[Balance] Legion Discussion

[Skyepic]

Same gear setup, 2 permanent targets:

Claw is .7% less dps than Satyr.
Soldier is within margin of error (.49%) of each sim at .45% less dps than Satyr.

For all of these, talent set up has been Starlord, INC, BotA:E, Nature's Balance.

The most interesting result is that at two targets (within range of starfall) I got the following gains from switching to a starfall based rotation*. Compared to a baseline single target build of Starlord, INC, BotA:E, NB, if we switch to a baseline build of FoN, Shooting Stars, Stellar Drift we get the following results:

Soul of the Forest: 13% increase in total damage done compared to just multi-dotting, starsurge into priority target.
Incarnation: 11% increase in total damage done compared to just multidotting, starsurge into priority target.
Stellar Flare: 12.5% increase in total damage done compared to just multidotting, starsurge into priority target.

The SotF buff is very strong combined with Stellar Drift (and the buffs to FoN are really nice to offset loss of Starlord). We get so much more D/AP out of starfall with it costing the same as SS.

In really high target count situations with Shooting Stars giving a lot of AP you'll even have AP to pump starsurges into priority targets while keeping up starfall and dots.

*Starfall Rotation: spends all AP on starfall (Stellar Flare if talented), keeping dots up, and only spamming wrath and moons and using FoN on CD.

That's kind of disappointing, i was hoping Claw would pull ahead at 2+ targets as i don't think Satyr benefits from additional targets.


Also for the SotF/SD build you tested:

In really high target count situations with Shooting Stars giving a lot of AP you'll even have AP to pump starsurges into priority targets while keeping up starfall and dots.

Is this taking into consideration Starfalls can stack (not the empowered buff, but the actual damage) i believe up to 3 times. So are you saying you can stack 3 starfalls and THEN have AP left over to Starsurge? Or do you mean just keeping 1 starfall at 100% uptime and starsurging with the leftover?

[Myztikrice]

I think he means the latter. With Stellar Drift and Echoing Stars I'm thinking it's better to put all excess AP into Starfalls and forget about Starsurge (in aoe situations)

[Polarthief]

So with ED, I pretty much broke even overall. Feelsbadman.

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I think he means the latter. With Stellar Drift and Echoing Stars I'm thinking it's better to put all excess AP into Starfalls and forget about Starsurge (in aoe situations)

The fact that you even mentioned "Echoing Stars" is pretty laughable. Just saying.

[Myztikrice]

So with ED, I pretty much broke even overall. Feelsbadman.

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The fact that you even mentioned "Echoing Stars" is pretty laughable. Just saying.

I like the new sustained AoE dps. 3 target dummies in Orgrimmar:

It's almost like a new patch was released.

[Deleted]

The fact that you even mentioned "Echoing Stars" is pretty laughable. Just saying.

LUL

Just saying.

[thedeisel]

I think he means the latter. With Stellar Drift and Echoing Stars I'm thinking it's better to put all excess AP into Starfalls and forget about Starsurge (in aoe situations)

Yeah, just depends on the situation.
Lots of adds = keep pouring AP into Starfall.
3-4 targets though with one much more important than the rest you should have enough AP to keep pumping Starsurges out while maintaining Starfall.

Fwiw when I was measuring how much my dps went up from:

pure single target (Starlord, Inc, BotA, NB)

to

two target cleave with Starfall strategy (FoN, SotF, Shooting Stars, Stellar Drift)

The increase was about 40%. I don't know how that stacks up compared to how much specs get out of their cleave but it seems better than our current situation.

[Kyanion]

I like the new sustained AoE dps. 3 target dummies in Orgrimmar:

Yeah tried running the WoE/SotF/Shooting Stars/SD combo and I was hovering around 900k-1mil with CA up. I wonder how strong the impact of mastery is because you did better numbers in a few areas than I did.

[Hellshout]

Did a M+7 with FoN, SotF, SS and SD. WOW! The difference between now and back then is huge. 1 mill dps very fast. While it's not instant, you can make 40 AsP pretty fast, so we can call it burstish, not burst AoE, but still. Thing is, idk about other classes, but we sacrifice huge ST for this AoE. Still not perfect, but better for M+. In raids, I guess it's gonna be ST choice, unless fighting 2-3 targets at once.

Btw, how did they increase mastery %? I read smth about 12%, but I got from 51% to 56% only. I know the rating/% got increased. What did you guys get?

[Lahis]

I like the new sustained AoE dps. 3 target dummies in Orgrimmar:

inb4 you were cleaving the lvl 85 dummies.

[Zan15]

inb4 you were cleaving the lvl 85 dummies.

i'd like to know what fight is a 5 minute cleave :P

[Adramelch]

So with ED, I pretty much broke even overall. Feelsbadman.

No way you broke even. Like I did 100k more dps on Ursoc just by swapping to a more mastery heavy build (similar experience on other bosses too). Ed+Prydaz equipped. 2.38 kill instead of ~3 min though and rng played a small part but that doesn't account for 100k dps difference (compared to my parses pre-7.1.5.

[Roxtar]

does SimCraft actually deliver somewhat accurate results with ED+IFE?

[MV Kaa]

I dont think it does ED rotation

[wing5wong]

So with ED, I pretty much broke even overall. Feelsbadman.

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The fact that you even mentioned "Echoing Stars" is pretty laughable. Just saying.

echoing stars coming in at about 5% total damage for +9-12s so far with a SS/SotF/SD build. not really that awful, right? starfall was 21%

[Bugg]

Odyn heroic: should I take Stellar Flare?

[MV Kaa]

Odyn heroic: should I take Stellar Flare?

No. Incarnation with adds=juicy

[Bugg]

Roger that, thx.

[Deleted]

Did full heroic clear yesterday and happy with the changes. I had no time to read forums or sim much before it so i run with standard (old) talents, 34% haste ,12% crit, 55% mastery and did well on most fights. I got both ED and IFE and was in top 5 on most fights. I feel like our damage went up (but other classes did as well as we were clearing bosses much quicker then usual). Due to our guild been average on some fights I had to forget about my DPS and help with mechanics (Xavius soaking etc) but still happy with my performance.

Cenarius (one fight i never knew how to play well) i managed to get 96% and with 100k more then last weeks but it would be I just played it better (faster kill time helped as well for sure). Other fights 85%+ ranking within my gear rank so quite happy.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

yet to try Mythic+ but from I have seen and read we finally can bet strong in AoE packs that last more then 10 seconds

ps. feel bad for Fire Mages as their damage seems to be down by a lot. Arcane though ... guy that was middle of the pack before now consistent top 3 or top of the pack ...

[Adramelch]

Did full heroic clear yesterday and happy with the changes. I had no time to read forums or sim much before it so i run with standard (old) talents, 34% haste ,12% crit, 55% mastery and did well on most fights. I got both ED and IFE and was in top 5 on most fights. I feel like our damage went up (but other classes did as well as we were clearing bosses much quicker then usual). Due to our guild been average on some fights I had to forget about my DPS and help with mechanics (Xavius soaking etc) but still happy with my performance.

Cenarius (one fight i never knew how to play well) i managed to get 96% and with 100k more then last weeks but it would be I just played it better (faster kill time helped as well for sure). Other fights 85%+ ranking within my gear rank so quite happy.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

yet to try Mythic+ but from I have seen and read we finally can bet strong in AoE packs that last more then 10 seconds

ps. feel bad for Fire Mages as their damage seems to be down by a lot. Arcane though ... guy that was middle of the pack before now consistent top 3 or top of the pack ...

Fire mage felt relatively strong when people got used to playing it. Hunters is where all the grief is at currently.

[Bugg]

with the new stats balance, would SFC trink come back to being a wise choice? Or are we still looking for more haste / crit or suitable stat sticks?