Are Mythic+ changing tomorrow?

[Sámsa]

So, has anybody done a high m+ and can enlighten us on the topic?

Or should we further discuss who has the biggest,raiders oder m+'ers?

[lolpve]

Yes, firstly raiders shouldn't have to grind an absurd amount of m+ to min max. A large amount of top raiders have several pieces of m+ gear equipped. You shouldn't be able to get gear that's competitive with raid drops from dungeons.

Why? Because the only reason you raid is so you have a gear advantage?

Raiding should be for people who enjoy raiding and there should be other content for people who enjoy different things. IMO the best gear in the game should be from the most challenging content which is certainly not raiding.

[Deleted]

Why? Because the only reason you raid is so you have a gear advantage?

Raiding should be for people who enjoy raiding and there should be other content for people who enjoy different things. IMO the best gear in the game should be from the most challenging content which is certainly not raiding.

Well, then we just disagree on how challenging the different types of content are. I'd like to argue that clearing a raid at X item level while it's current takes more effort than completing a +12 with the same ilvl. It's pretty safe to say that the vast majority of people in raiding guilds that have cleared at least heroic have done m+ >= 12, still many of them have yet to obtain a cutting edge, and if they have one, it's from EN which to be fair is a joke in comparison to most old raids. Most people don't even watch videos to clear m+ unless they're aiming for really high levels, on the other hand I'm fairly certain that if videos of raid bosses/guides weren't available, far less guilds would be able to clear mythic raids while they're current.

I definitely think that m+ is a good addition to the game, I'm just opposed to the lack of lockouts combined with the possibility to get such high ilvl drops from them, not to mention the weekly chest. Personally, I'd prefer if the max ilvl from m+ ended up being somewhere in between heroic and mythic raid drops. This is my point of view at least, and I'm not raiding atm, nor do I have any plans to do so in the foreseeable future.

[jaakkeli]

Well, then we just disagree on how challenging the different types of content are. I'd like to argue that clearing a raid at X item level while it's current takes more effort than completing a +12 with the same ilvl. It's pretty safe to say that the vast majority of people in raiding guilds that have cleared at least heroic have done m+ >= 12, still many of them

Heroic raids are totally trivial content compared to +12 mythic+. If your skill level maxes out at clearing heroic level raids your +12 experience is going to be a miserable wipefest where you corpse run bosses to death. These people can still complete a +12 since unlike raids you can zerg a dungeon down one bit at a time as long as you manage to kill something before you wipe. Only bosses might block you and even they are short enough that you can repeat and eventually get lucky enough to kill it.

Most people don't even watch videos to clear m+ unless they're aiming for really high levels, on the other hand I'm fairly certain that if videos of raid bosses/guides weren't available, far less guilds would be able to clear mythic raids while they're current.

Proper raiders don't watch videos for raids either. Raid videos are hardly proof of difficulty, instead they're proof of the ease of the content - you can clear much of raids even on mythic difficulty just by memorizing someone else's guide of do X when Y happens. Somebody has done the hard work for you.

In any case you're making a really silly comparison. The reason there is a market for raid boss guides is that you can only practice the fights when in a raid group but most raid groups will not take you or will kick you at the first sing of not knowing what to do. On mythic+ you have a sliding scale of difficulties starting from normal dungeons to heroics to mythic-non-plus to +... so you can build up your experience gradually. The whole raiding dilemma of "I need experience of the fights to get into a raid but I can't see get into raids if I have no experience" doesn't exist for dungeons.

[Deleted]

Heroic raids are totally trivial content compared to +12 mythic+. If your skill level maxes out at clearing heroic level raids your +12 experience is going to be a miserable wipefest where you corpse run bosses to death. These people can still complete a +12 since unlike raids you can zerg a dungeon down one bit at a time as long as you manage to kill something before you wipe. Only bosses might block you and even they are short enough that you can repeat and eventually get lucky enough to kill it.

And still they're able to clear it within reasonable time, earning them a reward disproportional to their level of skill. Not to mention the possibility of running countless amounts of m+ per reset as long as they have someone with a key.

Proper raiders don't watch videos for raids either. Raid videos are hardly proof of difficulty, instead they're proof of the ease of the content - you can clear much of raids even on mythic difficulty just by memorizing someone else's guide of do X when Y happens. Somebody has done the hard work for you.
In any case you're making a really silly comparison. The reason there is a market for raid boss guides is that you can only practice the fights when in a raid group but most raid groups will not take you or will kick you at the first sing of not knowing what to do.

Unless they truly enjoy creating their own strategies, they sure do - I'm willing to bet that the vast majority of raid guilds, particularly officers/raid leaders, watch videos in order to prepare for bosses (then again, maybe you don't consider these people to be 'proper' raiders?). If the content is so easy why do only a small percentage of guilds manage to kill end-bosses while the raid is current (despite nerfs, over-gearing, videos and so on)?

[Sámsa]

Raids have Sets now
Raids have OP Trinkets (looking at you Draught of Souls)
Raids drop multiple Items per Boss + Bonusrolls

M+ drop 6 4 2 Items according to Chests with a random loot from all bosses in the instance.
---> Your chance of getting sth you actually need is pretty bad
M+ drop a fairly low ilvl above 10 for the time involved

And lastely you won´t be farming m+ > 10 like crazy if you are barly managing to kill bosses on heroic.
And you will be runnning out of keys pretty fast.

If you are able to pull someone through and leech their key that way you will probably be a mythic raider and the whole discussion about undeserved gear is obsolete .

Nobody asks to adjust the gear of lower keys.

All we ask for is that, like with raids, the difficulty rises and the loot with it.

Just add loot für keys >12.

[Tang0]

Front page blue post. So, guess it's 900+ from a +15 and higher OH chest next week?