I assert that individuals can make it on minimum wage.

[Ragedaug]

Im aware but thats just dogmatic moralizing. The better question is what happens when you use a man as bait?

You catch the bad guys?

[Maletalana]

You catch the bad guys?

haha I was seriously staring at my screen genuinely wondering how to respond, then my eyes wandered and I saw this. Thanks xD

[Ragedaug]

haha I was seriously staring at my screen genuinely wondering how to respond, then my eyes wandered and I saw this. Thanks xD

I often get puzzled by what GL is talking about or who he is talking to.

[Maletalana]

I often get puzzled by what GL is talking about or who he is talking to.

His title, "The Insane," is fitting.

[Shadowferal]

You guys are completely speaking out of your rear ends. /facepalm

No.
You just don't get it. There were other factors, but it's obvious that any argument that goes against your belief in your narrative will get dismissed.
I almost envy your ignorance and zero experience with poverty.
---------------------

On a related note:

Goodbye Middle Class: 51 Percent Of All American Workers Make Less Than 30,000 Dollars A Year

According to brand new numbers that were just released by the Social Security Administration, 51 percent of all workers in the United States make less than $30,000 a year. Let that number sink in for a moment. You can’t support a middle class family in America today on just $2,500 a month – especially after taxes are taken out. And yet more than half of all workers in this country make less than that each month. In order to have a thriving middle class, you have got to have an economy that produces lots of middle class jobs, and that simply is not happening in America today.

Other numbers:
-38 percent of all American workers made less than $20,000 last year.

-51 percent of all American workers made less than $30,000 last year.

-62 percent of all American workers made less than $40,000 last year.

-71 percent of all American workers made less than $50,000 last year.

That first number is truly staggering. The federal poverty level for a family of five is $28,410, and yet almost 40 percent of all American workers do not even bring in $20,000 a year.

And of course the numbers above are only for those that are actually working...

- - - Updated - - -

Im aware but thats just dogmatic moralizing. The better question is what happens when you use a man as bait?

I think today it's more like:

'Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.'

[IKT]

MINIMUM WAGE is not meant to support a wholesome on-your-own lifestyle.

You don't get to have
a) no education
b) no experience
c) no value to an employer other than you're a warm body

and expect to live on your own in a nice house with a car and all this other shit.

You don't deserve that.

Spot on, very elequently espoused by George Carlin:



Thank you for doing your best to keep us fighting

[kamuimac]

---------------------

On a related note:

Goodbye Middle Class: 51 Percent Of All American Workers Make Less Than 30,000 Dollars A Year

According to brand new numbers that were just released by the Social Security Administration, 51 percent of all workers in the United States make less than $30,000 a year. Let that number sink in for a moment. You can’t support a middle class family in America today on just $2,500 a month – especially after taxes are taken out. And yet more than half of all workers in this country make less than that each month. In order to have a thriving middle class, you have got to have an economy that produces lots of middle class jobs, and that simply is not happening in America today.

Other numbers:
-38 percent of all American workers made less than $20,000 last year.

-51 percent of all American workers made less than $30,000 last year.

-62 percent of all American workers made less than $40,000 last year.

-71 percent of all American workers made less than $50,000 last year.

That first number is truly staggering. The federal poverty level for a family of five is $28,410, and yet almost 40 percent of all American workers do not even bring in $20,000 a year.

And of course the numbers above are only for those that are actually working...

- - - Updated - - -


I think today it's more like:

'Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.'

its called globalsation - i know its risky thesis but in my eyes a lot of america wealth was build around extorting other immigrant nations - between 1900-1950 the wealth was build on super heavy and underpaid work of afro americans, mexicans and all other emmigrants - thats why white community could have had their american dream - but then bubble bursted when no longer persecuted people of many colours got education and got decent jobs - and suddenly the class of "white thrash " appeared - peopel who preciously would make living on extorting others couldnt do this anymore .

also be real - tell people in for example Ukraine or other stans like kazachstan etc how living for 20k $ a year is hard when poor people in those coutries make below 1000$ a year and still live.

[Shadowferal]

Well, if you're for a more globalized economy, then you're for a more globalized government.

It's really a race to the bottom..

[kamuimac]

If Ukraine is now the bar by which we measure ourselves, we are truly boned.

thats not what i mean - people need to stop blindly think that US is as paradise to live in as it was painted 50 years ago with whole "american dream " myth - myth that was build on very low wages of immigrants and descendants of former slave cast which were still treated as ones just could leave if they didnt like conditions of work.

world has moved on - many coutries which 50 years ago were poorer then US now ahave higher live standards - you can either ignore those facts or admit they are true and understand why it happens. you build you economy on outsorcing many things because cheap costs of labour there but realise that by doin this you gave tools to native people of those countries to deveolpe their oven markets - people are not idiots just because they are poor - and now US still lives in delusion of its grandness when in fact the only remaining factor is huge army ready to invade any country because economics and markets went to shit without cheap labour.

[breadisfunny]

its called globalsation - i know its risky thesis but in my eyes a lot of america wealth was build around extorting other immigrant nations - between 1900-1950 the wealth was build on super heavy and underpaid work of afro americans, mexicans and all other emmigrants - thats why white community could have had their american dream - but then bubble bursted when no longer persecuted people of many colours got education and got decent jobs - and suddenly the class of "white thrash " appeared - peopel who preciously would make living on extorting others couldnt do this anymore .

also be real - tell people in for example Ukraine or other stans like kazachstan etc how living for 20k $ a year is hard when poor people in those coutries make below 1000$ a year and still live.

because it's essentially the same equivalent just bigger numbers. both of them are still poor as shit and both are getting paid shit wages compared to what they need wage wise in that country to survive and live. go ahead just try and live off of 20k in an area like los angeles or new york or san fran. even in more rural or less dense areas 20k is still poverty level.

[Shadowferal]

Well, people were angry enough to elect Trump. Imagine how angry things will get when the percentages get worse. I heard (misheard?) Trump doesn't trust the Secret Service so he hired his own bodyguards...not a good sign.

[alturic]

Well, people were angry enough to elect Trump. Imagine how angry things will get when the percentages get worse. I heard (misheard?) Trump doesn't trust the Secret Service so he hired his own bodyguards...not a good sign.

Yea, you heard wrong.

[TITAN308]

That first number is truly staggering. The federal poverty level for a family of five is $28,410, and yet almost 40 percent of all American workers do not even bring in $20,000 a year.

Imagine that, having five fucking kids creates a problem with making money.

[Captain N]

Imagine that, having five fucking kids creates a problem with making money.

That's family of five -- as in two parents and three children.

[Shadowferal]

Yea, you heard wrong.

Imagine that

[TITAN308]

That's family of five -- as in two parents and three children.

I stand corrected.

Imagine that, having three fucking kids creates a problem with making money.

[Sorrior]

Good lord I have repeated this so many times now.

MINIMUM WAGE is not meant to support a wholesome on-your-own lifestyle.

When you're a teenager, you get a minimum wage job, find a roommate, and share an apartment.

As you move up, you'll eventually earn enough to live on your own.


It's that simple....



You don't get to have
a) no education
b) no experience
c) no value to an employer other than you're a warm body

and expect to live on your own in a nice house with a car and all this other shit.

You don't deserve that.

Now is it a sucky life if you're 28 and have 2 kids with your live-in girlfriend and for some reason or another you still don't have anything past high school and still work the counter at McDonald's? Yeah man, that sucks, but the government or the system isn't responsible for you having kids and not moving up in life, that's on you pal.

The originator of the very concept disagrees with you. It was meant to be enough that if you wirk 40 hours a week you habe enough to eat pay rent and save money. And eventually buy a house on yes ONE income. Not to Bea high school kids spare pocket change.

[Total Crica]

The originator of the very concept disagrees with you. It was meant to be enough that if you wirk 40 hours a week you habe enough to eat pay rent and save money. And eventually buy a house on yes ONE income. Not to Bea high school kids spare pocket change.

Minimum_wage_origins

"Modern minimum wage laws trace their origin to the Ordinance of Labourers (1349), which was a decree by King Edward III that set a maximum wage for laborers in medieval England.

King Edward III, who was a wealthy landowner, was dependent, like his lords, on serfs to work the land.

In the autumn of 1348, the Black Plague reached England and decimated the population.

The severe shortage of labor caused wages to soar and encouraged King Edward III to set a wage ceiling.

Subsequent amendments to the ordinance, such as the Statute of Labourers (1351), increased the penalties for paying a wage above the set rates.

While the laws governing wages initially set a ceiling on compensation, they were eventually used to set a living wage. An amendment to the Statute of Labourers in 1389 effectively fixed wages to the price of food.

As time passed, the Justice of the Peace, who was charged with setting the maximum wage, also began to set formal minimum wages.

The practice was eventually formalized with the passage of the Act Fixing a Minimum Wage in 1604 by King James I for workers in the textile industry."

[Shadowferal]

Pretty sure that it was referenced by how the min wage originated in the US.

No business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country.

President Franklin Delano Roosevelt, 1933

That's how is should have always been.

[Sorrior]

Pretty sure that it was referenced by how the min wage originated in the US.

No business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country.

President Franklin Delano Roosevelt, 1933

That's how is should have always been.

This is correct

- - - Updated - - -

Minimum_wage_origins

"Modern minimum wage laws trace their origin to the Ordinance of Labourers (1349), which was a decree by King Edward III that set a maximum wage for laborers in medieval England.

King Edward III, who was a wealthy landowner, was dependent, like his lords, on serfs to work the land.

In the autumn of 1348, the Black Plague reached England and decimated the population.

The severe shortage of labor caused wages to soar and encouraged King Edward III to set a wage ceiling.

Subsequent amendments to the ordinance, such as the Statute of Labourers (1351), increased the penalties for paying a wage above the set rates.

While the laws governing wages initially set a ceiling on compensation, they were eventually used to set a living wage. An amendment to the Statute of Labourers in 1389 effectively fixed wages to the price of food.

As time passed, the Justice of the Peace, who was charged with setting the maximum wage, also began to set formal minimum wages.

The practice was eventually formalized with the passage of the Act Fixing a Minimum Wage in 1604 by King James I for workers in the textile industry."

A wage ceiling is if anything the exact opposite of a minimum wage and if they started making a minimum that much later..and a system based on what something essentially unrelated?