What dungeon length is more enjoyable for Mythic+?

[Alydael]

I would like a challenging dungeon that involved strategy and planning instead of just a "race against the clock." Which is what mythic plus basically is.

[D3athsting]

Length itself is not really a factor here. Two longest are Arcway and HoV, and for me HoV is the worst, Arcway around the best.

This

First times i hated arcway mostly because some pulls can be a pain (chaosbringers and those wandering banshees) and some trash abilities one-shot (arcane slicer), never did hov in m+, it's already crap in hc

[Deleted]

Anything below 15 minutes. It is already boring and repetitive, might as well end it asap.

[Wrecktangle]

This thread is about dungeon length.

And my response demonstrated that I think BRH length is fine (despite others not liking it), and provided some context as to what level I participate in that content.

I then talked about Arcway and HoV (the 2 most universally accepted "long" dungeons) and why they're generally bad (think fortified adds making HoV/Arc just take way too long, they're fine on normal mythic).

I then proceeded to discuss Maw explaining why I believe it is too short, and why I personally did not like it being so short.

[Deleted]

Enjoyable is the wrong word imo - Already in vanilla the quickest dungeon with most bosses (DM east wing for example) were the most enjoyable ones because you got most shards/h and had averagely easy mechanics to deal with (+ some rich thorium veins / book for quel serrar).

It repeated itself with heroic Mechanar and so on till we reach maw of souls.

[Sylvaeres]

Who the hell is taking 24 minutes to do maw?

[Deleted]

People will always vote for shorter dungeons. They would vote for only having one boss without trash, and people would still complain that the fight is too long and that they'd prefer it to be shorter (while at the same time others would comlain about the lack of content).

What i would actually like to see was more balance in the doneons Maw is too short and HoV is too long. They could balance it better by giving some extra time to the long ones so that it gets easier to 3-chest them...

[Tojara]

The long instances are some of the easiest to three chest though, Arcway being one of the easiest. You can make mistakes in both HoV/Arcway and still 3 chest them.

Now, I'm not saying Maw is hard by any stretch, but it certainly isn't the easiest to three chest. If you have some mistakes, or a wipe trying to do the big pulls you probably aren't going to three chest it. But if you're grinding AP and barely miss the three chest, it's still going to be just as fast as some of the other dungeons as far as AP efficiency goes.

What they should do is make it so instances like HoV/Arcway give an additional chest no matter what. Doesn't need to have 2 items in it, but it could have 1 item with an additional AP token in it. People would still probably avoid them, but it would make them a bit more attractive.

Personally I'm all over the place in what dungeons I like. Arcway is long but it's my favorite dungeon, but I detest HoV. BRH I actually like, but to do properly you need an invisibility potion, and that's likely the single biggest reason why it's avoided like the plague in pugs. I can't put my finger on it but I really don't like doing dungeons like Neltharion's Lair or Eye of Azshara, even though they are in the medium length category. Likely because there is a lot of empty space in EoA and Neltharion's Lair is the same, with the added bonus of having really annoying trash.

Basically love DHT/Maw/Court, and I like Arcway. Hate HoV and the rest are in the tolerable category.

[Halicia]

Of course people will always vote for shorter dungeons, keystone or otherwise... especially when the loot is the same regardless of time invested...

*but*

My major issue is that (especially from a healing perspective) even though I enjoy the concept of Mythic Keystones, and are pretty much what I wanted in Challenge modes originally...

The existence of a timer means that the pressure never lets off. Even on easy trash, you can always go faster, pull more, use your mana more efficiently.

So instead of Maw being 3 1-2 min boss fights broken up by some trash, its one continuous fight...

and judged on those merits, anything more then 10 minutes for a single bossfight wears me down pretty quickly. Especially when you have longer dungeons with more "options" for trash pulls and pacing. Its much easier to memorize the dance steps when there's fewer steps to be taken in the first place.

[Absintheminded]

OP has no idea what real world times are for these dungeons. Probably ran a few normal while leveling up.

[Greenmagoo]

For the most part they are all fine. I would prefer the lengths to being more consistent.

I then proceeded to discuss Maw explaining why I believe it is too short, and why I personally did not like it being so short.

As someone who enjoys running dungeons I also think Maw is too short. I am not a fan of Blizzard still encouraging Mechanar syndrome with such a wide range of dungeon length.

Would be nice to also not have the "hall" dungeon being the shitty one people dont want to do.

[Teoloniis]

For me, dungeons are meant to be quick. They are not meant to be even close to hour long endeavors. Leave that kind of timetable to normal raiding plus. That being said, I don't like to be able to run into a place and clear it so quickly that I feel as if I really haven't done anything of consequence. I think closer to 30 or 35 minutes is appropriate, though I can stand shorter instances if the content itself makes it interesting.

[donbooger]

Doesn't matter. Just please make them similar in length, getting sick of everyone wanting to do Maw over and over. Keep them within 5 mins of eachother.

[Deleted]

Compare a Mythic+ to a Raid.

In a raid you require an uptime concentration of approx. 4-12 minutes, based on which boss you fight. After the wipe/kill you can relax your body and mind until the next boss.

Now for a Mythic+ you require an uptime concentration matching the length of the mythic+ you run. It's natural that you portion your concentration a bit more than being at 110% at all times, however you must be on alert the entire dungeon, you can't just make a break. So a 10-20 minutes Maw of Souls/Dark Heart Thicket/Court of Stars run feels a lot better than a 30-40 minutes Halls of Valor/Arcway run. Some people can have a much calmer mind than others, so their feeling for joy is less influenced by the length of a dungeon.

I personally don't feel that a fast run is more enjoyable than a long run.

These are things that influence my sense of joy during a mythic+:
- How good does my party know the mechanics and pathways?
- How impatient are my partymembers? I hate people typing "gogo" all the time.
- How hard are the Affixes?
- How frustrating is the trash?
- How stressful is the timer?

Halls of Valor is usually an unenjoyable experience for me because of how annoying the trash from the beginning up to fenrir is. Arcway has a similar unenjoyable feeling for trash due to the randomly appearing ghost mistresses. However, both of those dungeons have a high fuckup tolerance, allowing you to wipe a couple of times and still making it in time. Maw of Souls with 2-3 wipes is making a timed finish much harder.

If I farm for Artifact Power, I go for shorter dungeons though cause it's more efficient, but has nothing to do with overall joy for me.

So yeah, concentration portioning is key.

[Deztru]

Long isn't bad if there's a lot of interesting stuff in there.

Unlike HoV which is just annoying as fuck trash

[ceall]

People like MoS most, as it's the most time efficient.
Personally I don't like it this much. Especially because you have to do almost all the trash after the 2nd boss, which artificially increases its length.

My favorite dungeons are DHT, arcway and VotW.

[Kalador]

I don't think length is a huge factor in the fun of the Dungeon, I'm personaly not a huge fan of MoS, it's efficient but not much else. I think long dungeon have a bad rep for M+ as the 2 long dungeon are in the hardest available. HoV is just very hard all over, 1st boss is a nightmare on tyranical, trash are very hard with the 2 sec AoE stuns and the hallway section is a shitfest. Nobody runs the damn things... Arcway is overall okay but the demon section is very hard, with fortified it's a run killer.

To short brings down the diversity of trash, MoS is a great exemple of that... in the end my favoirt are probably EoA, DhT, and Nelth

[melodramocracy]

Dungeon length is of no relevance to me, frankly they're all way too short with the exception of Kara. Affix combos are far more important.

[awbaker]

This would be fixed if the loot per chest was proportionate to the either 1) the number of bosses in a dungeon or 2) the length of the full timer.

More bosses/Longer timer = more loot.

[Jotaux]

In what world is a 24min maw a short run?
I prefer the 6-8min maw runs. Any dungeon that takes below 20min is fine.

24m is the mythic+ timer for Maw.