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  1. #81
    Stood in the Fire Synthium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwantmymomo View Post
    Baseline rofl, Keep your Momentum, Just don't complain if other ways of playing are equal or better.
    Take a deep breath. Ok good, now read through thread. Ok good, see how dumb you look?
    Burn it. BURN IT!

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Synthium View Post
    In my honest opinion, if you don't like Momentum playstyle, just pick a rogue, a feral druid or an enhancement shaman. Momentum is what gives the class a very unique flavor and your rotation revolving around you positioning yourself properly, activating it and then dumping fury is what this game needs. Flavor and unique playstyle among classes/specs. Momentum should be baseline in my opinion and ofc, baseline ability damage adjusted accordingly. If you just take Nemesis as a talent, you're basically off standing and hitting.
    I'm torn. I really enjoy the "unique playstyle" that Momentum brings, but I also really really dislike that our dmg is tied to our mobility. Just like monk in WoD where roll was tied to torpedo as a talent choice.

    I'd like to see blizzard explore alternatives that might maintain a unique playstyle while not forcing nearly all of our mobility into our dps rotation.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rootkitt View Post
    I'm torn. I really enjoy the "unique playstyle" that Momentum brings, but I also really really dislike that our dmg is tied to our mobility. Just like monk in WoD where roll was tied to torpedo as a talent choice.
    It's not parallel to WoD monks, because damage being tied to movement is not a talent choice; it's an innate feature of the class. This bears repeating - you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Khiyone View Post
    It's not parallel to WoD monks, because damage being tied to movement is not a talent choice; it's an innate feature of the class. This bears repeating - you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.
    Not for long.

  5. #85
    Bloodsail Admiral Pigglix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sajin001 View Post
    Not for long.
    Wrong, on 7.1.5 , like Khiyone said, you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.

    You will only stop doing that if blizz for some stupid reason or knee jerk reaction or both, nerf fel rush to a useless point or remove it dmg component.

  6. #86
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    Let's say you do not have enough fury to use chaos strike and your felblade is on CD. What do you use to fill up the gcd? Throw glaive or fel rush, both without talent.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Nihal View Post
    Wrong, on 7.1.5 , like Khiyone said, you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.

    You will only stop doing that if blizz for some stupid reason or knee jerk reaction or both, nerf fel rush to a useless point or remove it dmg component.
    This might be a dumb question, just trying to be a better DH. Why not just use demon's bite to gain more fury?
    Last edited by geetarkev; 2017-01-03 at 08:06 AM.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by geetarkev View Post
    This might be a dumb question, just trying to be a better DH. Why not just use demon's bite to gain more fury?
    Because both FR and TG do more dmg and and its aoe (in PvP TG also range + slow which is amazing), in addition FR also builds fury, basically it's simply a dps gain

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fooicus View Post
    Inflammatory (adjective): (especially of speech or writing) arousing or intended to arouse angry or violent feelings. To be honest your second post (quoted above) is probably more inflammatory than your previous one.

    I agree that momentum sets Havoc apart from other melee DPS, I main as Vengeance BUT love it when I get a chance to bring out my Havoc spec because I get to dart around like a right lunatic . However, I do not think that people who don't want that playstyle should pick another class - clearly blizz did not design the class with this intent either, otherwise momentum would have been baseline, not a talent.

    Additionally you accuse the person of lying. However, you do not know if he tried the class out during some Beta testing before making the decision to switch, if he made the decision based upon some third party reviews of the new class or if he made the decision to switch mains during this expansion. This would actually be a more accurate definition of broken logic than that which you infer upon the person you are pointing the finger at.
    But the person actually LIED. Momentum was a lvl 106 talent ever since the beta LOL, he claimed using momentum since lvl 98.

  10. #90
    Stood in the Fire Synthium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geetarkev View Post
    This might be a dumb question, just trying to be a better DH. Why not just use demon's bite to gain more fury?
    Well mostly because demon's bite is considered a dps loss because ever since demon blades were reworked, you could actually gain fury even while being on gcd, even when actually spending fury. So for example, you chaos strike, and while the animation lasts, your character also autoattacks and gains 12 fury while actually spending it. It results in an increased net gain of fury, as well as not having your builder locked behind gcd.
    Burn it. BURN IT!

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Synthium View Post
    First of all, you couldn't use Momentum since level 98 since it's a level 106 talent.
    Quote Originally Posted by kayusa View Post
    But the person actually LIED. Momentum was a lvl 106 talent ever since the beta LOL, he claimed using momentum since lvl 98.
    Haha, you're quite right. The whole levelling process whizzed by and I have to say I didn't keep track of levels vs talent tiers. But yes, tier 5 talents were unlocked at 106 not 98. This makes a grand difference of me playing with momentum (on live, yes I played the beta) for ~24 hours so... we'll call it 124 days rather than 125 days?


    Quote Originally Posted by Synthium View Post
    Third of all, if you know there is a dangerous mechanic incoming (you know, by looking at dbm) and you feel like you have to save a charge of FR in order not to kill your raid members, then you should just do what everyone else does: Use a few chaos strikes without Momentum (gasp!) and then Fel Rush the fuck away when it targets you (if it does).
    You know full well that there are "dangerous" mechanics which come in too frequently during most fights so that you can't keep FR available for them all. P1 Odyn is a good example, both adds have mechanics which may necessitate movement, as well as the rune mechanic from Odyn himself. It's perfectly doable without FR/VR being available, but again, if I wanted to do that I would have just rolled a Frost DK (well no, I would have remained a mage and Shimmered up and down the place, but you get the idea).

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthium View Post
    Look man, I get it. You don't like using it, and would much prefer if you could play a static style.
    I'm trying to explain that one of the reasons I love the class is the mobility, but that I don't think it should be tied to our dps, and you're telling me I love a static playstyle I think there have been some really toxic discussions on this forum about momentum and I don't want to slip into one of those, to be honest. Suffice to say, we disagree, although we probably will both take momentum again in 7.1.5 in a lot of situations in and outside of raids.

    Quote Originally Posted by Khiyone View Post
    It's not parallel to WoD monks, because damage being tied to movement is not a talent choice; it's an innate feature of the class. This bears repeating - you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.
    I don't think that keeping one charge of FR available throughout the fight until the last few seconds will impact negatively on anyone's DPS if they aren't running Fel Mastery or Momentum.

  12. #92
    Stood in the Fire Synthium's Avatar
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    Well you do realize your argument kinda works both ways right? I mean, you say that if you wanted something that can't dash, you would've picked a Frost DK. I can also say (and did say multiple times here) if I wanted something that deals damage in the same kind of way as usual, I would have gone with a rogue. The playstyle is, without denying, something very unique. Much like how my main throughout WoD and Mists was my warlock simply because of how it had 3 completely different specs from one another, used different resources for each one of them, and required you to really LEARN how to play each and every one of them. I rerolled away from warlock because of streamlining, removal of unique resource and having to level all 3 weapons because every spec can do only one thing while not being anywhere near decent on something else.
    Burn it. BURN IT!

  13. #93
    Welp I for one am glad that 3 different builds are going to be potentially viable in 7.1.5, even if not all are optimal

  14. #94
    Bloodsail Admiral Pigglix's Avatar
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    Live build on 7.1.5 simm for st is giving me 389k dps

    ptr st build is giving me almost 450k dps.

    So no lol, there's no such thing like "3 different builds going to be potentially viable in 7.1.5"

    The live build is dead for st.

    Also, the live build had its downtime increased from 25% to 34% on 7.1.5, gg blizz.
    Last edited by Pigglix; 2017-01-03 at 06:45 PM.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nihal View Post
    Live build on 7.1.5 simm for st is giving me 389k dps

    ptr st build is giving me almost 450k dps.

    So no lol, there's no such thing like "3 different builds going to be potentially viable in 7.1.5"

    The live build is dead for st.

    Also, the live build had its downtime increased from 25% to 34% on 7.1.5, gg blizz.
    If you were to take the time to read through this whole thread, along with the demonic eyebeam thread, you would find that none of the three viable builds being referenced are the live build, but one of them does use momentum.
    Last edited by Chevrato; 2017-01-03 at 07:07 PM.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Nihal View Post
    Live build on 7.1.5 simm for st is giving me 389k dps

    ptr st build is giving me almost 450k dps.

    So no lol, there's no such thing like "3 different builds going to be potentially viable in 7.1.5"

    The live build is dead for st.

    Also, the live build had its downtime increased from 25% to 34% on 7.1.5, gg blizz.
    I didn't say anything about the live build. but for 7.1.5 there are 3 builds

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleSector View Post
    I don't think that keeping one charge of FR available throughout the fight until the last few seconds will impact negatively on anyone's DPS if they aren't running Fel Mastery or Momentum.
    Doing this isn't a DPS loss even with Momentum/FM*. And in order to prevent overcapping, you need to Fel Rush anyways.

    *Of course, with the exception of meta - it's difficult to get almost full Momentum uptime during meta while holding a FR charge.
    Last edited by Saiyendra; 2017-01-04 at 12:34 AM.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synthium View Post
    Take a deep breath. Ok good, now read through thread. Ok good, see how dumb you look?
    Take a deep breath and hold for 10 min, now don't we all feel better?

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Khiyone View Post
    It's not parallel to WoD monks, because damage being tied to movement is not a talent choice; it's an innate feature of the class. This bears repeating - you will need to Fel Rush on CD even without Fel Mastery or Momentum.
    That's fair, because it leaves VR for movement. My point is that making ALL our movement part of dps rotation is not ideal to some people (me included), and I do find it important to keep the appeal of movement within the rotation. I just think that other options or perspectives could make a better balance between the two.

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