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  1. #1401
    Quote Originally Posted by Twilightcrescent View Post
    It's been my experience that my guild will usually try to cluster targets for cleave anyway. The only fight I've seen that's really benefitted a lot from havoc is the Odynn battle because the two targets are spread across the room. I'm also using Norgannons's now since my choice for 2nd legendary is that or the pillars and without BD I need that haste back (I have to admit the pillars are hilarious fun when you can insta-throw teleports and leap out in front of a warrior). When you're running through a high level M+ it is nice to have that extra movement boost. I used to pack FnB for added aoe in M+ but I may try your set up.
    I don't have the portal legs but I can imagine it being pretty fun lol

    I can definitely see FnB/Cata being more of a variable choice depending upon the affix week as well as group composition... Fortified definitely can throw a wrench in things depending on the dungeon (arcway for example). I know I'll be playing around with it.
    Last edited by pappaslop; 2017-01-12 at 07:14 PM.

  2. #1402
    Hi. Never thought that Backdraft changes would bring so much inconvenience for me. I often managed to cast CB, then Inci, then CB again - all while Backdraft is up. Not always it proced that way but very often since I have Feretory and 2 relics with a chance of getting a shard back of CB. And now keeping in mind that shard refunds only when CB hits the target I have to wait or stopcast Inci because otherwise Backdraft stacks are gone.
    So, the first question is - should I wait for a shard to cast the second "backdrafted" CB and do some other things meanwhile (like Rift, CDF if taken, Lifetap if taken, etc) or just waste the stack with Incinerate?
    The second question is about Lifetap. Brusalk claims that it is the best option in the tier almost in every situation. In practice: it lowers our HP (which may be fatal in some cases), it provokes GCD and it adds another thing to track (which probably ain't a problem, but still...) Eradication debuff ignores spells' travel time and applies to CB-havoked target as well and that's very important. And Entropy brings unlimited mana and comfortable CB casting time which adds to our mobility. Thus, is 10% ELP worth it or it pulls ahead just in simulation?
    Last but not least is about the final talent tier. I have Odr. Can anyone tell me for sure whether Havok debuff does work on a single target with this legendary. I never managed to see the difference probably because of mastery procs. If it does Wreak Havoc becomes my default option in all sircumstances, doesn't it?
    Last edited by skynet88; 2017-01-13 at 06:37 AM.

  3. #1403
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by skynet88 View Post
    The second question is about Lifetap. Brusalk claims that it is the best option in the tier almost in every situation. In practice: it lowers our HP (which may be fatal in some cases), it provokes GCD and it adds another thing to track (which probably ain't a problem, but still...) Eradication debuff ignores spells' travel time and applies to SB-havoked target as well and that's very important. And Entropy brings unlimited mana and comfortable SB casting time which adds to our mobility. Thus, is 10% ELP worth it or it pulls ahead just in simulation?
    Why do people keep pretending this is a thing.

    I can understand people scrounging for reasons to stick to the easier, more ergonomic talent - but the HP thing that keeps getting up is mindboggling.
    Yes, ELT is less pleasant to play with for the majority of players, but it seems to be optimal and HP concerns are just not a legitimate thing. At all.

  4. #1404
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Eradication is pretty even, problem is ELT also buffs AoE and shit you don't CB before and you will need to tap anyway, so meh.

  5. #1405
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagassh View Post
    Why do people keep pretending this is a thing.

    I can understand people scrounging for reasons to stick to the easier, more ergonomic talent - but the HP thing that keeps getting up is mindboggling.
    Yes, ELT is less pleasant to play with for the majority of players, but it seems to be optimal and HP concerns are just not a legitimate thing. At all.
    The health thing is negligible. I've only had issue with low health a few times and it was in a M+ when we had a healer who was feeling uneasy and skittish was causing me to get melee'ed more than I'd like. If you find yourself in that situation then hopefully you were wise enough to remember to give yourself healthstones and have your defense cooldowns and lifedrain handy to fix it. ELT is no big deal in a raid environment. I was using it in mythic EN last night with no problemo.

  6. #1406
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Yeah and it's not like "I'm getting pounded here at 40% HP and dropping, this is the best time to Life Tap lel!".

  7. #1407
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Yeah and it's not like "I'm getting pounded here at 40% HP and dropping, this is the best time to Life Tap lel!".
    Yup, same as Lifetap has been for warlocks for the past 10ish years - lifetap during movement if you have nothing better to do and your health isn't in immediate danger - if you've tapped so little that you're both a) unable to cast due to mana, b) getting pounded, chances are you missed an opportune time to tap earlier.

    I can understand people missing the CB cast time / taking a while to getting used to tracking the buff, but the health drop is barely there and it helps pad out destructions movement with something useful - hell, we even get a 9% damage reduction which is better than the deal was in previous expansions / a better deal than demo has.

  8. #1408
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagassh View Post
    Yup, same as Lifetap has been for warlocks for the past 10ish years - lifetap during movement if you have nothing better to do and your health isn't in immediate danger - if you've tapped so little that you're both a) unable to cast due to mana, b) getting pounded, chances are you missed an opportune time to tap earlier.

    I can understand people missing the CB cast time / taking a while to getting used to tracking the buff, but the health drop is barely there and it helps pad out destructions movement with something useful - hell, we even get a 9% damage reduction which is better than the deal was in previous expansions / a better deal than demo has.

    Actually I think lifetap might even be babified. I don't know if you can lifetap yourself to death anymore. I remember trying it and not being able to. It is useful for the nightbane fight in getting health low though I was able to sink my health faster than anyone else lol... great claim to fame.

  9. #1409
    Hey, can anyone please invite me to wlock discord? The link I expired, eh.

  10. #1410
    Quote Originally Posted by TheodorEicke View Post
    Hey, can anyone please invite me to wlock discord? The link I expired, eh.
    https://discord.gg/7DbzrZX

  11. #1411
    Quote Originally Posted by Twilightcrescent View Post
    Actually I think lifetap might even be babified. I don't know if you can lifetap yourself to death anymore.
    I don't recall it ever being possible to kill yourself with Life Tap. IIRC even in Vanilla on a wipe we used to life tap to low hp and then actually commit suicide with Hellfire, not Life Tap.

  12. #1412
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckz0rs View Post
    I don't recall it ever being possible to kill yourself with Life Tap. IIRC even in Vanilla on a wipe we used to life tap to low hp and then actually commit suicide with Hellfire, not Life Tap.
    Good old no repair times

  13. #1413
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagassh View Post
    Yup, same as Lifetap has been for warlocks for the past 10ish years
    And for destro specifically 6-ish. Those were a good 4 years.
    ..and so he left, with terrible power in shaking hands.

  14. #1414
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Princess Missfit View Post
    Good old no repair times
    I miss hellfire

  15. #1415
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Hellfire? Rest well, old friend, nobody will hurt you anymore.

  16. #1416
    And you'll no longer wipe the raid old friend, cause a ranged mechanic picked you and you were in melee to pad up the aoe.
    ..and so he left, with terrible power in shaking hands.

  17. #1417
    Anybody have a general idea on what build to play for each Nighthold boss? I'm near 54 on destruction and so going DEMO for certain fights is out of the question until I get that weapon much higher. Just want to be prepared for each fight on what I should be playing?

    Format example I am sort of looking for would be like:

    Scorpyron
    Backdraft / ELT / Demonic Circle / Cataclysm? or SH? / Dark Pact or Burning Rush / GoServ / Channel Demonfire

    I guess i'd go cata and sacrifice or i'll go SH and goserv. I'm not sure which yet.

    Not even sure if that is accurate but I'm thinking of going with that build, leaning towards SH b/c of the insane aoe dmg with my raid group.

  18. #1418
    I like ELT better than Eradication anyways, removes the headache of calculating CB collision time if you wanted to be adventurous and sneak in more than 1-2 incinerate in between CB's.

    Destro is also NOT a mana hog like affliction/demo. With affliction 2 drain souls in and I'm already at half mana, with demon and hero in the opener you actually need to waste time life tapping.

  19. #1419
    Deleted
    Hey guys a few questions

    The latest sim has eradication over Imt for St is does that translate into the game?

    If so what would Imt be used for? Or a fight example in EN or is Imt just better

    With soul harvest being taken on all fights and no fnb or cataclysm taken, what are people doing for cleave adds say spider boss/illg as examples or trash? Just tab immolate and RoF? or is CDF providing decent cleave now amd throw out havoc chaos bolts? Are there any times where fnb or cataclysm are going to outweigh sh outside of m+?

    With all the changes what is a good m+ build?

    As long as there is a good chunk of long living targets does havoc win?

    Thanks in advance guys

    Hey guys a few questions

    The latest sim has eradication over Imt for St is does that translate into the game?

    If so what would Imt be used for? Or a fight example in EN or is Imt just better

    With soul harvest being taken on all fights and no fnb or cataclysm taken, what are people doing for cleave adds say spider boss/illg as examples or trash? Just tab immolate and RoF? or is CDF providing decent cleave now amd throw out havoc chaos bolts? Are there any times where fnb or cataclysm are going to outweigh sh outside of m+?

    With all the changes what is a good m+ build?

    As long as there is a good chunk of long living targets does havoc win?

    Thanks in advance guys

  20. #1420
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucrece View Post
    I like ELT better than Eradication anyways, removes the headache of calculating CB collision time if you wanted to be adventurous and sneak in more than 1-2 incinerate in between CB's.

    Destro is also NOT a mana hog like affliction/demo. With affliction 2 drain souls in and I'm already at half mana, with demon and hero in the opener you actually need to waste time life tapping.
    A while back it was confirmed that eradication snapshots at the cast completion. So as long as CB left your hand while eradication is on the target it gets the dmg increase. I tweeted about it to celestalon who then said he was gonna look into it a loooong time ago, but I haven't seen anyone confirm if they changed the behavior to be consistent with other debuffs.
    ..and so he left, with terrible power in shaking hands.

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