Watcher knew about Legion issues, did nothing about it

[Paulosio]

Great sum of excuses. Actually doesn't matter since even most P2Win Asian RPGs have better balance than WoW nowadays.

These days ? The game today is still more balanced than Vanilla ever was (and i'd argue BC too).. Good luck if you wanted to raid in a proper guild as a boomkin, BM hunter, shadow priest, ret pala and half the other specs in game during Vanilla. Doesn't stop plenty of people going on about how awesome vanilla was / is.

[Theed]

I'm sorry...

The lack of quality with blizzard?!

Do you even realise how much polish and balance you get out of the box on any blizzard game vs. everyone else out there?!

I agree that some things are designed a bit poorly, but dear god it's like the millionth thing out of 999.999 that work brilliantly while others can't even get 20 right.

This elitist shit that's going on in wow since years is actually proof of that.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

Offtopic: Usually i would agree 100% with you. Most games of Blizzard are very VERY polished. Legion however saw a massive drop in QA. Major Bugs slipped QA like double Legandary bug, Rated BG and Arena rating bugs, failed pvp title rewards and other flaws happened over and over again since the game was released. Major class flaws like surrender to madness which were reported in beta are still in the game. I can only explain this with a pared QA budget.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

lets get it on the table . its bad in your opinion - one that is not shared by more then 500 people on this forum.

for majority of other players the legendary system in legion is good.

At least you got your daily "look guys my dick is small" post out the way. Truth be told unless you got data that proves other wise you are just sharing an opinion as fact. Get over it.. you are not any better than me.. and I am a scum bag. Get some game before you roll in my direction kido.

[Deleted]

did even 1 person in your guild told you to grind ? or the whole problem was in your head only ?

dont raid with douchebags and problems liek this would be non existent.

It's a combination. The people I raided with were extremely nice and I've known them since MoP. I've met them outside the game on many occasions and I'd consider most of them my friends.

But that doesn't mean there's no social pressure to the hit max traits early or to grind M+ for gear.
You should want to do all those things if you're a progression raider. It's part of that package.
It's competitive environment with people who have competitive mindsets.

But again - it's the outlier. Most people don't really have to pay any attention to any of it.
The system is fine for them.

[Raven]

Yeah Vanilla was really balanced, really like that balance the paladins had, they had 1 job in raids stay out of combat so they could ress people dying.

[Niwes]

its absurd how ppl think the current design are "mistakes" or "blizz dont know what they do". many of you do not realize how that big companies works.

i lead you step by step to get what a company like blizz do:

1)
its ALL about money.

that company do not care if you are happy. they do not care what you want. they do not care if things are "rational" to you or in general. they do not care how things look like. they do not care about you. the only exception is, if "care about you, like you feel it should" leads to more money. sometimes it does (then they go that route) sometimes not. but the fact do not change: every conclusion is made of the first and important base fact: its all about money. you should really get that (solves a lot of ppls problems in their minds, with what blizz do). its a giant company with shareholder, and their one and only goal is: produce much money as possible. simple as that. The same gies for every other system in game.

2)
step 2 is: HOW to get the most money out of a giant diverse playerbase ?

they need information. so they consider their data. and they have a lot. at this point, the average mmoc poster/reader should learn the second fact: they do not even care the slightest what you give with feedback. why ? because they have no benefit of it. the only feedback that matters, is subs/money. forum feedback is useless, because 17343637 different oppinions. 1253736 useless statements. 153632634 ppl wrote how bad is x and y, and what they like or dont like, BUT stay subbed! so why listen to anything of that ? its pointless. the only use of feedback is, to get an overall very foggy feeling what the community thinks. its a 3-5% part in blizzards descissions. the rest is comin from their data, market analysis, maths, etc. to guarantee the most money outcome.

3)
WHAT to implement to get the most money out of WoW ?

Every single aspect of the game is calculated. Bad Legendary system ? Accident? Mistake? No. Its based on a "get best quarter numbers" mindset behind. They do what the best money maker is. Regardless how strange, stupid or whatever the system sounds to you. Thats why nothing changed since alpha and the system stay as it is in 7.1.5. Because it works! Money-wise.

Conclusion:
And none of the above is "conspiracy" or "evil" or whatever. Its just the way, big companies like blizzard work, and whats happen in free market economy. If you do not believe that, just work in such a company and check it for yourself. The problem with ppl is, they have a tunnel view of their own viewpoint. If you really want to understand why blizzard is doing the things they do, learn to think as blizzard. Trying to get an understanding by viewing their outcome from the outside, will lead you nowhere.

[Deleted]

Offtopic: Usually i would agree 100% with you. Most games of Blizzard are very VERY polished. Legion however saw a massive drop in QA. Major Bugs slipped QA like double Legandary bug, Rated BG and Arena rating bugs, failed pvp title rewards and other flaws happened over and over again since the game was released. Major class flaws like surrender to madness which were reported in beta are still in the game. I can only explain this with a pared QA budget.

Well I see that, my point being, rather look to what has worked.

If you compare to other developers or publishers the amount of actual game breaking bugs blizzard has let slip through is minimal.
I can tell you for almost any other MMO where actual rollbacks had to happen to almost the entire playerbase etc.

SWTOR lost cash currency balances in the beginning (of f2p), another mmo lost all chars etc.

1)
its ALL about money.

[...]

2)
step 2 is: HOW to get the most money out of giant diverse playerbase ?

[...]
3)
WHAT to implement to get the most money out of WoW ?
[...]

no really exactly this...!
And blizzard excells at this "game".

[xZerocidex]

Guys guys....

Let's just agree that the Legendary system we got right now is shit and hope it doesn't return whether it's raid related or not.

[Deleted]

I don't care so much that he knew or that the systems were in place. My problem is they are insisting and expanding the systems for the rest of the expansion like they are a good thing. They are making a mistake into a bigger mistake. That is the straw that breaks the Camel's back.

[Niwes]

Guys guys....

Let's just agree that the Legendary system we got right now is shit and hope it doesn't return whether it's raid related or not.

it WILL return, if it works. money-wise. otherwise it will be canceled. after the dust settled they will calculate it and decide if its been cutted for the next xpac (they are start working/planing on yet), if they improve it, or if they take it exactly like it is now. they decide it, based on hiw it worked out, money/sub-wise (carrot-on-a-stick-wise).

[Taeldorian]

They switched mains to those that got their BIS legendaries. They sat their classes themselves.

Apparently you didn't understand. They played alts of their mains. They stayed with the same class but switched to whichever toon got the better legendaries.

For example, Naguura in serenity has 4 or 5 Druids leveled and always does, so she picked whichever Druid got the best legendaries.

Is the system broken? Fuck yes. Is it bad? Absolutely. Was it thought through all the way? Nope. BUT, are people getting benched or sat due to legendaries? Absolutely not. The system has a ton of issues, but this isn't one.

[Niwes]

I don't care so much that he knew or that the systems were in place. My problem is they are insisting and expanding the systems for the rest of the expansion like they are a good thing. They are making a mistake into a bigger mistake. That is the straw that breaks the Camel's back.

why do you believe its a mistake ? do blizzard think its a mistake ? maybe you are another one thinking its bullshit and pay blizz 15 bugs a month ? they will not change the system, as long as it works.

[Darkguyver2020]

FFS people, stop bitching about everything in this game, the game is NOT in that bad a shape as you all make it out to be. Just because you don't like something, or the way it was designed, does not make it 'wrong' and need 'fixed'. The amount of bullshit whining because something 'is not fair' is getting out of hand. Life isn't fair, something in a video game are also not fair, get over it and stop this "I didn't get what I want, when I wanted it, so lets go complain" attitude.

I think this is the perfect bookend to all whine threads on this site. /thread.

[SirBeef]

I definitely hope this is sarcasm. I feel like it is.

Even the top guilds in the world said they didn't bench anyone due to bad legendaries. I've never seen a single pug even require a legendary and most of the top US 20 guilds I've seen recruit don't require one either. They don't even ask how many you've got.

Even the thread a while back here no one said they got benched or refused to bring someone due to a lack of or a bad legendary.

[Deleted]

Even the thread a while back here no one said they got benched or refused to bring someone due to a lack of or a bad legendary.

They specifically said that they benched characters (mains) due to alters getting BiS legendaries when they had to push content. Overall, they also said that class stacking (class imbalance) was more important than legendaries tho.

I mean, if they are going to use comments from method, atleast do it right, instead of half-assing them just so they don't contradict their arguments in the slightlest form.

[Super Kami Dende]

Rerolls to new characters were done based on legendaries though.

only if they wanted too. They weren't forced to and many stayed on their Mains regardless of their alts having legendaries.

[Echocho]

Yeah Vanilla was really balanced, really like that balance the paladins had, they had 1 job in raids stay out of combat so they could ress people dying.

In our case that wasn't because paladins were bad healers, it was because all our paladins refused to heal. I think it attracted a certain type of person that wanted to be a 2H wielding holy warrior and detracting from that was beneath them. We had ONE paladin that wore whatever gear that boosted his healing, dubbed "the clothadin" by the other paladins but his healing was sublime.

[Eon Drache]

.2% dps boost is 2.8% dps for your raid group which can be the difference between a phase push (cenarius) or wipe (guarm). I know you're trying to be smart but actually say something smart when you do it next time.

That .2% boost is if you play your class perfectly, get no downtimes and don't miss your gcd by even a fraction of a second. Even players in the top 100 will hit something like that in a progress kill. My point was no matter how big or small the dps difference in legendaries people will complain. As they always have since vanilla.

[Deleted]

You are upostu be behind players what plays more. Thats how game works. Like what do you want? Blizzard to stop them from playing so you can catch up with them? Put insade game soft caps so you dont feel forced to play game? Casuals will never and dont deserver to catch up to more hardcore players end of story.

Said Sinndor the Wise.

Well, its ok for me to be behind, Im not casual either, more average. But actualy its first expansion you have to grind that much besides mythic raiding, at least for me. WoD was awful, yeah but now there is no limit like 1 hc dungeinon per day, then you could do lower diff raids. For me its a bit too much and too random, but I wont quit or something silly like this, i just dont enjoy playing with that much rng. A lot of hours spent in a game, 2 worst legendary (was waiting 4 months for 2nd one) for my spec, and i love to compete on wlogs rankings. God bless the legendary nerfs thats only my point of view but yeah when I was once hardcore I wanted some options to improve myself beside raiding. However the cap is something I would love to have now, when I dont have that much time. For example, world quests are imo awesome, I do them regulary, and I hated doing daily quests.

[Deleted]

only if they wanted too. They weren't forced to and many stayed on their Mains regardless of their alts having legendaries.

Yea I'm sure Method was sitting there on Helya, pushing for world first when Sco and Roger said: "Hey do you guys mind logging those other chars of yours that do 10% more damage? If you don't want to tho it's fine, don't worry about it."

I also think some of their members didn't use flasks and shit with them being so expensive.

Jesus the shit I read on these forums never cease to amaze me.