Guardian dead in 7.1.5

[Deleted]

What is it that you don't "get" OP?

Yes we were incredibly broken, best tank by a mile. Nerfs were justified.

[CenariusTheForestLord]

Cleary u guys have 0 Idea about Druid.... "will get u killed in 0.1 sec" wtf Bear Form -> Blink = Far Away -> Bear Form -> Mobs still not in your Range... and before u Kids whine that it wouldn work on 15 and used it on 17 last Time we had Necrotic... if some of u aint actualy trolling and beeing serious u guys probaly need like 20sec to switch forms backf rom cat to bear

You could also take guttural roars and speed up your entire team in between pulls, or roar to get away from a pack if you need to. Blink removes all your ironfur stacks and all your rage. No reason to blink out of a group when you can just thrash and run out, or thrash roar and run out.

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Thats what i meant cant be like "with nighthold gear etc it will be top tier again" not anyone does raid.. i raided since classic since legion i only do m+ managed to get 892 ilvl and up to +19 but i cant rely on nighthold gear or 4set boni since i wont raid... so its kinda stupid to build around that same stupid as nerfing/buffing skills around pvp

Have fun in LFR.

[avoidconfusion]

The guy clearly said +15. And like I said, If you use displacer, you are playing wrong. Going cat form and then blinking will get you killed in +15

Dude.... stop.... just stop.

[roi]

Thats what i meant cant be like "with nighthold gear etc it will be top tier again" not anyone does raid.. i raided since classic since legion i only do m+ managed to get 892 ilvl and up to +19 but i cant rely on nighthold gear or 4set boni since i wont raid... so its kinda stupid to build around that same stupid as nerfing/buffing skills around pvp

Just go for blood frenzy, huge rage gain especially in aoe situations (which is where before and after the patch and with and without t19 we'd have low rage as thrash swipe swipe doesn't regenerate the rage thrash gore mangle gg moonfire does). I don't raid mythic either, but pugging heroic shouldn't be very hard if you really want t19.

[teddabear]

I mentioned this in another thread (I think), but balancing around gear that you may or may not get is rather silly. I already have 54 traits in my weapon, and I know I'll get the 4-set bonus... but what about all the other bears? Just because I raid doesn't mean I should expect everyone else to need to raid in order to perform well, especially with mythic+ being the first viable alternative end-game method of gearing up in a long time. Unless tier gear is going to be dropping in mythic+ chests (or PvP caches for that matter), a class/spec shouldn't be balanced around optional content gear with the direction the game is heading now. Further down the expansion, it'll cause even more problems as new gear and tier sets come out.

Agree 100%. Overtuned set bonuses are poor design. You are gimped until you get them and it makes the next tier a real pain.

[Special-K]

You could also take guttural roars and speed up your entire team in between pulls, or roar to get away from a pack if you need to. Blink removes all your ironfur stacks and all your rage. No reason to blink out of a group when you can just thrash and run out, or thrash roar and run out.

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Have fun in LFR.

actualy not even worth to reply to you since u have no diea what ur talking about.... u cant "outrun" most mobs with shout or else since there movement speed will be the same as yours and they will just following u same speed while hitting u and since there many mobs u cant stun/desorientate aswell that was by far the easiest option to get ride of stacks and fucking fur since it holds forever ofc refresh fur and than run guess ur kinda retarded right? if ur plan is to use cooldown and run while their up gj on that and if u got a sec left on fur and u blink who cares? not much ressources wasted.. pretty sure your one of thoose guys who does his +12 weekly and needs like 2 hours to do it

[Deleted]

I'm sorry guys, but saying we shouldn't be balanced around set bonus doesn't work. Historically everyone has always been balanced around having the set bonus. Its impossible to balance everyone at all gear levels at all times, so they have to pick something to balance around. As such, it makes sense to balance around the situation where balance most matters.

In PvP that is 3v3s (thats why they never balance for 2v2, and balance in BGs is wack). In PvE that is raids. Tier sets come from raids, and thus balance around tier sets. If you are a player that doesn't raid, and has no want or need to raid, then your not hitting the points in game play where balance is a big enough issue for it to matter, the difference in specs is close enough (especially for tanks) that it doesn't matter if you're playing a spec that is 10% less effective.

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actualy not even worth to reply to you since u have no diea what ur talking about.... u cant "outrun" most mobs with shout or else since there movement speed will be the same as yours

I'm sorry, what? You passively slow all mobs by 50% with Bloody Paws, so yeah you can easily, easily kite mobs wth roar. And why would their movespeed match yours?

and they will just following u same speed while hitting u and since there many mobs u cant stun/desorientate aswell that was by far the easiest option to get ride of stacks

Find me a mob that is both fast (ie you can't kite it) AND can't be stunned, that isn't a boss? I can't think of any, I might be wrong though. Bosses have inbuilt periods of time where you can reset your stacks (literally every single boss has one).

if ur plan is to use cooldown and run while their up gj on that and if u got a sec left on fur and u blink who cares? not much ressources wasted.. pretty sure your one of thoose guys who does his +12 weekly and needs like 2 hours to do it

I'm really confused what you're trying to say here? If they are running away (ie kiting) they shouldn't need to use a cooldown, at least in any kiting situation that displacer beast would work in (ie no casters). Seems you are just resorting to insults to backup a theory which you can't actually fully justify.

[ydraw]

I have a dislike of that kind of design, though. Reducing Guardian effectiveness due to general gear scaling, sure. Reducing Guardian effectiveness because they may get optional specific gear, not so much. I'd rather they have changed the tier set bonus, because I'm fairly certain their power is part of the reason for some of these changes. Honestly feel bad for the not-so-geared bears or the newly leveled bears.

Not to mention bears who primarily do M+ and thus will never have tier. Like many people's alts.

[Exigent]

Raiding > Dungeons.

That has been the general rule of thumb since the game was released and while the M+ grind has certainly watered down the concept this expansion, I'm looking forward to actually getting upgrades from raiding again. If you're capable of running +19 content then it sounds like a slight nerf to your effectiveness won't stop you from continuing that grind.. to what end, who knows, but that's your prerogative.

[Deleted]

Nerf to the ground. Everything nerfed to the ground. Why so? We were so op? Wtf, i dont get it

Yes we were. Christ.

We could perform the same as other tanks 5-10iL higher than us. The nerf was justified. I have noticed the change but am not struggling at all, I take a bit more damage and have to actually (gosh!) think about whether or not to weave a few mauls in instead of just spam spam spam because it doesn't matter.

[CenariusTheForestLord]

I'm sorry, what? You passively slow all mobs by 50% with Bloody Paws, so yeah you can easily, easily kite mobs wth roar. And why would their movespeed match yours?



Find me a mob that is both fast (ie you can't kite it) AND can't be stunned, that isn't a boss? I can't think of any, I might be wrong though. Bosses have inbuilt periods of time where you can reset your stacks (literally every single boss has one).



I'm really confused what you're trying to say here? If they are running away (ie kiting) they shouldn't need to use a cooldown, at least in any kiting situation that displacer beast would work in (ie no casters). Seems you are just resorting to insults to backup a theory which you can't actually fully justify.

Thank you.

[Wild]

Well the dmg incoming might still be somewhat ok, but rage generation is noticeable af. I still dont like the changes

[mmouser]

While our survivability went down, our DPS went up. This is especially useful in mythic+ and now we have options between pulverize and rend/tear.

As far as necrotic, just rotate your weapon and stampeding roar. With your weapon, you should be able to live through 30+ stacks. Without, just roar and go.

[Daan]

Feral is dead, not Guardian.

[CenariusTheForestLord]

Well the dmg incoming might still be somewhat ok, but rage generation is noticeable af. I still dont like the changes

Try and get the tier set asap. If you're not a raider, run as much LFR as you can. It'll help you loads in M+. If you're neither a M+ player or a raider, there's no need to be fussed about rage gen

[CitizenWoot]

So now we're RNG dependent on 4 pieces, with one shot per week at them? That's not balance....

[dcc626]

So now we're RNG dependent on 4 pieces, with one shot per week at them? That's not balance....

actually, 4 shots per week if you run all the difficulties tier is good and going to be helpful, but ive felt pretty good after the patch regardless. i do take more damage, but rage feels ok (for me)

[beatmyface]

Tier drops from every difficulty and also from weekly cache. I literally noticed zero survivability issues Tuesday tanking 9/10 mythic bosses. Rage generation you could notice a little bit, but not enough to bitch about.

If you have survivability issues run the Pulverize build. If you don't stick with the rend and tear build for maximum DPS.

Tier pieces are going to be great and make QoL better, but not ground breaking. As we normally do, we will scale well with more gear.

[Deleted]

i have read your posts and here is the solution. i am an experienced top 100 guardian druid and have had no issues with mythic ToV/EN or +15 mythics.

the problem here is how you are all playing. the icy veins guide is a good starter for the new guardian druid but you need to know what is happening mechanics wise in dungeons/raids.

you also need to have knowledge of tanking and what it is all about , it is not enough to know a rotation off by heart and think it will see you through.

[Exigent]

Tier drops from every difficulty and also from weekly cache.

If Blizzard follows the same pattern as last expansion, then the NH raid cache will contain everything except tier (and weapons, which don't exist anyway).