Watcher knew about Legion issues, did nothing about it

[Luxeley]

I'm sorry...

The lack of quality with blizzard?!

Do you even realise how much polish and balance you get out of the box on any blizzard game vs. everyone else out there?!

I agree that some things are designed a bit poorly, but dear god it's like the millionth thing out of 999.999 that work brilliantly while others can't even get 20 right.

This elitist shit that's going on in wow since years is actually proof of that.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

3-4 years ago you're a 100% right, today I don't believe so. Between tech issues (WOD) and Balance issues (Legion & MOP), Blizzard reputation for quality is not what it used to be.

[darklogrus]

I seen first hand people benched because they had to compete dps wise against people with BiS legendaries.

[Lasombria]

Watcher knew about Legion issues, did nothing about it
Legion was an inside job.

*laugh* Right on. Now I'm imagining arguments like "Legendaries can't melt steel beams!". To which a friend of mine once gave the great answer, "Get out! The calls are coming from inside your head!"

[Gwiez]

OP's sig should have ended this thread.

[vilememory]

So what do people want from Blizzard? All I see is all this bitching and moaning, their ideas of how to fix things are far and few between. Those that do get parroted aren't exactly good for the game as a whole, so what do they want exactly? Is it for Blizzard to shutter its doors and windows? For all the games to just go offline permanently? So they can dance and sing shouting how right they were? Seriously what is it that these people want?

[Charge me Doctor]

It's different because you know what you have to do. You kill that boss once per week, and you have a shot at it. You double your chances if you roll on it. Other people in your guild get it, and that increases your chances too because now if they get another they'll give it to you.

Sucks to be a survival hunter and waiting for that trinket to drop for you when you can't get a spot amirite?

Also i still feel soar from not getting an agi axe to drop from firelands to my enhancement shaman (was raiding it since release day and was stuck with trash mace + blue axe). Or pyrite infuser in wotlk. Or whatever this fist SP weapon fro mexxna was called.

Yeah, highly likely to happen my ass. I can remember a dozen of stories on various guild forums of "dat last BiS item that keeps getting snitched from me/doesn't drop, blizz fix plz"

It's the same shit as legendary items. You either get them, or do not. The only difference that they are not locked behind a weekly reset

[Nethlord]

I'm sorry...

The lack of quality with blizzard?!

Do you even realise how much polish and balance you get out of the box on any blizzard game vs. everyone else out there?!

I agree that some things are designed a bit poorly, but dear god it's like the millionth thing out of 999.999 that work brilliantly while others can't even get 20 right.

This elitist shit that's going on in wow since years is actually proof of that.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

Just pointing out that the bolded. underlined counterminds your whole point. You contradict yourself and negates the conclusion. You can get 999.999 things right....but theoretically destroy everything about the product with that one thing they got wrong.

Example: Blizzard messes up the graphic engine to such a degree, that players can't see one single thing they are doing on the screen. The game is borked, but every other thing in the game works to perfection.

Your argument is weak to start (and kinda stereotypical). Also conflating Blizzard's reputation for polish on their games is only valid "IF" the game in quest benefits from this. The argument then should be "Does WoW benefit from that Legendary Polish?" You can make the claim it does, but then you would have to support that claim; as would someone saying it doesn't. Failing to do that, devolves the argument to nothing but a shouting match between people that "FEEL" it is one way or another.

[Deleted]

Just pointing out that the bolded. underlined counterminds your whole point. You contradict yourself and negates the conclusion. You can get 999.999 things right....but theoretically destroy everything about the product with that one thing they got wrong.

Example: Blizzard messes up the graphic engine to such a degree, that players can't see one single thing they are doing on the screen. The game is borked, but every other thing in the game works to perfection.

Your argument is weak to start (and kinda stereotypical). Also conflating Blizzard's reputation for polish on their games is only valid "IF" the game in quest benefits from this. The argument then should be "Does WoW benefit from that Legendary Polish?" You can make the claim it does, but then you would have to support that claim; as would someone saying it doesn't. Failing to do that, devolves the argument to nothing but a shouting match between people that "FEEL" it is one way or another.

Aha yeah...
Lets read up on what polish means shall we?

Then lets restart the discussion OP brings up, and maybe then you will see that the point of dicussing about a system "late" in the endgame experience chain is discussed because up to that point everything works.

[Wondercrab]

The assumption put forth in the OP fundamentally misunderstands how game design works and how developers tend to settle on decisions like this. Many design decisions (not just when it comes to gaming, but in pretty much anything) are not based on "what do we do to make this the objective best", but on "what qualities do we value over others, and what balances are we willing to strike".

The decision to implement legendaries as they did in Legion is certainly not ideal for a certain segment of the playerbase. But, as with anything, that is not the only criteria the devs made their decision based upon. Clearly they believed the positives of this system outweighed the downsides, and this is generally how you have to view any design choice. It's incredibly hard (especially in an MMO like WoW, with millions of players who all have very diverse tastes) to design something that works ideally for everyone. Most of the time you will have to compromise something along the way.

Blizzard *had* quality, but now it seems they have no QA at all. I mean bugs are not fixed even after 2 years (tot video before tortos, panda blue gem goes to enchanting bag)

This is a good example of what I'm talking about. Fixing bugs is not a simple matter of "Oh, there's a bug, let's fix it". If the bug is minor, it will go to the bottom of the priority list. If more important bugs crop up before the team get to them, then they'll get bumped down the list again. Sometimes bugs are just incredibly time consuming to fix, and if they're nothing more than a minor annoyance then they'll be written off altogether, since there are always more important things the team could be working on.

In this situation the time and resources involved in fixing said bugs is valued as being more important than the actual impact these glitches have on the game, and so they're left perpetually unresolved. That isn't bad design, lazy QA, or anything of the sort. It's good resource allocation, assuming the time is spent resolving problems that are far more serious.

[Deleted]

why do you believe its a mistake ? do blizzard think its a mistake ? maybe you are another one thinking its bullshit and pay blizz 15 bugs a month ? they will not change the system, as long as it works.

I'm afraid i have unsubbed. So... no.

I do wish they would fix it, because this isn't the game i used to play anymore. More akin to a korean MMO.

[TITAN308]

I'd still trust buying a Blizzard game over just about anyone else on the market as far as prime time producers go.

I think players of Blizzard games have gotten spoiled to put it bluntly.

[Stormspark]

Blizzard *had* quality, but now it seems they have no QA at all. I mean bugs are not fixed even after 2 years (tot video before tortos, panda blue gem goes to enchanting bag), jc bag does not working with legion gems, specs are badly undertuned, etc.

Actually patch 7.1 fixed the JC bag/Legion gems issue.

[Vichan]

Blizzard *had* quality, but now it seems they have no QA at all. I mean bugs are not fixed even after 2 years (tot video before tortos, panda blue gem goes to enchanting bag), jc bag does not working with legion gems, specs are badly undertuned, etc.

actually pretty much everything is viable now, people like to bitch and moan about certain specs being weak but you can pretty much raid in whatever spec you like

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I'd still trust buying a Blizzard game over just about anyone else on the market as far as prime time producers go.

I think players of Blizzard games have gotten spoiled to put it bluntly.

This, people blow the legendaries problem way out of proportion

[Deavane]

So what do people want from Blizzard? All I see is all this bitching and moaning, their ideas of how to fix things are far and few between. Those that do get parroted aren't exactly good for the game as a whole, so what do they want exactly? Is it for Blizzard to shutter its doors and windows? For all the games to just go offline permanently? So they can dance and sing shouting how right they were? Seriously what is it that these people want?

I'd like if legendaries weren't RNG (if there was definite progress towards them (that was visible). I'd also like to be able to target the ones I want. As a DPs, I want one of the eight more than the rest. Followed by two others that are resasonable DPs increases. The way it is now, getting a 5th takes an extradionary amount of time. There's one I can get right now that will be an absolute disappointment, and will likely ensure that I don't get a good one until half way through Nighthold, if not further. I'm a top 100 world raider though, not sure if others feel the same way but having the one's I have right now do very little for me and my role.

[Moon-Man]

Quality? Who do you think you are OP?

Companies such as Blizzard, doesn't care about quality, its ALL about the profit. Companies will gladly slide any issue to release a product on time. Especially like BLizzard, where they know people will buy their products. Even if its literally a Piece of Crap (and I mean Literally, a human feces), people will buy it and EAT it. So knowing that BLizzard, will release products quicker, with some flaws, to maximize the PROFIT. They wont please every players, because its not profitable for them. If a Consumer (customer) is not profitable, blizzard will care nothing about those people.

[Rikkof]

Pretty much this. While some legendaries are sub par, the number of people who were supposedly sat because of legendaries is probably EXTREMELY small. This is nothing but an example of the newest tactic players are trying to use to get attention to their beliefs. If they can convince other players, or the developers, that they are not able to play the game for whatever reason, then they will automatically change things.

This game is massive, and there will likely be things that don't work properly (bugs, etc) people grab ahold of a few things and make HUGE deals about them, when in actuality, they are rather minor. It is damn near IMPOSSIBLE to fully "balance' everything in this game, but people expect them to be able to balance everything to within .05% of something else, or they scream about balance. If someone has something they want, and they don't have it, they scream until they can have it. Like a bunch of children.

Then people say "If we don't say something about it, then it will never get changed". Sadly, MOST things people complain about, don't need 'fixed'. It is nothing more than an opinion on how they think the game should work.

Over all, if you or your raid group is sitting people because they don't have a certain legebdary, the problem is not with the system, it's with you. If you need that ONE or TWO people with a certain piece of gear to kill a boss, the problem is not with the system, the problem is your raid group sucks. You can easily kill these bosses without legendaries if the group works well together, and follows mechanics.

FFS people, stop bitching about everything in this game, the game is NOT in that bad a shape as you all make it out to be. Just because you don't like something, or the way it was designed, does not make it 'wrong' and need 'fixed'. The amount of bullshit whining because something 'is not fair' is getting out of hand. Life isn't fair, something in a video game are also not fair, get over it and stop this "I didn't get what I want, when I wanted it, so lets go complain" attitude.

I am one of those players...i was in the guild for one and a half year, and we had a pala coming 6 weeks before Legion released
He got the cloack, i got the bench.
He quited the game like a month ago for reasons i don't care, but i never took back my spot, not because i didn't desired to raid, but because i ddint wanted to raid with them.
The fault reside both on Blizzard and on the officers running the guild, but Blizzard caused it.
I am now on my last token left from WoD era, i am playing mostly Battlefield one and some single players game, casually logging in wow for 5 minutes a week....watching the timers ticking down and knowing i will not coming back.
And i am not alone, take a loot around your server, but really look at it....see how many players are from your server , not the CRZ ones.
So yes, i did got benched , demoted to "social" because i did not got the cloack (in time) and other one did. My guild wanted to progress fast and furious, to be able to recruit easier and easier.
Yes, the game is in a very bad shape.
Legion is the doom of it, mark my words.

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actually pretty much everything is viable now, people like to bitch and moan about certain specs being weak but you can pretty much raid in whatever spec you like

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This, people blow the legendaries problem way out of proportion

I guess you are referring to LFR and Normal raids, right? Where u can just go afk and have otehrs kill teh bosses for you, stand in aoe and not care and the likes?
Because no respectable guild will inv a surv hunter, a enh shaman, an warlock.....
You clearly never raided high end content when was actual, because if you would do you will know how ppl get to raid those raids the month they are released...
So pls, keep your opinions for your LFR forum dwelers

[Doffen]

I am one of those players...i was in the guild for one and a half year, and we had a pala coming 6 weeks before Legion released
He got the cloack, i got the bench.
He quited the game like a month ago for reasons i don't care, but i never took back my spot, not because i didn't desired to raid, but because i ddint wanted to raid with them.
The fault reside both on Blizzard and on the officers running the guild, but Blizzard caused it.
I am now on my last token left from WoD era, i am playing mostly Battlefield one and some single players game, casually logging in wow for 5 minutes a week....watching the timers ticking down and knowing i will not coming back.
And i am not alone, take a loot around your server, but really look at it....see how many players are from your server , not the CRZ ones.
So yes, i did got benched , demoted to "social" because i did not got the cloack (in time) and other one did. My guild wanted to progress fast and furious, to be able to recruit easier and easier.
Yes, the game is in a very bad shape.
Legion is the doom of it, mark my words.

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I guess you are referring to LFR and Normal raids, right? Where u can just go afk and have otehrs kill teh bosses for you, stand in aoe and not care and the likes?
Because no respectable guild will inv a surv hunter, a enh shaman, an warlock.....
You clearly never raided high end content when was actual, because if you would do you will know how ppl get to raid those raids the month they are released...
So pls, keep your opinions for your LFR forum dwelers

1. That guild you described are idiots.

2. What?? Enhancement Shamans and 2 of 3 warlock-speccs are average or higher on any mythic ToV-rankings atm.

[Deleted]

Because no respectable guild will inv a surv hunter, a enh shaman, an warlock.....

Either you've been with some shit guilds that are not respectable or you know little about what you're talking about.

[masterhorus8]

Either you've been with some shit guilds that are not respectable or you know little about what you're talking about.

Not mutually exclusive, especially since they're blaming Blizzard for their guild being shit.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Either you've been with some shit guilds that are not respectable or you know little about what you're talking about.

No kidding.