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  1. #1
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    So I understand that Overwatch is popular, but it rubs me all the wrong ways.

    So i've finally figured out what drives me mental about OW, thing smells more cheesy than gorgonzola.

    It's supposedly an FPS but has multiple instances where you don't aim at all, one would think that aiming is a central part of a shooter, but fair enough.
    And there are sooo many cheesy ways you keep dying in this game, Torbjörn's turret that requires zero input from the player, has "maphack" and "aimbot", symmetra/winston beam and of course the two spawns of satan themselves, spamrat with his skillnades and roadhog and his bullshit lolshot combo with the hook.

    It feels somewhat like quake, except with "for dummies" added in the title.

    Is this common critique for Overwatch or am I just an older generation gamer who want player capabilities to be in center?

  2. #2
    Go play CS then?
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  3. #3
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    You just want a different type of game. There are plenty of FPS out there who's purpose is "be good at aiming". This one has more depth in choosing the right heroes to counter different setups.

    I find it really strange that you should call it "for dummies" when all the auto-aim stuff like turrets, Symmetra's gun, and "no skill" heroes like Bastion or Winston, are inherently avoidable and counter-able by alternative picks; typically by skill itself. Dying to those, generally, is something I consider a retarded mistake not to be repeated - I'm the one that was the idiot feeding them, not the other guy for picking those heroes.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    You just want a different type of game. There are plenty of FPS out there who's purpose is "be good at aiming". This one has more depth in choosing the right heroes to counter different setups.

    I find it really strange that you should call it "for dummies" when all the auto-aim stuff like turrets, Symmetra's gun, and "no skill" heroes like Bastion or Winston, are inherently avoidable and counter-able by alternative picks; typically by skill itself. Dying to those, generally, is something I consider a retarded mistake not to be repeated - I'm the one that was the idiot feeding them, not the other guy for picking those heroes.
    Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.
    But when I pick McCree, or Soldier, or Genji or what have you and try my best to hit those pesky bastards running all over the place, meanwhile a torbjörn gets play of the game while hammering a wall due to his turret, it rubs me all the wrong ways. Or the killcams of a junkrat standing in the same spot, lobbing his nades at the same place, over... and over... and over again.

    Maybe Overwatch isn't for me, probably isn't. I enjoy the core of it, but the devil's in the details, specifically the heroes.
    I get a minor stroke whenever I encounter: Symmetra, Mei, Torbjörn D.va
    I lose my shit when I face a junkrat or a Roadhog.



    Fuck Roadhog.

  5. #5
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.
    But when I pick McCree, or Soldier, or Genji or what have you and try my best to hit those pesky bastards running all over the place, meanwhile a torbjörn gets play of the game while hammering a wall due to his turret, it rubs me all the wrong ways. Or the killcams of a junkrat standing in the same spot, lobbing his nades at the same place, over... and over... and over again.

    Maybe Overwatch isn't for me, probably isn't. I enjoy the core of it, but the devil's in the details, specifically the heroes.
    I get a minor stroke whenever I encounter: Symmetra, Mei, Torbjörn D.va
    I lose my shit when I face a junkrat or a Roadhog.



    Fuck Roadhog.
    Those kinds of things go away with time, experience and general improvements in your own skill and corresponding MMR; and the more "skill based" things tend to start to take over. The 'cheap' heroes, people tend to learn to counter and they get become less effective and ultimately get picked less.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.
    But when I pick McCree, or Soldier, or Genji or what have you and try my best to hit those pesky bastards running all over the place, meanwhile a torbjörn gets play of the game while hammering a wall due to his turret, it rubs me all the wrong ways. Or the killcams of a junkrat standing in the same spot, lobbing his nades at the same place, over... and over... and over again.

    Maybe Overwatch isn't for me, probably isn't. I enjoy the core of it, but the devil's in the details, specifically the heroes.
    I get a minor stroke whenever I encounter: Symmetra, Mei, Torbjörn D.va
    I lose my shit when I face a junkrat or a Roadhog.



    Fuck Roadhog.
    The thing about those aimless classes if that their weapons have a "fixed" skill, for lack of a better term. Take Winston for example. His weapon deals like what? 60 damage per second? That means regardless of who is playing him, the world's worst Winston or the world's best, he will always do 60 dps to his target. Aiming heroes like McCree on the other hand always have room to improve. Until the point they are hitting headshots with every click and then shortly banned for hacking accusations.

    Mei as well. She takes 1.5 seconds to freeze anyone regardless of how good the Mei is. A good player may actually be able to do something about her in those 1.5 seconds while a bad player might not. That's why they are more useful at lower skill brackets and less when people actually know how to deal with them. It isn't exactly that case though because they usually have other "aiming" requirements that give the hero a higher skill. Mei's right click and ability usage along with Torbs weapon.

    It was the same deal with W+M1 pyros in TF2. They are a common sight in pubs, for reasons I can't really understand, but you will never actually see them doing well any in actual serious game.

  7. #7
    non aim heroes have limitations and balances keeping them in check. Often they are the same heroes who depend on abilities and functionality. Often they have high risk/high reward initiatives in place like a team charging symmetra.

    Stuff like torbs turret and the other stuff you mentioned fall out of sight once you move past the common pub who dont realize how to easily counter them.

    Though skilled junkrat players are absolute monsters

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.
    But when I pick McCree, or Soldier, or Genji or what have you and try my best to hit those pesky bastards running all over the place, meanwhile a torbjörn gets play of the game while hammering a wall due to his turret, it rubs me all the wrong ways. Or the killcams of a junkrat standing in the same spot, lobbing his nades at the same place, over... and over... and over again.

    Maybe Overwatch isn't for me, probably isn't. I enjoy the core of it, but the devil's in the details, specifically the heroes.
    I get a minor stroke whenever I encounter: Symmetra, Mei, Torbjörn D.va
    I lose my shit when I face a junkrat or a Roadhog.



    Fuck Roadhog.

    If Torbjörn gets potg while hammering a wall, you really have some serious L2P issues. You know you can pretty much 2 shot the turret on McCree? Throw couple shurikens on it? Kill it with one burst on Soldier (Even better, one single Helix combined with couple bullets)?

    Even better, how the hell do you give potg to a Junkrat who's just lobbing nades to same spot? I mean, like seriously, does that actually happen on like some lowest of the low level on this game? Imo Junkrat is one of the easiest champs in the whole game to counter. It's just a shit champ. Roadhog is free target practice once you bait his hook.

    Weird to call Overwatch "Quake for dummies" when it actually has a hundred times more depth. Quake is just a simple FPS where you just run around and aim at stuff, which involves barely any thought at all. I think that sounds a lot more like "for dummies" really. Like, literally. It's for dummies that can't use their brain to figure out stuff like countering one champ with another, but instead prefer to bash their head on a wall while keeping mouse button down hoping something dies.

  9. #9
    play paladins its so much better

  10. #10
    Banned sheggaro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    So i've finally figured out what drives me mental about OW, thing smells more cheesy than gorgonzola.

    It's supposedly an FPS but has multiple instances where you don't aim at all, one would think that aiming is a central part of a shooter, but fair enough.
    And there are sooo many cheesy ways you keep dying in this game, Torbjörn's turret that requires zero input from the player, has "maphack" and "aimbot", symmetra/winston beam and of course the two spawns of satan themselves, spamrat with his skillnades and roadhog and his bullshit lolshot combo with the hook.

    It feels somewhat like quake, except with "for dummies" added in the title.

    Is this common critique for Overwatch or am I just an older generation gamer who want player capabilities to be in center?
    You just described the game perfectly.

    I played it during beta and never bought it. It's a dumbed down version of tf2 or as you said Quake.

  11. #11
    In higher play levels characters that require aim are usually favored, since they have higher skill caps and thus a great player can do more with them. Mcree is a great example; He was considered meta as hell for a good while - not sure if he has been substituted by 76 or not, but either way they are both "aim" characters - and he requires a lot of aim to pull of. Torb, Junkrat and Bastion can be cheesy, but Pharah, who is very aim oriented, counters them well.

    You have to remember that Overwatch is heavely reliant on its counter system. Some heroes require more aim, some require more awareness of your teamates or the map, some require forward thinking and using the terrain in your favor...and some are easy as hell to play. But, most of the times, each of those characters has a nemesis that will screw them over. Winston is easy to play, but he is not there for all purposes. Zarya is way harder to play but she is way more versatile.

    I believe you mentioned in a comment that you're "awared that you suck". Well, if you value aim, the issue is probably not that you "suck", but that you didn't quite get the game's philosophy yet.

  12. #12
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    Of course and I don't disagree, I'm new to Overwatch and very aware that I suck, hard.
    But when I pick McCree, or Soldier, or Genji or what have you and try my best to hit those pesky bastards running all over the place, meanwhile a torbjörn gets play of the game while hammering a wall due to his turret, it rubs me all the wrong ways. Or the killcams of a junkrat standing in the same spot, lobbing his nades at the same place, over... and over... and over again.
    If Torb's whacking a wall in his killcam, you need to ask yourself why you walked out in front of his turret and let it kill you. As "cheap" as you think it is, it's an immobile thing that doesn't do huge amounts of burst damage and has limited range. If you die to Torb's turret, that's player error, pretty much every time. Torb's just set up to capitalize on your mistake.

    Same with Junkrat. If he's spamming grenades at a choke point and killing you when you go through the choke point, he's doing his job. You're running into grenade spam for some reason. It doesn't matter that he doesn't have line of sight to the choke point, that just makes his positioning smarter, because you can't shoot back directly.

    These aren't cases of heroes being "cheap". This is cases of heroes playing to their strengths, and you getting killed by them because you're not countering that.


  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by sheggaro View Post
    You just described the game perfectly.

    I played it during beta and never bought it. It's a dumbed down version of tf2 or as you said Quake.
    Can you please explain to me, like you would to a 5 year old, how exactly is OVerwatch "dumbed down version of Quake"? And before you even answer, aiming has nothing to do with that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If Torb's whacking a wall in his killcam, you need to ask yourself why you walked out in front of his turret and let it kill you. As "cheap" as you think it is, it's an immobile thing that doesn't do huge amounts of burst damage and has limited range. If you die to Torb's turret, that's player error, pretty much every time. Torb's just set up to capitalize on your mistake.

    Same with Junkrat. If he's spamming grenades at a choke point and killing you when you go through the choke point, he's doing his job. You're running into grenade spam for some reason. It doesn't matter that he doesn't have line of sight to the choke point, that just makes his positioning smarter, because you can't shoot back directly.

    These aren't cases of heroes being "cheap". This is cases of heroes playing to their strengths, and you getting killed by them because you're not countering that.
    Exactly. Sounds to me like we're dealing with people who are too used to playing "dumb" games where all you do is run around shooting with zero thinking involved. Then they argue here that OW is a dumbed down version of those games. I just don't get it.

  14. #14
    Banned Gandrake's Avatar
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    winston is ok for what he does but it takes a lot of climbing to get out of an mmr where people still play torb but i wouldn't miss symmetra or roadhog if they were just removed from the game one day and i dont blame anyone for thinking they are some real weenie hut jrs shit for windex drinkers

    The game can be a lot of fun if you don't mind being able to play a handful of heroes and knowing what a heroes' weaknesses are and assessing an enemy player's weakness to counter them (i.e, DVA players are generally very awful and still easily countered by bastion at my mmr because they have been playing her like reaper with a jetpack for as long as any of these braindead mongoloids can remember)

    I've probably played the game for some 70 hours and the appeal is really starting to wear off for a number of reasons, primarily that the game is too laggy to be taken seriously on any level as you will find if you spend enough time to find yourself in tough situations where you think reactive quick decision making will make a difference

    but you either like it or you dont

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Pigy View Post
    So i've finally figured out what drives me mental about OW, thing smells more cheesy than gorgonzola.

    It's supposedly an FPS but has multiple instances where you don't aim at all, one would think that aiming is a central part of a shooter, but fair enough.
    And there are sooo many cheesy ways you keep dying in this game, Torbjörn's turret that requires zero input from the player, has "maphack" and "aimbot", symmetra/winston beam and of course the two spawns of satan themselves, spamrat with his skillnades and roadhog and his bullshit lolshot combo with the hook.

    It feels somewhat like quake, except with "for dummies" added in the title.

    Is this common critique for Overwatch or am I just an older generation gamer who want player capabilities to be in center?
    I think the mistake you're making is that FPS = skillful shooting. FPS just stands for First Person Shooter. There's nothing in there that restricts it to aiming or skill. Overwatch is First Person, and you shoot things.

    The other mistake you're making is assuming that in order for a game to be skillful, it requires aiming on the crosshairs. Overwatch has LOTS of skill, but it usually involves the correct timing and coordination of your team's abilities. Choosing the right hero for the right situation.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    winston is ok for what he does but it takes a lot of climbing to get out of an mmr where people still play torb but i wouldn't miss symmetra or roadhog if they were just removed from the game one day and i dont blame anyone for thinking they are some real weenie hut jrs shit for windex drinkers

    The game can be a lot of fun if you don't mind being able to play a handful of heroes and knowing what a heroes' weaknesses are and assessing an enemy player's weakness to counter them (i.e, DVA players are generally very awful and still easily countered by bastion at my mmr because they have been playing her like reaper with a jetpack for as long as any of these braindead mongoloids can remember)

    I've probably played the game for some 70 hours and the appeal is really starting to wear off for a number of reasons, primarily that the game is too laggy to be taken seriously on any level as you will find if you spend enough time to find yourself in tough situations where you think reactive quick decision making will make a difference

    but you either like it or you dont
    How on earth is a D'va easily countered by a Bastion, when her shield isn't based on how much damage she absorbs? Bastions are so easy to handle as D'va, as long as your team knows to stand behind you, and kill the damn thing while the shield is up.
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  17. #17
    Banned Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feederino Senpai View Post
    How on earth is a D'va easily countered by a Bastion
    by being awful? i explicitly stated this but to elaborate they are too stupid to figure out how to use RMB to let their team kill you lmao

    so many DVA players blow dogs for quarters at this game. they get over extended, you notice how aggressively they are playing and punish them for it by setting up behind a corner and reaming their asshole with headshots the second they come into your crosshairs.

    personally i am ashamed of myself whenever i play bastion but i usually get ultimate within a minute of switching to him so that really helps me cope with my scumbag ways
    Last edited by Gandrake; 2017-01-16 at 09:40 PM.

  18. #18
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feederino Senpai View Post
    How on earth is a D'va easily countered by a Bastion, when her shield isn't based on how much damage she absorbs? Bastions are so easy to handle as D'va, as long as your team knows to stand behind you, and kill the damn thing while the shield is up.
    She can only soak for 4 seconds, and it doesn't protect her flanks.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    She can only soak for 4 seconds, and it doesn't protect her flanks.
    4 Seconds is a long time vs a Bastion, if your team cant finish him of in that time, then they suck. Dva is a good pick, and counters a lot of ulties etc in the game, by simply right clicking.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Gandrake View Post
    by being awful? i explicitly stated this but to elaborate they are too stupid to figure out how to use RMB to let their team kill you lmao

    so many DVA players blow dogs for quarters at this game. they get over extended, you notice how aggressively they are playing and punish them for it by setting up behind a corner and reaming their asshole with headshots the second they come into your crosshairs.

    personally i am ashamed of myself whenever i play bastion but i usually get ultimate within a minute of switching to him so that really helps me cope with my scumbag ways
    Then Bastion doesn't counter Dva, Bastion counters an idiot, doesn't matter what the idiot plays, he will always be countered.
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  20. #20
    Banned Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feederino Senpai View Post
    Then Bastion doesn't counter Dva
    Bastion's clip can outlast defense matrix especially if you stagger your rounds and keep her guessing when to use DM and waste it on lag so you have more to shoot at her when it's down and if she tries to get in your face it's instant death

    so while he may not be the hardest kind of counter he definitely forces DVA to drastically change her playstyle which is what it means to be a counter

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