7.1.5: Fire completely wrecked

[Deleted]

If raid dps is strong enough and pop hero at start it's possible, i did 480k in a pug before 7.1.5 with only bracers (95%)

480k pre patch with bracers isn't exactly hard to achieve. Nevertheless, I'd like to see his logs.

Really? Let's talk about hunters then.

Mage forum, we don't give two shits about the current state of hunters. Go to their forum if you want to discuss that.

[Deleted]

Yeah I'd like to see that as well. Problem is there are just a few frost and arcane mages with 54 traits in their weapon, so it's hard to get logs. I will test arcane on HC split raids today tho, it looks promising after target dummy testing at least.



Tbh playing with mirror images feels wierd to me, guess I'm still used to rune of power. And after yesterdays raid it feels like rune is still the best for me, cause I play with bracers and helm. Dunno really, have to test more I guess.


Here you go.
Was using bracers/helm and urn/arans ruby. Talents are Rune and AF. You can see how good arans ruby is now

What is your opener? There are a few circulating. I have the helm only. It's quite nice with MI/ALEX 5 PIs and meteor opener. I didn't use ruby tho and that was stupid. I will tonight. Dat Shadow Priest on Xavius tho. Totally proves my earlier point. Over 1 mil and still only 85%? WTF!!!

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Ouch, yup it's still a learning process. Kind of fun though. And we finally have the option to get rid of RoP. Which many of us wanted for a long time.

THAT is true. I hate HATE RoP. Always have always will. I'm very happy about having the MI option. Even if it doesn't do as well as RoP, it's worth sacrificing a little bit of dps for. RoP is window of opportunity burst dps and if it wasn't lined up properly, it fucked your rank thoroughly.

[Neoxx]

What is your opener? There are a few circulating. I have the helm only. It's quite nice with MI/ALEX 5 PIs and meteor opener. I didn't use ruby tho and that was stupid. I will tonight. Dat Shadow Priest on Xavius tho. Totally proves my earlier point. Over 1 mil and still only 85%? WTF!!!

With BL on pull I use this opener: precast fireball > meteor > rune into combustion > fire blast > (phoenix if needed) > pyro > yada yada
Bloodlust on pull enables me to use meteor before rune, because you have so much haste that your meteor hits the ground after you placed the rune and used combustion. Not sure if that's the best solution, but like I said I was testing shit.
Watching PI stacks is not that important anymore since the nerf IMO. And the ruby comment was sarcastic btw, it literally procced once and did 460k dmg. This trinket is useless now.

[Deleted]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/12#sample=1

Are you sure?

According to your link we're down there with all 3 of our specs being in the bottom 7. Together with shamans who have both their dps specs be dogshit and hunters who have beast and MM be very weak, but survival being top 5. Yes. I'd say we're in the gutter. Especially since we're one of the strongest padding classes for fights like xavius which would elevate our overall.

[pkm]

With BL on pull I use this opener: precast fireball > meteor > rune into combustion > fire blast > (phoenix if needed) > pyro > yada yada
Bloodlust on pull enables me to use meteor before rune, because you have so much haste that your meteor hits the ground after you placed the rune and used combustion. Not sure if that's the best solution, but like I said I was testing shit.
Watching PI stacks is not that important anymore since the nerf IMO. And the ruby comment was sarcastic btw, it literally procced once and did 460k dmg. This trinket is useless now.

For single target yes Arans is somewhat useless but still sims high on AoE.

[D3athsting]

You can see how good arans ruby is now

Ruby is sh*t now on ST, i run 880 oakheart and 880 sinew but i have to say sinew is quite underwhelming now without rop

[Salystra]

Ruby is sh*t now on ST, i run 880 oakheart and 880 sinew but i have to say sinew is quite underwhelming now without rop

Sinew is dead, Int is king and stat sticks seem to be the winners

[Deleted]

Here you go.
Was using bracers/helm and urn/arans ruby. Talents are Rune and AF. You can see how good arans ruby is now

Thanks bro!

You do understand I'm going to bombard you with questions now, right?

Kidding, I saw the fights were very short, which explains the high dps somewhat. But I wonder, how many traits do you have and what relics are you using?

I also have the legendary helm (and belt), but AF still sims lower than Flame On for me.

[Morillus]

Sinew is dead, Int is king and stat sticks seem to be the winners

Certainly seems to be the case. Annoying since I gave an 880 Brinewater bottle to a guildie last week.

[Skylarking]

Sinew is dead, Int is king and stat sticks seem to be the winners

Is this for all classes now or just mage?

[Neoxx]

Thanks bro!

You do understand I'm going to bombard you with questions now, right?

Kidding, I saw the fights were very short, which explains the high dps somewhat. But I wonder, how many traits do you have and what relics are you using?

I also have the legendary helm (and belt), but AF still sims lower than Flame On for me.

You can see all the information in the logs. Click on summary and select the player.

AF and Flame On are really close if you have the helm. On pure single target Flame On should be better in theory, but if you have any kind of cleave AF is better IMO. Same with Rune of Power: use it on cleave and AoE fights. Mirror images might be better on pure single target but I'm not sold to that for now.

[enchiridion]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...e=1&dataset=99

And my point was that fire isn't the worst. Also, consider that much of the tuning was done with set bonuses in mind. I am currently enjoying playing fire.

The set bonus argument doesn't really work for comparison to other classes, everyone is tuned around set bonuses, everyone is in the same rough % increase from their tier, comparisons don't change in any meaningful way.

[Deleted]

480k pre patch with bracers isn't exactly hard to achieve. Nevertheless, I'd like to see his logs.



Mage forum, we don't give two shits about the current state of hunters. Go to their forum if you want to discuss that.

Your inability to grasp the understanding behind my post really concerns me. It simply implies that hunter got hit by a bigger nerf bat than fire mages and fire mages still QQ about it.

Also, gz to you for winning a forum debate, I hope you will succeed in life.

[enchiridion]

You haven't played long have you?

Played for several years now, I assume this is directed at the part where I said everyone gets roughly the same % increase from tier, that is not some bs I pulled out of the air there is actually a spreadsheet that has the % increase for tier and it's in the same ballpark of 5-7% obviously with a few outliers but I don't recall fire being one of them

[Deleted]

So you pulled it out of your ass. Good to know.

Same as you then, maybe you should give him some actual numbers isntead of trowing the 99% at him because we all know only the top 1% counts right?
This would give a better picture:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/12#sample=1

[Alvito]

No need to nerf LB; flame patch is already stronger

If targets don't move and live long enough to take multiple hits. Say something like Helya LB is far better. They both have a place now though, all 3 choices in that tier do. Nice to be able to change if only it didn't cost 600g at each fight to keep switching.

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Played for several years now, I assume this is directed at the part where I said everyone gets roughly the same % increase from tier, that is not some bs I pulled out of the air there is actually a spreadsheet that has the % increase for tier and it's in the same ballpark of 5-7% obviously with a few outliers but I don't recall fire being one of them

Fires 2 set is junk. They did buff it Monday before the patch hit so maybe it will come more in line. One of the bigger issues for fire with set bonuses is the stat break down on the 6 tier items. 2 have crit so while bonuses may or may not be good cutting out over 1000 crit from your gear to get your 4 set at the very least hurts. Arcanes 2 and 4 set are both great and in many cases they have on of the best set bonus combos.

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Same as you then, maybe you should give him some actual numbers isntead of trowing the 99% at him because we all know only the top 1% counts right?
This would give a better picture:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/12#sample=1

Why do people insist on showing the blended all fights. It gives such a absurdly jaded picture of the raid as a whole. If you looked at it for EN you would have thought fire was a top 4 spec when it was 13th or lower on most fights, but cheesed mechanics so hard on 2 fights it padded it's numbers for the raid. That is also for 1 day worth of information.

[enchiridion]

So you pulled it out of your ass. Good to know.

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...ower_rankings/

So the range that I had was a bit off on either side as the last min changes to tier were factored in after I looked at it last so 4-8%, my bad on that one, but fire is on the low end of that scale, soo...

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If targets don't move and live long enough to take multiple hits. Say something like Helya LB is far better. They both have a place now though, all 3 choices in that tier do. Nice to be able to change if only it didn't cost 600g at each fight to keep switching.

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Fires 2 set is junk. They did buff it Monday before the patch hit so maybe it will come more in line. One of the bigger issues for fire with set bonuses is the stat break down on the 6 tier items. 2 have crit so while bonuses may or may not be good cutting out over 1000 crit from your gear to get your 4 set at the very least hurts. Arcanes 2 and 4 set are both great and in many cases they have on of the best set bonus combos.

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Why do people insist on showing the blended all fights. It gives such a absurdly jaded picture of the raid as a whole. If you looked at it for EN you would have thought fire was a top 4 spec when it was 13th or lower on most fights, but cheesed mechanics so hard on 2 fights it padded it's numbers for the raid. That is also for 1 day worth of information.

I was saying the "balanced around tier" argument WASNT valid

[Deleted]

Same as you then, maybe you should give him some actual numbers isntead of trowing the 99% at him because we all know only the top 1% counts right?
This would give a better picture:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/12#sample=1

Stop showing this link.
Fire mage is crap vs Odyn and guarm.
Only Helya is ok.
Meaning trial of valor has no good encounter design for fire mage, no need to complain.

[D3athsting]

Sinew is dead, Int is king and stat sticks seem to be the winners

Lol just simmed and realized that 890 brinewater (+vers) is a 6k dps gain over sinew and 885 socket twisting wind is 3k over oakheart

[Deleted]

If targets don't move and live long enough to take multiple hits. Say something like Helya LB is far better. They both have a place now though, all 3 choices in that tier do. Nice to be able to change if only it didn't cost 600g at each fight to keep switching.

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Fires 2 set is junk. They did buff it Monday before the patch hit so maybe it will come more in line. One of the bigger issues for fire with set bonuses is the stat break down on the 6 tier items. 2 have crit so while bonuses may or may not be good cutting out over 1000 crit from your gear to get your 4 set at the very least hurts. Arcanes 2 and 4 set are both great and in many cases they have on of the best set bonus combos.

- - - Updated - - -



Why do people insist on showing the blended all fights. It gives such a absurdly jaded picture of the raid as a whole. If you looked at it for EN you would have thought fire was a top 4 spec when it was 13th or lower on most fights, but cheesed mechanics so hard on 2 fights it padded it's numbers for the raid. That is also for 1 day worth of information.

I know, I am just saying its very unfair showing 99% as it will show classes played to perfection which most of the population doesn't do.