What made classic wow better than current?

[Delmore]

The question seems to come up everywhere.

Lets get a few things straight.
- Graphics are better now
- Gameplay is smoother now
- Connection uptime and overall server stability are better now.

Anyone who argues that or even brings it up are stupid.

However:

- Reasons for participating in world content are lower. World quests are usually a single player element, and world bosses pretty much are taken down in a auto-invite group or simply tagging a boss that a pre-made group has tagged.
- Having to communicate with a group is pretty much non-existant. This is the piece that is majorly different. Doing any dungeon in Vanilla required communication, as the bosses were not 100% documented by websites and other tools.
- Engaging world content for an upgrade is pretty much a non starter. The 3 to 4 quests that really come to mind as super engaging and fun were The Hearthglen questline with Tirion's son, the Onyxia questline for the key to Ony, the key to UBRS, the quests on the AQ line, the World Dragons, the Twilight Hammer in Silithus, and summoning the major bosses. You may not have liked those things, but I did.

Why I liked them. They were difficult. They took some planning. You needed a group to understand what was going on. They forwarded story without feeling like it was on rails.

Why they cant happen again? They were difficult. No one wants that in casual content anymore. We arent talking Mythic here. The real reason for that is that casuals have spoken (Im not saying this is wrong), and they have told Blizz (as their biggest montary contributer) that they dont want difficult content in the world that blocks progression to small group play.

Combine that with the cross realm technology and you feel like everyone you see with a different server name is forgettable, as you wont EVER run into them again, and you have a disengaged system for creating a friend outside of your guild.

What everyone is talking about with Nostalga, and not everyone felt this is in Vanilla, was the common goal scenario, where you felt like a small part of a bigger group that was doing something larger than life. Playing now, you rarely get that feeling. I had it for a second at the beginning of Legion, when we were in blues/epics going into Emerald Nightmare, but it dissipated when we found out how easy normal was. Once we went through it on normal, Heroic was not exciting at all, it felt like a drag. The easy answer is to simply go right to heroic, slam your dick in a door and skip normal. That may be a thing, but lets face it, if there is an easier option, pretty much everyone will take it. It ruins the illusion of the boss and the raid. You can argue its value to the game till your blue in the face, but a raid with a single difficulty is far more satisfying. It feels like you've finished it, rather than ran it. The first kill on a boss is the best feeling, but when its easy its diminished. Why dont more people only do one difficulty? I bet you that half the people cant be bothered, or dont even know that it feels different, as they have filtered in from days past that. Others have to deal with people who dont care about that anymore. Others are really burnt out from the vanilla grind due to crappy guilds and otherwise non-progression. I had the benefit of being in progression throughout vanilla and BC, and it was a blast. Were there times it sucked? Fuck yes. Beating my head off a wall for 3 months on Muru, that was fun.....sigh. However, the grand majority of the time, you felt like you were a part of something bigger.

Community was knowing the alliance and horde heroes of your server. You didnt need to be told you were great, people told you. I remember looking at this T2 warrior in Ironforge and thinking he was the cats meow before I started raiding. It was obvious who was putting in raid time. I know thats all elitist to a generation of participation award winners, but that doesnt make it wrong, just because you dont like that idea. It appealed to me, I wanted to raid to get that. I wanted it to be gated. I didnt care if I never got it, it made me seek out other people who had the same idea that I had, to go do a challenge, to overcome it and not feel like you are taken out of the narrative. Thats the game I paid to play. I know other people dont like that idea, but I did. It was immersive in a way that difficulty levels never could be. Right now, even mentioning the idea that you like having something that someone else doesnt is a fucking war cry to people who want access to everything with no effort. Because of the choices now, guild ARE smaller because they simply dont have to be bigger. Your community of people you deal with on a daily basis is smaller. Does it mean you deal with less a-holes in a day, yes, but they were the people who added color to the group, added drama to the game. Every person who left in a rage was a conversation for a week. It meant sometimes you were that person, but tempers died down, you moved on to another guild, and your social group got bigger. The community aspect is lost for accessibility, and thats ok too, if thats what you want. Im not saying any of that stuff was fun persay, but it was engaging. Many people quit over those things, but a lot also did not. The avrage age of those people were much lower Im assuming then too, which Im sure had plenty to do with it. Some of the people I know have literally grouwn up and had kids over the life of the game, but those people are the ones I talk to, because they are in quild and we all know each other over a long period of time.

Now everything seems smaller. Reminds me of days before the internet and cellphones where things in a way were managed by your group of friends, and not by 1000 anonymous friends. THis really is a microcosm of the world today and when the game started. May seem like a silly statement but it seems to fit, at least to me.

[Nfinitii]

It wasn't, it was different, some things r better now and some things r not. Legion has been one of those expansions where there r a lot of good and a lot of bad.

[Vash The Stampede]

I recall the same being said about Hearthstone. And Heroes of the Storm. Both are still going strong.

They are? You sure? Those kinda faded away like Pokemon Go.

But if you want to be pedantic, everything fades away over time. Every. Single. Thing. So it's kind of a meaningless argument.

That's true but TF2 is still going strong after like 10 years. I can't see Overwatch lasting that long.

[Kithelle]

Nothing at all other than it being new to most people.
Playing it and NOT being new to the game, I can say it doesn't have a sliver of the rose shimmer people ascribe to it.

This...I don't know where all of this *community* talk comes from...what community? The community of spend hours sitting in front of a summoning stone waiting for people to finally get a group formed then wham bam thank you mam and walk away...I never had people asking to add me tot heir friends list...never had people ask me to run another instance with them.

Maybe the community was from sitting in a major city for a hour spamming in LFG and Trade chat then wham bam thank you mam and then it was over.

Yeah...so much community...I think vanilla zealots just use this excuse because they literally have no other legs to stand on.

[Xheoul]

That's true but TF2 is still going strong after like 10 years. I can't see Overwatch lasting that long.

I can... I played TF2 heavily before and the game has changed so much, specially with all the dumb hats and weapons they added (imo). I truly believe Overwatch is here to stay. Considering all the support it's getting from Blizz.


OT: Vanilla was great cause it was new. The same as Burning Crusade was great cause it was new to those who began playing on Burning Crusade... As with WotLK, Cata, Mop, etc.

There's also the hipsters that never played Vanilla that will say it was better than anything ever just because, like most of the gaming community nowadays, they have become bitter and hate fun things. The game is much better now. And yes, I played since vanilla too.

[Stormspellz]

server community and a "living" world, wow turned into a glorified menu game

[iperson]

fewer casuals

[Deleted]

This...I don't know where all of this *community* talk comes from...what community? The community of spend hours sitting in front of a summoning stone waiting for people to finally get a group formed then wham bam thank you mam and walk away...I never had people asking to add me tot heir friends list...never had people ask me to run another instance with them.

Maybe the community was from sitting in a major city for a hour spamming in LFG and Trade chat then wham bam thank you mam and then it was over.

Yeah...so much community...I think vanilla zealots just use this excuse because they literally have no other legs to stand on.

That was your experience. It was not necessarily same for other people. Truth is when there is new game people playing it are usually more excited - that's why loads of coolish vids were created during classic/tb. Also game being new back then made most ppl bad, inexperienced, insecure and hence more friendly. So yeah basically answer "it was new" is correct as that was main reason why other "good things" about it were ever there.

[Jonnusthegreat]

Difficulty.

[Deleted]

nothing ? Vanilla is compared to now a Piece of Garbage Game

[Phuongvi]

I don't know how to answer the question *What made classic wow better than current?*

But after 3 month Legion I'm already waiting for a new expansion annoncement because their is fuck all to do in those little 5 small compact winzip zone.
With random crap dropping anywhere, and a LFR in wich you can do quest seriously blizz, and those main and second profession, just horrible.

Is it burned out ? I don't know, like I said, I'm waiting for a new expansion announcement.

World quest was ok for a week, but it just feel like the Legion zones alltogether are the Barrens split in 5 general chat.

Maybe during the begening of WoW with Vanilla and TBC, alot of people who are saying this was the best WoW , they started playing during that time.
It was a hell of an adeventure to reach level 60 or 70 and you didnt have 5 small zone le like Legion is offering, but a new world to explore.

Leveling was fun like and loot was something, the Arugal robe in SFK at level 25.
Waiting for some people at the summoning stone for a 5 men. With some fucking level 53 alliance ganking you at level 27
Yeah sure it could take you an evening to complete Black Rock. Yes it'S fucking crazy. A fucking 3 hours to form, travel and not even sure to finish this shit.


Now you buy a tank for 1000g Trade chat, and the shit is completed in 15 min. You buy another tank 1000g, another 15 min. You buy a EN H run for 100 000g.Yes thats fucking crazy.


It's just liek Stan in South Park.... you're getting old

[Kithelle]

That was your experience. It was not necessarily same for other people. Truth is when there is new game people playing it are usually more excited - that's why loads of coolish vids were created during classic/tb. Also game being new back then made most ppl bad, inexperienced, insecure and hence more friendly. So yeah basically answer "it was new" is correct as that was main reason why other "good things" about it were ever there.

So? Same argument can be used the other way around...community was something someone else experienced...not everyone experienced it so it's not really a valid claim...I did a lot of dungeons and even the lower level raids...I didn't have people asking to friend me left and right...other than my guild a lot of my friends were made from RP.

RP which is something I do even in Legion...except even RP is better with mods like TRP3....with more lore to expand things...more ideas...ect ect ect.

[Vineri]

Legacy vs Retail ...

Better RPG - you betcha. Legacy holds WoW lore before it was butchered.

Better Gameplay - Tie. Pro's and Con's .. a Tie.

Better Customer Support - Worse. Erg, Thanks Blizzard for making your phone reps not speak English.

Better Graphics - Absolutely. The most compelling point. Though I think most "modern" games with graphics are garbage compared to their retro counterparts. =D

I love RPG's. Sorry Legions .. I choose Vanilla

[kary]

Legacy vs Retail ...

Better RPG - you betcha. Legacy holds WoW lore before it was butchered.

Better Gameplay - Tie. Pro's and Con's .. a Tie.

Better Customer Support - Worse. Erg, Thanks Blizzard for making your phone reps not speak English.

Better Graphics - Absolutely. The most compelling point. Though I think most "modern" games with graphics are garbage compared to their retro counterparts. =D

I love RPG's. Sorry Legions .. I choose Vanilla

The alpha memberberry appears
Lol this thread is retarded and so is everyone in it.

[Kyanion]

Legacy vs Retail ...

Better RPG - you betcha. Legacy holds WoW lore before it was butchered.

Better Gameplay - Tie. Pro's and Con's .. a Tie.

Better Customer Support - Worse. Erg, Thanks Blizzard for making your phone reps not speak English.

Better Graphics - Absolutely. The most compelling point. Though I think most "modern" games with graphics are garbage compared to their retro counterparts. =D

I love RPG's. Sorry Legions .. I choose Vanilla

Vanilla gameplay is a tie with retail? LOL

Online chat support has been A+ for me, so whatevers. Man you are so blinded it is painful. I won't even bother with the better RPG/graphics part. Not worth arguing over anymore.

[Ielenia]

They are? You sure? Those kinda faded away like Pokemon Go.

Yes, I'm sure. Those games still rank rather high on the Twitch list for most streamed games.

That's true but TF2 is still going strong after like 10 years. I can't see Overwatch lasting that long.

Funny. I, for one, see Overwatch going just as long if not longer. I see no reason no reason why OW couldn't last at least as long. Also, TF2 doesn't show up in the Top 10 most streamed games on Twitch, btw.

[Vineri]

Vanilla gameplay is a tie with retail? LOL

Online chat support has been A+ for me, so whatevers. Man you are so blinded it is painful. I won't even bother with the better RPG/graphics part. Not worth arguing over anymore.

I guess you just want to make trouble, since the graphics and RPG aspects were opposites :P

PS - you have been arguing for a long time. I really don't think you'd stop.

[Toppy]

So? Same argument can be used the other way around...community was something someone else experienced...not everyone experienced it so it's not really a valid claim...I did a lot of dungeons and even the lower level raids...I didn't have people asking to friend me left and right...other than my guild a lot of my friends were made from RP.

RP which is something I do even in Legion...except even RP is better with mods like TRP3....with more lore to expand things...more ideas...ect ect ect.

The community WAS better then. People had to coordinate with others which meant there was a greater amount of civility and kindness. Since you had to do things with people from your server people were less likely to be ass holes and more likely to want to form bonds.

Its something that was lost from MMO in time. EQ had a similar sort of camaraderie in their community (speaking from experience with both EQ and WoW). Now? You only need to be nice with people in your immediate raid group or rated pvp group. Dungeons? Groups for PvE quests? Groups for PvPing? Groups for none-mythic raiding? Can all be done with people you'll meet just for that run that you'll never see again. It gives greater freedom to be a prick since you dont have to worry about being blacklisted.

EDIT:

Also yes, the gameplay compared to now wasnt so great and the class balance was kinda crap. A lot of raiding was less about doing your rotation right and more so about having the right resist gear.

But at the time, WoW was revolutionary on the MMO gameplay department.

[Bapestar]

This...I don't know where all of this *community* talk comes from...what community? The community of spend hours sitting in front of a summoning stone waiting for people to finally get a group formed then wham bam thank you mam and walk away...I never had people asking to add me tot heir friends list...never had people ask me to run another instance with them.

Maybe the community was from sitting in a major city for a hour spamming in LFG and Trade chat then wham bam thank you mam and then it was over.

Yeah...so much community...I think vanilla zealots just use this excuse because they literally have no other legs to stand on.

Sounds like it was you with the issues. Also spamming in Trade chat for a hour, was not super common. And even if you didn't add people, it was common that you ran into the same people later on. And friendships often stemmed from that. And spending hours sitting in front of a summoning stone? Stop exaggerating.

[Vash The Stampede]

There's also the hipsters that never played Vanilla that will say it was better than anything ever just because, like most of the gaming community nowadays, they have become bitter and hate fun things. The game is much better now. And yes, I played since vanilla too.

I know a lot of people believe it's Nostalgia but I don't believe Nostalgia applies to video games very well. A good game is a good game no matter how many years have passed. Thief 1 & 2 are better than Thief 3 or Thief 4. The same applies to Doom where 1 & 2 were good, but 3 was not and 4 went back to how 1&2 played.

Point is, Nostalgia has no place in game design. New WoW is bad, and it reflects on how many active players.

Funny. I, for one, see Overwatch going just as long if not longer. I see no reason no reason why OW couldn't last at least as long. Also, TF2 doesn't show up in the Top 10 most streamed games on Twitch, btw.

So we're going by Twitch as a measurement?