much in the way of raiding or endgame.

    And after I did... I never ran Legion anymore. Vanilla actually feels like an RPG, a world to explore, with people to interact with. It really says much about the current state of the game when I boot up a 12-year old version of it and get instantly hooked, to the point I never even bother to log back in retail. I've let my sub lapse, done deal.

    I do hope they bring official servers, would be reassuring to know that the work I'm currently putting on my character won't be wiped in the future. I would easily pay a monthly sub for that, even going as far as re-buying the base version of the game if that's the business model Blizzard chose. Nevertheless, I'm having a blast. Really don't see myself coming back for Nighthold or future patches, the game truly lost its way... feels like I'm playing Diablo most of the time.

  8. #36948
    Quote Originally Posted by fbscarel View Post
    For what it's worth, with everybody talking so much about Vanilla, I went ahead and created an account to check out the game on X server. I had played a bit back in the day, came all the way up to level 40 iirc, but never did much in the way of raiding or endgame.

    And after I did... I never ran Legion anymore. Vanilla actually feels like an RPG, a world to explore, with people to interact with. It really says much about the current state of the game when I boot up a 12-year old version of it and get instantly hooked, to the point I never even bother to log back in retail. I've let my sub lapse, done deal.

    I do hope they bring official servers, would be reassuring to know that the work I'm currently putting on my character won't be wiped in the future. I would easily pay a monthly sub for that, even going as far as re-buying the base version of the game if that's the business model Blizzard chose. Nevertheless, I'm having a blast. Really don't see myself coming back for Nighthold or future patches, the game truly lost its way... feels like I'm playing Diablo most of the time.
    Agreed. I, too, won't look back to retail. Vanilla is so much better in terms of community and interaction with each other. Go to any zone on Nost and you can find people to talk to and make friends with. No one gives a shit on retail because they know they won't see people ever again while in LFG.

    Infracted
    Last edited by Darsithis; 2016-12-26 at 04:53 AM.

  9. #36949
    Deleted
    Since I play on Nost again I have not even logged into Legion, it makes you see how bad Legion actually is. I'd rather run Deadmines then Karazhan or any Mythic+...

    Infracted
    Last edited by Darsithis; 2016-12-26 at 04:53 AM.

  10. #36950
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbscarel View Post
    the game truly lost its way...
    I can't help but always chuckle in amusement when I read stuff like that, because it heavily implies people believe they, and they alone, dictate the direction a MMO game should go. You don't.

    Mainly two things "dictate" the direction for a game development: the gaming market, and the gaming community as a whole.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by EVGAFAVOR View Post
    Since I play on <snip> again I have not even logged into Legion,
    Please read the rules.

    it makes you see how bad Legion actually is.
    No. No, it doesn't. Not at all. It only says you don't like Legion, which is fine. But, hey, it's not an uncommon tactic to see pro-legacy people stating opinions as facts.

    I'd rather run Deadmines then Karazhan or any Mythic+...
    So... are you saying you abhor challenge, since you're saying you prefer running a level 20 dungeon than a max level dungeon in hard mode? ... Ok?
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  11. #36951
    Deleted
    Get the fuck out Blizzard fanboy! And btw I have Nightbane Mount, Trinket and Chest and did enough Mythic+ Dungeons. Deadmines at Level18 is way more challenging than Kara or any Mythic+. Try tanking at level18 on Nost - its way harder than any Class at Maxlevel Retail.

    INFRACTION
    Last edited by Saracens; 2016-12-26 at 08:27 AM.

  12. #36952
    Quote Originally Posted by EVGAFAVOR View Post
    Get the fuck out Blizzard fanboy!
    Is that really all you have when someone comes in to debate with you? You made opinions, someone debated them and all you have are insults?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by EVGAFAVOR View Post
    Get the fuck out Blizzard fanboy! And btw I have Nightbane Mount, Trinket and Chest and did enough Mythic+ Dungeons. Deadmines at Level18 is way more challenging than Kara or any Mythic+. Try tanking at level18 on Nost - its way harder than any Class at Maxlevel Retail.
    Since you expanded upon it. No it's really not. I've played those dungeons and they are not hard whatsoever. Time consuming is the word I'd use to describe them. Major difference between a challenge and a time sink.
    Last edited by Eleccybubb; 2016-12-26 at 04:25 AM.

  13. #36953
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I can't help but always chuckle in amusement when I read stuff like that, because it heavily implies people believe they, and they alone, dictate the direction a MMO game should go. You don't.
    I know I don't. I mean... are you really that pedantic? When I say the game "lost its way" it seems quite obvious (to me at least) I'm speaking only for myself. I can't for sure speak for other players, and have no intention to do so. And did you really have to quote and retort six words out of a 3-paragraph post I made? I for one wouldn't concern myself with such little details.

    I was not "heavily implying" anything. All I was doing was telling my story. I read and re-read my post and it's really, really straightforward, I think.

    All I said was, FOR ME, the game lost its way. I prefer Vanilla, therefore I play it. That's it. Not speaking for ANYONE ELSE here.
    Last edited by fbscarel; 2016-12-26 at 04:34 AM.

  14. #36954
    Quote Originally Posted by EVGAFAVOR View Post
    Get the fuck out Blizzard fanboy! And btw I have Nightbane Mount, Trinket and Chest and did enough Mythic+ Dungeons. Deadmines at Level18 is way more challenging than Kara or any Mythic+. Try tanking at level18 on ~snip~ - its way harder than any Class at Maxlevel Retail.
    Hahah you can't be fucking serious. Deadmins in Vanilla a challenge? The challenge to stay awake when doing no mechanics at all maybe. I mean some pro-Legacy people make some sensible arguments but when you try and make bullshit claims like Vanilla is some super hardcore challenger's paradise you are out of your mind.

  15. #36955
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyanion View Post
    Hahah you can't be fucking serious. Deadmins in Vanilla a challenge? The challenge to stay awake when doing no mechanics at all maybe. I mean some pro-Legacy people make some sensible arguments but when you try and make bullshit claims like Vanilla is some super hardcore challenger's paradise you are out of your mind.
    I bet the "challenge" of gearing up to face HuHu will really make his day :P!

  16. #36956
    Quote Originally Posted by fbscarel View Post
    I know I don't. I mean... are you really that pedantic? When I say the game "lost its way" it seems quite obvious (to me at least) I'm speaking only for myself.
    It was't really apparent you were speaking for yourself. It looked like one of those general sweeping statements that gets made (both side loves to use them).

  17. #36957
    Honorary PvM "Mod" Darsithis's Avatar
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    Again, and I don't know how many times I need to stress this, this is not a thread for you to discuss your experiences on a private server. That isn't allowed here. It has never been allowed here; the original thread was about a very noteworthy shutdown that led to Blizzard themselves discussing it and has been repurposed since.

    Nor am I interested in hearing "well, shut the thread down!". This thread's purpose is for discussing classic World of Warcraft (as you remember it), legacy servers, and pristine servers (if they ever appear) as well as any official news from Blizzard relating to any of the above.

    Naming private servers, linking to them, talking about them, comparing them to each other or to retail World of Warcraft will not be tolerated.

  18. #36958
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    Nor am I interested in hearing "well, shut the thread down!". This thread's purpose is for discussing classic World of Warcraft (as you remember it), legacy servers, and pristine servers (if they ever appear) as well as any official news from Blizzard relating to any of the above.
    OK.

    Legacy servers implemented by Blizzard are not going to happen anytime soon, because they are hard to do. Discussed to death.

    Pristine servers implemented by Blizzard are not going to happen anytime soon, because nobody is interested (pristine servers are: current live build, just with all content outside of 1-60 thrown away). Discussed to death.

    Classic was... I don't know what it was. Good. Or bad. Don't really care, because I am not interested in the past, I am interested in the current and in the future.

    What else is there to talk about?

    How close they can reproduce vanilla now? LOL, no, that'd touch what happens on private servers. Can't discuss them.

    Which of the mechanics are important and which aren't? Nah, that'd touch what happens on private servers as well. As in, "well, I can tell you that mechanic X sucks because it does Y and that's tedious" and in two posts someone will drop the name of the private server, because, yes, the experience is from there, it's not from 10 years ago, nobody remembers things from 10 years ago in this much detail, certainly not enough to support a useful discussion.

    I guess the thread is back to discussing what's legal and what isn't in very high theoretical mode because you can't support any of the arguments with data, because that data involves private servers.

    Have fun, guys. See you in the next year discussing the same three issues regarding copyright and the lost database while trying desperately to try and stay within the confines of the thread and saying nothing new because of that.

    Seriously, this thread is just bait for noobs at this point. "Please come and get banned. Happy New Year."
    Last edited by rda; 2016-12-26 at 08:24 AM.

  19. #36959
    Quote Originally Posted by rda View Post
    Seriously, this thread is just bait for noobs at this point. "Please come and get banned. Happy New Year."
    While I agree with you on this point, the thread is intended to serve the purpose of providing a place to discuss Legacy without having ten to fifteen different "Bring back Legacy NOW" threads a day. Kind of like there's a Legendary megathread but you still see ten to fifteen new threads on the subject anyway. Iunno. MMO-C is a pretty big community and I understand the need for a megathread like this but it is somewhat strange that a subject which was central to this thread's existence for more than 1,500 pages is now completely off limits.

    Right now, it serves mostly to be an echo chamber for pro-Legacy supporters and the eternally-at-odds musings from those of us who oppose it. Every once and awhile new topics come up which are fun to explore but when you have a thread as large as this it's extremely unlikely somebody will ever bring up something which hasn't been touched on before. That's just the nature of message boards in general. c'est la vie.

    I've actually been debating whether I should compile information from this thread to create a huge pro- and con- list for Legacy (to help with the repeat debates) but I'm not sure if the subject compels me enough at this point.

  20. #36960
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    I've actually been debating whether I should compile information from this thread to create a huge pro- and con- list for Legacy (to help with the repeat debates) but I'm not sure if the subject compels me enough at this point.
    That might actually be useful as a conclusion. (Sure, if you do some kind of a FAQ, some will object and come with their own FAQs, but that's completely fine.)

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