7.1.5 is abysmal

[Mamut]

I see 700k+ crits with blade dance but for some reason I see this as last hit on my floating combat text. Not sure if lag or intended.

[Oneglaive]

I see 700k+ crits with blade dance but for some reason I see this as last hit on my floating combat text. Not sure if lag or intended.

I'm seeing the same behavior with Mikes Scrolling Battle Text. Seems like a bug.

[Deleted]

Ah could be it then, was wondering if I was reading the tooltip wrong or was it somehow changed in the last second.

[Deix-EU]

Doing good numbers and having a good time are two completely different things. His opinion is a very valid opinion. I'm sustaining 580k single target, am I having a good time doing it, no.

Of course but not at the same time. Saying it's less fun yeah, saying DH is shit isn't a valid opinion.

[Zyky]

Of course but not at the same time. Saying it's less fun yeah, saying DH is shit isn't a valid opinion.

The guys exact words were:

"Nemesis isn't an option, it dosn't make fun.
Demonbite is a pain in the ass.
The energy reg is sooo horrible (even with ring).
Demonic sucks.
"

The only thing he said that sucks is Demonic, which is a true statement. It fucking blows compared to the other talents in the row. Nemesis not fun, check. Demon Bite being a pain, check. Energy regen is horrible, check.

I complete agree with everything he's said except that I'm always going to play the top talents, even if I don't enjoy the playstyle. I do also agree and strongly push that this is indeed a completely garbage patch.

[tyfavre04]

Use Felblade and Nemesis. You'll be fine.

In raids. Not in M+.

[ZaraniaWoW]

I mean, I'm simming at 50 APM (around 8.6% wait time). That's not "totally fury starved".

[Moarbacon]

This patch is amazing. Demon blades feels subpar now and demon's bite resets felblade so much I never feel fury starved. Momentum and nemesis are both situationally viable, demonic is situationally viable, UP feels broken in mythic+ since you can basically reset the stun almost every pull.

I see a lot of people arguing to still use demon blades, and I'm sorry but I'm just not seeing it. They gutted it and offered too good an incentive to use demon's bite.

Demon hunter is far stronger than before. Momentum is still viable but not mandatory. If you don't think it's fun then they just made alts more accessible. Personally, I'm loving it.

[Vanyali]

In raids. Not in M+.

I pushed to a 15 with nemesis + felblade in a M+ last night.

it's fine.


As for demonic cries, demonic is also really fine in M+.

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This patch is amazing. Demon blades feels subpar now and demon's bite resets felblade so much I never feel fury starved. Momentum and nemesis are both situationally viable, demonic is situationally viable, UP feels broken in mythic+ since you can basically reset the stun almost every pull.

I see a lot of people arguing to still use demon blades, and I'm sorry but I'm just not seeing it. They gutted it and offered too good an incentive to use demon's bite.

Demon hunter is far stronger than before. Momentum is still viable but not mandatory. If you don't think it's fun then they just made alts more accessible. Personally, I'm loving it.

From the looks of it, the Fblade 50% chance is also on dblades, which is what makes it superior; dblades is off the GCD, allowing you to maximize the fury gains given that pooling isn't particularly useful.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

"7.1.5 is abysmal"

Well that's a good thing, if you're a DH, right? I mean, the abyss is our perfect hangout! First round's on me, and all that.

[Moarbacon]

I pushed to a 15 with nemesis + felblade in a M+ last night.

it's fine.


As for demonic cries, demonic is also really fine in M+.

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From the looks of it, the Fblade 50% chance is also on dblades, which is what makes it superior; dblades is off the GCD, allowing you to maximize the fury gains given that pooling isn't particularly useful.

Possibly. IF that's true maybe dblades isn't off the table. Question is how much bearing does having the legendary ring or not have on that. Haven't tested it yet since the 60% proc rate seemed unappealing but I'll give it a go.

[Raiju]

It works alright with dblades. Imo it feels awful and dare I say it - like an incomplete spec- but it works for numbers. 'woo buffs'

[Azaal]

If the shitty talent that is momentum got baked into DH's, far less people would even touch it.

You're that scrubby DH that post on all forums about how momentum is terrible and despise using fel rush in your rotation, so I guess this mindless iteration of DH must be you're favorite

[chooi]

You're that scrubby DH that post on all forums about how momentum is terrible and despise using fel rush in your rotation, so I guess this mindless iteration of DH must be you're favorite

It won't stay forever this way, my friend. Let them have their minute of glory. Just unsub and wait until they #MakeHavocMomentumAgain - don't forget to flood the official forums, write ingame suggestions and tweet the devs.

I've played Havoc from Beta to now and this is the worst cancerous spec I had to deal with, ever.

[Talonwraith]

DH are insane, you're just doing it wrong.

Listen to -youswas

I feel like DH is more fun to play now. You aren't stuck taking the same talents, though there are clear winners to which are best.

He's 100% wrong (meaning youswas) and Ill explain why.

He's equating damage with overall satisfaction or rewarding playstyle. The post isn't about poor damage. it doesn't mention damage. The damage is fine. But the op is talking about satisfaction of play. I also feel the playstyle is not nearly as satisfying or rewarding as Momentum. In comparison, it's very boring for me.

[Absintheminded]

Well I like having options and I think Demonic is fun so.... best patch ever?

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I actually love this patch! I was so frustrated because of what I saw 7.1.5. would bring because I LOVE the Momentum build, but after actually playing it with my DH, I LOVE it! Though to be honest, I just simply can't imagine it without Demon Blades! I mean, I keep spamming Chaos Strike, Felblade and Blade Dance, I simply have no opening for anything else! Also, is it right to use First Blood? I'm not really sure if I see that 600+K strike on ST?

I'm using first blood with the Demonic EB build and Blade Dance is my highest damaging ability.

[Talonwraith]

So far it feels like the devs substituted engaging gameplay for good numbers. I want to be fair to people that like a different playstyle than I do. I'm fine with nemesis being viable, but it should never outplay the build that is more challenging. Momentum should never fall below Nemesis for this reason. Might as well give out a participation award for rolling a Demon Hunter...

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our DH is #1 on every fight - you're using the wrong talents i think

edit: just checked your logs - yeah you're definitely using the wrong talents. :/

You're equating damage with engaging gameplay. That isn't the point of the post and hasn't even been mentioned. Therefore your point is moot.

[Yuqii]

As always, it comes down to: do you want to pick the "mathematically best" dps option or pick what you enjoy playing. Heaps of DHs hated when Momentum was mandatory and now it's flipped the other way. One thing I would ask to those upset about not getting to play Momentum is: Were you using Blur off CD to max out the bonus Fel Rushes? Because as far as I understand, that's the only reason it's no longer the "go to" in that row because of the Demonic Speed rework. So if you weren't using Blur but still playing Momentum, you can still do that now and be the same as you were before.

If you really can't stand the fury starvation windows that we're getting at the moment, run 132 instead of 222. My understanding is that they're simming very close to each other anyway (~30k difference)

[Talonwraith]

As always, it comes down to: do you want to pick the "mathematically best" dps option or pick what you enjoy playing. Heaps of DHs hated when Momentum was mandatory and now it's flipped the other way. One thing I would ask to those upset about not getting to play Momentum is: Were you using Blur off CD to max out the bonus Fel Rushes? Because as far as I understand, that's the only reason it's no longer the "go to" in that row because of the Demonic Speed rework. So if you weren't using Blur but still playing Momentum, you can still do that now and be the same as you were before.

If you really can't stand the fury starvation windows that we're getting at the moment, run 132 instead of 222. My understanding is that they're simming very close to each other anyway (~30k difference)

I think that's a fair statement..although my individual numbers were simming a more substantial difference to stick with momentum. I suppose I just assumed everyone was using blur to reset fel rushes...do people actually not do that?

Also, I'm not currently playing at a true progression level atm, but having done so in the past, old habits are hard to break. It's very difficult to not use the most optimal build unless the difference is truly insignificant. At present, I'd say it's fairly significant (I'm simming 40k minimum difference). But it goes well beyond damage. Fury generation took a major hit. All of this is leading to some understandable frustration for people that loved the class in it's previous incarnation.

[Raiju]

Yes, pretty much anyone complaining on a forum is also someone who understand about blur resetting FR charges. Sure, they're a minority of players in the grand scheme of things but is there any evidence that whether momentum is better or not affects those casuals (who don't do organized raiding, don't go to forums, to some extent don't use any out of game resources). It's a battle of minorities, but it seems counter to blizzards word that the clearly most challenging aspect of demon hunter available via talents is no longer particularly competitive in... well nearly any real raid environment.