World Boss - Drugon the Frostblood, Outland Timewalking, Tweets, DLC #565

[Psygon]

Hati requires that I click the Assist button sometimes... then he moves his butt!

[Destructus]

I don't expect someone to main each class and each spec, I do expect that someone plays it even as an alt. The idea that it doesn't matter is silly, we are humans and we naturally have bias to the things we enjoy. Either way, number 3 doesn't seem to be happening either, some of these problems people talked about in the beta like all the Hati stuff.

The main reason he's wrong to dismiss point 1:
Point 2 and 3 are about how things work in theory whereas point 1 is about how things work in practice.

Scientists in general can tell you there's a big difference between them and both are very important.

I agree that we need someone there playing classes/specs regularly at least as an alt so they see the full design picture.

[Synapto]

Did Deathshrimp REALLY say this? "But I’d be interested in understanding *why* so many players think that it’s important that you main X in order to make sure they are designed well."

Well, if we ignore the first-hand fostering of an intrinsic understanding of class mechanics, the first-hand comprehension of the synergy between class ability and playstyle, the first-hand assessment of class (im)balance in any scenario, the first-hand emotional commitment to designing that class well, and if we ignore the utter stupidity of making such a moronic statement in the first place, then I suppose that... NO... you don't need your Warlock designer to play a Warlock (for example).

In that case, some ignorant drone who cares more about their paycheck than their class design would suit the game well, some blinkered idiot who doesn't understand the indirect (aka diluted or unrepresentative) feedback from some middle-man idiot like the Community Mangers would do fine, some oblivious dolt who doesn't bother to discuss mechanic changes directly with the "unconstructive" playerbase has a future, or some supercilious peasant who promotes their own inadequate concepts ahead of what would universally be recognised as "fun" gets to keep their job.

Indeed, this is exactly what we used to have from Deathshrimp, and this is exactly what we currently have with the present bunch of degenerate losers at Blizzard.

[sociald1077]

The World Bosses in this expansion can kiss my ass.

I did every World Boss for 6-7 weeks straight and not a single loot.
The lootsystem turned horrribleee horrribleee in this game.

I got loot on 3 out 4 characters when I ran them through the world boss this morning.

Back in classic I remember a 2 month stretch where I no loot from raids. Droughts have happened in WoW since the very begining.

[Ragedaug]

The main reason he's wrong to dismiss point 1:
Point 2 and 3 are about how things work in theory whereas point 1 is about how things work in practice.

Scientists in general can tell you there's a big difference between them and both are very important.

I agree that we need someone there playing classes/specs regularly at least as an alt so they see the full design picture.

I tend to agree. If they don't have reps that are playing the class and sticking up for the class you get to the point where you feel left out. I also think it's not fair to compare class design from WoW and LoL. In WoW, being an RPG and a game where players have played the same character for a decade, players are more married to their toons then you see in LoL

Nothing worse then feeling broken for a whole expac (or several) and wondering why you can never get fixed. Or getting glimpses of being fixed for one or two patches, then going right back to being broken. Probably one of the reasons I don't play a DPS shaman (my first main) much anymore. So hit or miss between patches & expacs on whether they will be viable or just plain suck.

[Lightbull]

Did Deathshrimp REALLY say this? "But I’d be interested in understanding *why* so many players think that it’s important that you main X in order to make sure they are designed well."

Well, if we ignore the first-hand fostering of an intrinsic understanding of class mechanics, the first-hand comprehension of the synergy between class ability and playstyle, the first-hand assessment of class (im)balance in any scenario, the first-hand emotional commitment to designing that class well, and if we ignore the utter stupidity of making such a moronic statement in the first place, then I suppose that... NO... you don't need your Warlock designer to play a Warlock (for example).

In that case, some ignorant drone who cares more about their paycheck than their class design would suit the game well, some blinkered idiot who doesn't understand the indirect (aka diluted or unrepresentative) feedback from some middle-man idiot like the Community Mangers would do fine, some oblivious dolt who doesn't bother to discuss mechanic changes directly with the "unconstructive" playerbase has a future, or some supercilious peasant who promotes their own inadequate concepts ahead of what would universally be recognised as "fun" gets to keep their job.

Indeed, this is exactly what we used to have from Deathshrimp, and this is exactly what we currently have with the present bunch of degenerate losers at Blizzard.

Your point would work in a perfect world where game companies have unlimited resources, and designers were machines.

Like GC said in his post, there are a lot of factors that go into giving people roles in the class design team. Yes, it would be nice if every game designer was completely and absolutely invested and passionate in WoW for as long as the game exists, but in a realistic scenario this is simply not the case. People change over time, do you expect Blizzard to waste resources and fire anyone who doesn't do their job perfectly?

[luckydan79]

Did Deathshrimp REALLY say this? "But I’d be interested in understanding *why* so many players think that it’s important that you main X in order to make sure they are designed well."

Well, if we ignore the first-hand fostering of an intrinsic understanding of class mechanics, the first-hand comprehension of the synergy between class ability and playstyle, the first-hand assessment of class (im)balance in any scenario, the first-hand emotional commitment to designing that class well, and if we ignore the utter stupidity of making such a moronic statement in the first place, then I suppose that... NO... you don't need your Warlock designer to play a Warlock (for example).

In that case, some ignorant drone who cares more about their paycheck than their class design would suit the game well, some blinkered idiot who doesn't understand the indirect (aka diluted or unrepresentative) feedback from some middle-man idiot like the Community Mangers would do fine, some oblivious dolt who doesn't bother to discuss mechanic changes directly with the "unconstructive" playerbase has a future, or some supercilious peasant who promotes their own inadequate concepts ahead of what would universally be recognised as "fun" gets to keep their job.

Indeed, this is exactly what we used to have from Deathshrimp, and this is exactly what we currently have with the present bunch of degenerate losers at Blizzard.

I don't think it's the classes per se, the game really has suffered as a whole because the game hasn't initially changed from WOW WOTLK to WOW CATA and keeping the old raids and dungeons made the game a complete mess nothing really fits anything at all in Azeroth.

[Mic_128]

I haven't gotten a single piece of gear from world bosses since their introduction, and that includes rolling for extra loot every single time. And no, I'm not kidding. I've been calling bullshit for a few months now.

Do you do anything else? Raiding, Mythics, LFR? Because I'm pretty sure if you bonus roll on anything and win, that resets the 'bad luck protection'.

[Deleted]

I got loot on 3 out 4 characters when I ran them through the world boss this morning.

Back in classic I remember a 2 month stretch where I no loot from raids. Droughts have happened in WoW since the very begining.

Classic and Legion aren't the same mate. Legion is accesible by everyone, and Classic wasn't. It's obvious that getting loot in Classic had you work for something and gave you a sense of accomplishment. and im talking about Wbosses here, not lootsystem in general.

Legion is accesible by everyone. It's something else.. everybody can reach out on loot, but for the ones that really need it don't get shit. The loot system is horrible for Wbosses. You dont feel a sense of accomplisment in any way but yet it's so RNG heavy. I even got 2 legendaries in 1 day but getting 1 single Wboss loot seems impossible lmao.. to the point where im thinking meh.. fuck the Wbosses, not even worth trying. It's a pain in the ass tbh since the Wbosses are only lootable once per week. Something so easy is not meant to be that RNG heavy. Luck or bad luck

[Hach]

Do you do anything else? Raiding, Mythics, LFR? Because I'm pretty sure if you bonus roll on anything and win, that resets the 'bad luck protection'.

Of course. I'm just saying: it sucks / it's kind'a bullshit that I haven't gotten a single drop in all this time, despite rolling for loot twice each week. (I didn't get any loot this week either, for what it's worth.) Bad luck alone doesn't really tend to extend to this extent, especially nowadays.

[Demise_]

@Ghostcrawler comments: while i feel ghost crawler is correct that an impartial view is the best strance, its apparent that their was favoritism within specs and classes.A problem arises when devs play x but no one plays y. If no one is playing x or y then there is no problem. Better balanced would probably be achieves is dev was in charge of c y and z was not allowes to play any.

I think the other issue this xpac is that the "style design" was much more dominant than "balance design". And this ranged through all aspecs from mythic + dungeons theough to legendaries and Artifact Knoweldge/Power.

The design te has been fixing the broader issues after the comple screw up with outlaw, (broken to begin with but the nerf hammer was more of a wrecking ball).

Ps. I started ele but now resto shaman.