No healer dps balance at all?

[Deleted]

They're consistently the most or 2nd most represented healer in warcraft logs for every single tier.

Damn tied for second with resto shaman and behind resto druid, that representation bias.

Looks like they applied the same logic when balancing our dps.

Wow better bring 4 holy paladins for that 20k dps gain, oh wait disc.


Too bad when the facts don't align with your own beliefs.

[Deleted]

Ideally they'd just nerf the overperforming DPS in a decent way i.e. for HPala you could do something like "Holy Shock does X% less damage but always/has a Y% chance to give IoL when used on a enemy and doesn't crit". Would make for some interesting gameplay choices.

[Woop Woop]

I do shit for dps on my Holy Priest, but every second I save us on the timer is a second closer to hitting that extra chest. Plus, my stuns have saved lives before. So...yeah, that druid needs a reality check.

That druid was bad, simple as that.
To be good (any role) you should know when and where to use all of your abilities.
I've had so many runs (too many) where we missed 3 chests by a few seconds. I'm sure healer doing steady dmg through the dungeon would speed it up by a few seconds.
Depending on difficulty and fight, even holy priests are able to do decent dps (50-100k). I get really triggered if the healer does close to 0 dps overall

[Gorgodeus]

It might not be the most important topic but dps balance is totally non-existent.
Hpals are pulling 520k dps on H ursoc when they go full dps mode , while other healers are not even close. It might not be that important in raiding scenarios but it's definitely a thing in m+s when the healer can do so much dps on low pressure pulls. Hpals can also dish out the most dps in just a few GCDs.

Is it something blizzard should look into?

Shockadins are Holy specced and can put out insane damage, but their healing is gimped because they use different talents and stats than a normal pally healer.

[Emerald Archer]

It might not be the most important topic but dps balance is totally non-existent.
Hpals are pulling 520k dps on H ursoc when they go full dps mode , while other healers are not even close. It might not be that important in raiding scenarios but it's definitely a thing in m+s when the healer can do so much dps on low pressure pulls. Hpals can also dish out the most dps in just a few GCDs.

Is it something blizzard should look into?

While yes, healer dps is wonky. In content that matters (non-faceroll) pallys can't use their cds for dps, and don't pull those numbers.

And even with that very strong dps, Hpallys still aren't the best m+ healer. So it isn't game changing. They hold their spot with or without the dps.

[Dug]

If no other healers can come close to replicating that tradeoff it's a balance issue. Being able to turn into an effective dps for portions of a fight can be very valuable - you heal when healing is needed, dps when dps is needed, making the overall raid's performance more efficient.

But from what I'm reading here people are claiming the paladin needs to spec into it. And this "gimps" their healing. Is it really a balance issue then? It's not like they're going from insane dps to insane heals all in one fight.

[Nero Stormchester]

Top 10 for mythic is roughly -
paladins 165-440k
disc 141-380k
druids 150-300k
monk 114-250k
shaman 88-220k
holy priest 66-242k

Now remember this is top 10, to put this into perspective I get 95-98th percentile dps on every boss but ursoc and xavius (sac cheese ftw ) and I do anywhere between 50-150k dps to get those rankings.

The only way you're getting a parse like 520k is if you 1. have all/majority of your gear with haste on it and no mastery 2. wear dps trinkets 3. use dps potions 4. talent for dps 5. aren't forced to stop your rotation to heal

Yes it's easier to do damage as a paladin healer but to claim shit like 520k is normal is dumb lol.

This . So much this . Half the dps out there pull less than that, yet OP claims this is normal for HPall. Jeez , people love to exaggerate too much

[danieltang34]

I never said it's a gamebreaking issue, if anything, I actually said the opposite
Of course they are trading healings for damage but thats the same for other healers isn't it
And also they're more gcd efficient while having much more dps, that means they're trading less healings for more dps
Say, even if holy priests pop their wings and spend all GCDs on damage, they won't even come close
So I'm kinda interested to know if such advantage could be justified or it's just plain op

- - - Updated - - -

This . So much this . Half the dps out there pull less than that, yet OP claims this is normal for HPall. Jeez , people love to exaggerate too much

They're just outliers, but i don't think it's reasonable for a healing spec to be capable of doing so much damage in the first place

[fangless]

No paladin healer is doing 500k for an entire raid fight. Maybe for 20 seconds (in which case, with old war potion, it's more like 700k), but the rest of the 2-3 mins is just awkward pillow talk after blowing your load.

[danieltang34]

Shockadins are Holy specced and can put out insane damage, but their healing is gimped because they use different talents and stats than a normal pally healer.

The top parses of other healers are using full dps talents and gears as well, that reason doesn't seem to justify the power difference

[TEHPALLYTANK]

The top parses of other healers are using full dps talents and gears as well, that reason doesn't seem to justify the power difference

Right, the power difference of using a spec just for a shits-and-giggles parse. This is like complaining about one spec being better at soloing WoD raids than others, it is just plain silly.

[RohanV]

The easiest fix would be to nerf our artifact. We get like 1% bonus damage for each point up to 34. Drop that to 0.5% per point, and Holy Pallies should be good, while not significantly hurting leveling or new max-levels.

A little sad, because doing dailies as Holy is actually fun this expac.

[danieltang34]

Right, the power difference of using a spec just for a shits-and-giggles parse. This is like complaining about one spec being better at soloing WoD raids than others, it is just plain silly.

and pallys are still doing way more damage than other healers in proper specs and talents

[TEHPALLYTANK]

and pallys are still doing way more damage than other healers in proper specs and talents

If we can afford to use Holy Shock for damage then the content likely is already trivial, which was the point you somehow managed to miss.

[Teri]

Instead of nerfing paladin, could buff the others, if pvp is a problem, use the template system.

[danieltang34]

If we can afford to use Holy Shock for damage then the content likely is already trivial, which was the point you somehow managed to miss.

So basically you're saying as long as its not being abused for raid progression, then its not an issue at all?
I for one do not agree with that.

[anon5123]

lol so in that, you are saying that they are piss when not optimal.

"Best when they have support" does not equate to "terrible without support"

Strawman harder, m8

but really fucking horrible to play.

rip disc - 3.0 - 7.0

Because bubblespam was so fun and interesting right

right

[Teri]

So basically you're saying as long as its not being abused for raid progression, then its not an issue at all?
I for one do not agree with that.

What is the real issue with high burst dps anyway? World pvp of any kind does not count.

In instanced pvp we have templates.

On world quest pvp it might be more dps then usual due to our http://www.wowhead.com/spell=216331/avenging-crusader honor 46 talent.

[zeropeorth]

Why are you so obsessed with their niche burst damage? Let them have their fun in farm content.

[Saverem]

It might not be the most important topic but dps balance is totally non-existent.
Hpals are pulling 520k dps on H ursoc when they go full dps mode , while other healers are not even close. It might not be that important in raiding scenarios but it's definitely a thing in m+s when the healer can do so much dps on low pressure pulls. Hpals can also dish out the most dps in just a few GCDs.

Is it something blizzard should look into?

Paladins are currently Blizzard's favorite right now. All 3 of their specs are not only viable, but in the top 3 of their respective roles. HPallies are top 3 in healers for PvP and PvE, Rets are at the top of the melee DPS in raids and Prot tanks are ranked second behind G Dru in 7.1.5 after the Prot War nerfs and are still number one in tank damage.

Basically ALL 3 Paladin specs are number 1 in damage in their roles as well.


Paladins are sitting pretty right now. If you want a guaranteed raid spot without getting sat out, go Paladin.