What's the point of flying half a year away from now?

[Dhrizzle]

Because it doesn't matter how they're different. If your base argument is that utensils help you eat faster and thus shouldn't be allowed, it doesn't matter if we're talking chopsticks or forks and knives and how they're used. Convenience is convenience, and if the complaint is 'it makes content too easy' then the same can be said about other like features. In the end, there is no difference because we are getting flight regardless, so it's clear that none of those differences matter in the end anyways.

The argument isn't "utensils help you eat faster," the argument is "a shovel makes you eat too fast, knives and forks or chopsticks are fine."

Let's put it this way, it would be bad if players had an ability that could one-shot every boss in the game. That doesn't mean we should remove all abilities and force players to just auto-attack.

[Thimagryn]

The argument isn't "utensils help you eat faster," the argument is "a shovel makes you eat too fast, knives and forks or chopsticks are fine."

If that's your argument, then why is Blizzard allowing everyone to eat with shovels in patch 7.2? Because shovels have always had a use other than for 'eating', and Blizzard banning their use just because they want to protect people from 'eating too fast' is a direction I've simply never agreed with.

Let's put it this way, it would be bad if players had an ability that could one-shot every boss in the game. That doesn't mean we should remove all abilities and force players to just auto-attack.

But that's exactly why flight has been removed. Because it's too good at doing the one thing it was never intended to be used for. And rather than design limits to flight but keep it for its intended purpose, they decided to remove it outright. Flight is equivalent to your 'rotation' in this case, your ability to function effectively. Your new rotation isn't fun, the boss was never challenging, and you still have to fight him weekly out of necessity (ie rep grind). This trickles down to other aspects of the game hurting because you've lost a fun set of abilities. The worst part about this? You can have your fun abilities back when the grindy boss is no longer relevant.

Besides, if your argument is ever going to be 'makes the content too easy', then what do you have to say about high ilvl gear making all those mobs and quests a complete cakewalk? Like I said, the repeatable content has never been challenging, so I see no reason why to 'stick with the old ways'. I could easily play devils advocate and say 'Gear ilvl should scale down because it lets you consume content too quickly.', but NOBODY wants that.

I earned my gear, so I should be allowed to use it to practically bypass any challenge in content. With pathfinder, we're already earning the use of flight. I see no reason why a time gate needs to remain. If we applied a time gate on using raid gear outside of raids, it would make the world much more challenging but at the same time be a huge step backwards to allowing people to play the way they want.

If some people are advocating having challenge in the outside world and being paced, then their argument should definitely extend to having gear be limited as well. But who wants to take off pieces of gear to have a little more challenge in their daily AK grinds? They wouldn't, unless Blizzard gated everyone, then they will convince themselves that the new status quo is 'more fun'.

[Wingspan]

I am not sure why content consumption speed is even a consideration in the whole Flight scenario. With all of the various gating in WoW, there is a very negligible net effect. You still need to serve your time in the grand scheme of things... And doing some WQs a bit faster is not really going to throw that out of balance to any degree that matters.

[Dhrizzle]

If that's your argument, then why is Blizzard allowing everyone to eat with shovels in patch 7.2? Because shovels have always had a use other than for 'eating', and Blizzard banning their use just because they want to protect people from 'eating too fast' is a direction I've simply never agreed with.

Because by that point a new course is being served and Blizz don't really mind if people shovel down the left-overs from a previous course.

But that's exactly why flight has been removed. Because it's too good at doing the one thing it was never intended to be used for. And rather than design limits to flight but keep it for its intended purpose, they decided to remove it outright. Flight is equivalent to your 'rotation' in this case, your ability to function effectively. Your new rotation isn't fun, the boss was never challenging, and you still have to fight him weekly out of necessity (ie rep grind). This trickles down to other aspects of the game hurting because you've lost a fun set of abilities. The worst part about this? You can have your fun abilities back when the grindy boss is no longer relevant.

Besides, if your argument is ever going to be 'makes the content too easy', then what do you have to say about high ilvl gear making all those mobs and quests a complete cakewalk? Like I said, the repeatable content has never been challenging, so I see no reason why to 'stick with the old ways'. I could easily play devils advocate and say 'Gear ilvl should scale down because it lets you consume content too quickly.', but NOBODY wants that.

What, to your mind, was flying "never intended to be used for?" As far as I can see it was always there to make your character super-powerful in open-world content. It didn't matter in TBC, WotLK and Cata where the world content was side-activities apart from the main route of progression, but as Blizz seem to want it to be more important (especially in Legion with the gear from world quests) it makes sense to make it less of a snooze-fest.

In your rotation analogy, flight would be the equivalent of having one ability you could spam for maximum DPS (think TBC warlocks.) Sure I can understand why people might want that sort of gameplay but Blizz have come down on the side of people who want something with a little more depth.

Finally, I would be all for making the world content more difficult, so it remains somewhat a challenge even when you've earned some powerful gear, but we're playing a game where people complain about having to fight non-threatening mobs (and inanimate tree trunks,) so I think making them actually dangerous might be more than the player-base could tolerate. Like I said there are aspects of the game that have changed in ways I don't fully enjoy (non-dangerous world mobs being one change) but I don't see the point in moaning about it for several years.

[TheLimonTree]

I don't see the problem with accelerating the rate of completing repeated content. What reason is there for world quest grind to remain paced? The content itself is tedious.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to say flying should be removed forever. I think unlocking it later in the expansion is fine. I merely mean that did have value either through interacting with the world or challenge becomes flavorless when you reduce it down to a point on the map you can reach with ease nearly right out the gate.

[Thimagryn]

What, to your mind, was flying "never intended to be used for?"

Interfering with Blizzard's internal design goals. Flight removal has NOTHING to do with players, and EVERYTHING to do with how Blizzard wants to control the pacing of their content. Instead of larger landscapes that make use of flight, they chose to design smaller, tighter zones that have more to them. The result - flight interferes with design. The reaction - flight is removed.

As far as I can see it was always there to make your character super-powerful in open-world content.

Your character has ALWAYS been super powerful regardless of flight! Lack of flight never made you less powerful. You aren't even necessarily any slower to get from point A to B considering we have more flight paths and alternative movement abilities. Yet what was taken away was the freedom of control in where we could go.

Your character IS a badass and is more of a badass than any previous expansion. Staying grounded makes no sense from RP standpoint to gameplay standpoint.

Finally, I would be all for making the world content more difficult

Agreed, yet it is always a separate discussion from flight. Like I said, gear plays into more of a role in making content irrelevant than flight ever would. Yet the fact is gear doesn't interfere with their level design. Flight unfortunately does. This issue has never been a player-side issue, it is always been on Blizzard's end. Like many others have pointed out, regardless of how fast you do the content, you're still doing the content, and flight doesn't bypass that.

[Dhrizzle]

Interfering with Blizzard's internal design goals. Flight removal has NOTHING to do with players, and EVERYTHING to do with how Blizzard wants to control the pacing of their content. Instead of larger landscapes that make use of flight, they chose to design smaller, tighter zones that have more to them. The result - flight interferes with design. The reaction - flight is removed.

Except Pandaria (with flight) was a really small area like Broken Isles (no flight) whilst Draenor (no flight) was about the same size as Outland (with flight.) You're right that no expansion has had a giant landmass with lots of emptiness like Northrend, but that seems to have nothing g to do with flight.

That said, even if your theory of no-flight = small land was correct it's still being done for the players, they don't purely for the benefit of the development team.

Your character has ALWAYS been super powerful regardless of flight! Lack of flight never made you less powerful. You aren't even necessarily any slower to get from point A to B considering we have more flight paths and alternative movement abilities. Yet what was taken away was the freedom of control in where we could go.

Yes, and that freedom of control that allows you to ignore enemies and obstacles and complete objectives faster is a form of power, one that effects questing as much if not more than overgearing, which is why we have these threads saying people need flight to make the game easier.

Agreed, yet it is always a separate discussion from flight. Like I said, gear plays into more of a role in making content irrelevant than flight ever would. Yet the fact is gear doesn't interfere with their level design. Flight unfortunately does. This issue has never been a player-side issue, it is always been on Blizzard's end. Like many others have pointed out, regardless of how fast you do the content, you're still doing the content, and flight doesn't bypass that.

"The content" is everything you do as you complete your objectives, including navigating the terrain and fighting enemies in your way who may not be directly related to what you are doing. Flight allows you to take off and almost completely ignore the terrain and incidental enemies.

Don't you think it's a but silly to say flight interferes with "level design" but doesn't bypass "the content" as if those are two different things? The peel design is part of the content.

[Thimagryn]

That said, even if your theory of no-flight = small land was correct it's still being done for the players, they don't purely for the benefit of the development team.

It's not a theory. They've been outright blatant about their direction with no flying and level design post MoP. Check any blizzcon and listen to their panels, they outright stated that they began to focus on ground content starting right around Timeless Isles release. No-flight absolutely benefits the team because like I said, they pace content accordingly. They want players to spend a certain amount of time in the game, and this is just one of the ways of doing so.

Yes, and that freedom of control that allows you to ignore enemies and obstacles and complete objectives faster is a form of power, one that effects questing as much if not more than overgearing, which is why we have these threads saying people need flight to make the game easier.

You can ignore enemies already with a billion other means. Blizzard doesn't care about you skipping enemies. Having tons of gear and doing the current pathfinder already allows you to be unaffected by them as a threat. Terrain is the biggest factor, because skipping over it saves so much time.

And why shouldn't we save time? Like I keep asking, what reason is there to NOT speed up objectives? This really only benefits Blizzard because YOU are spending more time in the game dodging enemies that aren't a threat but hinder your progression speed.

"The content" is everything you do as you complete your objectives, including navigating the terrain and fighting enemies in your way who may not be directly related to what you are doing. Flight allows you to take off and almost completely ignore the terrain and incidental enemies.

You do that when you DO the quests. Navigating is a bullshit excuse considering you already skip 90% of that with flight paths. Tell me I'm wrong here and that flightpaths don't ignore mobs.

Don't you think it's a but silly to say flight interferes with "level design" but doesn't bypass "the content" as if those are two different things? The peel design is part of the content.

Because I don't consider travel from A to B to be content. Do you consider using a flight path to be content? If you say no, then you have no real reason to talk about dodging enemies and navigating terrain because you're skipping 90% of your travel from main city to questing area by using them. I mean really if we're really going to talk about that last 10% ground mounting as the reason flight needs to be removed, we have nothing much to talk about.

That's been my whole point from the beginning. Flight should be an alternative to using Flight Paths, and that's where 90% of the travel is relevant. The other 10% is content. Yes, flight absolutely trivializes that 10%, but I would rather Blizzard limit or restrict flight in that 10% rather than completely remove and lock it behind an arbitrary time gate. Limit flight rather than remove it. I want to be able to use flying mounts that I earned. I spent countless hours crafting skygolems, getting the dragon of the shifting sands and farming a headless horseman mount. I should be able to use them upon reaching max level and doing the appropriate unlock quests, not wait till half the expansion is over.

It's literally as simple as talking to an NPC, accepting a quest and phasing the world to no-flight. DONE.

[Deleted]

Because by that point a new course is being served and Blizz don't really mind if people shovel down the left-overs from a previous course.



What, to your mind, was flying "never intended to be used for?" As far as I can see it was always there to make your character super-powerful in open-world content. It didn't matter in TBC, WotLK and Cata where the world content was side-activities apart from the main route of progression, but as Blizz seem to want it to be more important (especially in Legion with the gear from world quests) it makes sense to make it less of a snooze-fest.

In your rotation analogy, flight would be the equivalent of having one ability you could spam for maximum DPS (think TBC warlocks.) Sure I can understand why people might want that sort of gameplay but Blizz have come down on the side of people who want something with a little more depth.

Finally, I would be all for making the world content more difficult, so it remains somewhat a challenge even when you've earned some powerful gear, but we're playing a game where people complain about having to fight non-threatening mobs (and inanimate tree trunks,) so I think making them actually dangerous might be more than the player-base could tolerate. Like I said there are aspects of the game that have changed in ways I don't fully enjoy (non-dangerous world mobs being one change) but I don't see the point in moaning about it for several years.

Please stop with this "meaningful content" bullshit. Travel is not meaningful content, it's a FILLER and TIME WASTE thing.

Every decent movie and story cuts out travel merciless if there is 1) nothing of importance which happens on the way and 2) no meaningful interaction between characters / drama. Why do we have to endure things we already hate from RL, especially in REPETITIVE content?

This is very bad storytelling, this is very bad from the enjoyment perspective. Only people who take MMO-RPGs as character simulation games should be interested in such things, but then they also should walk, not run, because the stamina of their character is limited, and should make breaks so their mounts get a rest etc. But we don't simulate all these things, so why the hell do we get all these roadblocks?

It's not engaging, it's not fun, and falling to your death from a cliff because a lag prevents you from launching a glider, without the option to retrieve your corpse in a sensible time frame, is an insult.

The whole zone design just stinks of a malevolent time sink idea. There are not many things that I want back from Vanilla, but zone design would definitvely be it. Large zones, where you either just can ride around, or fly above if you want to cross larger distances. I hate their claustrophobic mazes.

[Deleted]

I really dont know what people are complaining about, you can teleport to the FP, and the world is small so ground mount is absolutely okay. I hated ground mounts in WoD but I love it in Legion.


I'm pretty sure that when flying hits and people realize how small the Broken Isles actually are, they'll rage and whine hard as fuck ("omglol I paid full price for half the content area or WoD, pmfpaosmfpasomfaopasd" and stuff).

[rda]

I'm pretty sure that when flying hits and people realize how small the Broken Isles actually are, they'll rage and whine hard as fuck ("omglol I paid full price for half the content area or WoD, pmfpaosmfpasomfaopasd" and stuff).

I don't think not releasing flying is a good solution to the Broken Isles being small.

I really don't know, but maybe they could try making them bigger, no?

[Dormie]

You mean like flight paths, goblin gliders and all the other abilities we already have in game that do that?

This is why I don't argue seriously here. There's no way you're not being purposely dense to say that. If you can't see how those things you listed are balanced compared to flying, your either clueless or being intellectually dishonest.

This crap happens all over the forums and it's why I'm a dick. Don't expect me to humor you down your rabbit hole of logical fallacies.

[SirCowdog]

This is why I don't argue seriously here. There's no way you're not being purposely dense to say that. If you can't see how those things you listed are balanced compared to flying, your either clueless or being intellectually dishonest.

This crap happens all over the forums and it's why I'm a dick. Don't expect me to humor you down your rabbit hole of logical fallacies.

Actually, he's making a very logical comparison in order to point out the flaws in your argument. The claim is that flying skips content. The point being made is that there are other things which also skip content. Why is one thing that skips content ok, but other things which skip content not ok?

If your stance is that it's acceptable practice to prevent players from skipping or bypassing content, then why allow any form of skipping at all?

[Deleted]

The biggest pain in the ass in this game is doing shit zones like Suramar city where you have to walk on egg shells and RP that you're Solid Snake ever 5 seconds to avoid the "HNNNGHHH WHO GOEZ THERE?" "WHAT ARE YOU HIDING GUYZ" bullshit, but once we get our artifact power and upgrades and shit why would I ever want to return ehre anyway? Why would i even do daily quests anymore anyway, expect for your rare upgrade and what not?

Why not give us lfying now? It won't change anything most the world is dying in activity now anyway since people finally realize the world quest logo is just another fancy word for "more daily quests that sound different but aren't that different overall"

Hell even the exploration argument is moot since there's exploits to fly around just enough for you to see the unreachable places in the game, so even if i get flying i've already seen everything that i couldn't as a ground mount peasant.

There is none. You will fly after you've done all the content anyway, and then a couple months later Argus is introduced as a no fly zone and that's it. But again, fanboys defended it so you're stuck with it. Enjoy.

[Kazgrel]

Now I can only wonder what will come first: flying in Legion or flying in FF14's Stormblood expansion, heh. I would find it rather hilarious if it were the latter.

[Thimagryn]

This is why I don't argue seriously here. There's no way you're not being purposely dense to say that. If you can't see how those things you listed are balanced compared to flying, your either clueless or being intellectually dishonest.

This crap happens all over the forums and it's why I'm a dick. Don't expect me to humor you down your rabbit hole of logical fallacies.

Take a clear look at your reasons why flight is bad. Apply them to existing elements in the game that function the same way. Again, I'm pointing out how those reasons are flawed. Period.

I'm not saying X = Y. Flight Paths, Goblin Gliders and other abilities are not the same as flight. But they fulfill those same 'skips content' bullshit that you're presenting as being gamebreaking. If Blizzard allows those tools, then it's clear that those are not compelling reasons for why we don't currently have flight; it's a non argument.

We can both agree that flight has negative effects for gameplay pacing, BUT we can disagree in how and why. In this sense, the reasoning of 'Flight bypasses content and needed to be removed' is absolutely moot considering it is a method of travel that could be limited in numerous ways rather than be removed outright.

Let's look at this logically - if we had flight right now, how much of an advantage would you have in completing the catch squirrels/collect nuts World Quest? Unless you're a druid, mounting with flight would likely only save you a menial amount of time overall. The task is not complicated by having flight whatsoever, since your challenge is not based on mobs or terrain but the distance between collectable elements. We've had flight before, we've had collection quests before. Unless you're a ground-only collection enthusiast, this hardly trivializes what is already considered trivial.

I'm currently playing Diablo 3. At the moment, running Rifts is as easy as clicking a button. Running bounties has waypoints that take you directly to the questing zones. Now imagine if they replaced these instant travel methods and forced you to watch a 30s-2m travelling caravan sequence between each hub. Or force you to watch boss intro and death sequences without being skippable. Some people might like that, but for me it takes me out of the game. I want to be in control of my character at all times.

Flight isn't a make-or-break factor for me. But consider this - I'm going to play a progress grind RPG that involves a lot of repeated content and RNG for optimal loot. I'm not interested in raiding, and arguably the biggest thing WoW has unique to it is the ability to fly. Without flight, Diablo 3 (and other RPGs) fills my needs without having me pay per month or wait around twiddling my thumbs. WoW doesn't offer me anything unique to it that I can't fill or replace with content from other games. Flight is literally their most outstanding feature that few other games offer.

While Legion content itself is probably worth paying and playing for, there are plenty other of games I can enjoy and Legion's (non raid) content will always be there anytime I decide to come back to play it.

[Dormie]

Actually, he's making a very logical comparison in order to point out the flaws in your argument. The claim is that flying skips content. The point being made is that there are other things which also skip content. Why is one thing that skips content ok, but other things which skip content not ok?

If your stance is that it's acceptable practice to prevent players from skipping or bypassing content, then why allow any form of skipping at all?

It's a terrible argument which should be apparent to anyone taking 5 seconds to think about it. When people say skipping content is bad they're referring to flying mounts and assuming everyone knows the way one would skip content with a flying mount.

I made this a while ago. Red is the world you interact with with flying mounts, blue is with a flight path:

There really isn't anything else to say. Flying mounts only take you part of the way to fixed locations, not anywhere you want for an indefinite time. Gliders only let you skip downhill parts only AFTER you've made your way to a good takeoff place, and they have cooldowns.

Flying mounts let you lift off from anywhere for any amount of time and drop anywhere. It's completely OP. I will say the flight path whistle on a 5 min CD is a bit OP as well.

- - - Updated - - -

Take a clear look at your reasons why flight is bad. Apply them to existing elements in the game that function the same way. Again, I'm pointing out how those reasons are flawed. Period.

I'm not saying X = Y. Flight Paths, Goblin Gliders and other abilities are not the same as flight. But they fulfill those same 'skips content' bullshit that you're presenting as being gamebreaking. If Blizzard allows those tools, then it's clear that those are not compelling reasons for why we don't currently have flight; it's a non argument.

We can both agree that flight has negative effects for gameplay pacing, BUT we can disagree in how and why. In this sense, the reasoning of 'Flight bypasses content and needed to be removed' is absolutely moot considering it is a method of travel that could be limited in numerous ways rather than be removed outright.

Let's look at this logically - if we had flight right now, how much of an advantage would you have in completing the catch squirrels/collect nuts World Quest? Unless you're a druid, mounting with flight would likely only save you a menial amount of time overall. The task is not complicated by having flight whatsoever, since your challenge is not based on mobs or terrain but the distance between collectable elements.

"skipping content" isn't a big deal. Skipping all the content with no restrictions is. With something like a glider you're actually earning the right to skip that bit of content by being in a good place to use it in addition to actually using the glider well (not hitting mountains or anything).

[Dhrizzle]

It's not a theory. They've been outright blatant about their direction with no flying and level design post MoP. Check any blizzcon and listen to their panels, they outright stated that they began to focus on ground content starting right around Timeless Isles release. No-flight absolutely benefits the team because like I said, they pace content accordingly. They want players to spend a certain amount of time in the game, and this is just one of the ways of doing so.

Yes Blizz have said that they prefer making ground-focused content, but it's not like that's the only way they have to pace content. MoP (with flight) turned players off with the amount of grind whereas WoD (no flight) had players rapidly run out of things to do.

It also doesn't follow that they are removing flight to allow them to make zones smaller when once again Panaria (with flight) was around the same size as Broken Isles (no flight) and Draenor (no flight) was about the same size as Outland (with flight.)

TL~DR theories along the lines of "They're only doing it because [nefarious scheme to save or make more money]" don't hold up when you look at what is actually happening in the game and the simple explanation of "they make it this way because they think it's better" is most likely correct. It's okay to disagree with Blizzard and "anti-flight" people's opinions on what makes the content better, but there's no point trying to spin a fantasy where your opinions are objective facts so there must be something else going on.

You can ignore enemies already with a billion other means. Blizzard doesn't care about you skipping enemies. Having tons of gear and doing the current pathfinder already allows you to be unaffected by them as a threat. Terrain is the biggest factor, because skipping over it saves so much time.

And why shouldn't we save time? Like I keep asking, what reason is there to NOT speed up objectives? This really only benefits Blizzard because YOU are spending more time in the game dodging enemies that aren't a threat but hinder your progression speed.

I think the main reason to not speed up progression is the overall negative response to WoD and how rapidly people ran out of things to do. Obviously there's always going to be some people who want everything as quickly and easily as possible, just as there's always going to be some people who want to face a larger challenge/grind before gaining all their rewards. Taking your argument to the extreme you could say everything in WoW only benefits Blizzard because it's there so that player buy the game and game-time. Should they make all the raid bosses much easier, remove RNG loot so you only have to kill them once or simply post you everything you could ever want, just to speed up your objectives?

You do that when you DO the quests. Navigating is a bullshit excuse considering you already skip 90% of that with flight paths. Tell me I'm wrong here and that flightpaths don't ignore mobs.

I sincerely doubt you spend 90% of your play time on flight paths, you can get from anywhere to anywhere else in a few minutes on the Broken Isles.

Because I don't consider travel from A to B to be content. Do you consider using a flight path to be content? If you say no, then you have no real reason to talk about dodging enemies and navigating terrain because you're skipping 90% of your travel from main city to questing area by using them. I mean really if we're really going to talk about that last 10% ground mounting as the reason flight needs to be removed, we have nothing much to talk about.

Well I do consider traveling (i.e. "The World" in "World of Warcraft") to be part of the content, otherwise they might as well just give us a target dummy that dispenses rewards as you do damage to it.

- - - Updated - - -

Please stop with this "meaningful content" bullshit. Travel is not meaningful content, it's a FILLER and TIME WASTE thing.

Every decent movie and story cuts out travel merciless if there is 1) nothing of importance which happens on the way and 2) no meaningful interaction between characters / drama. Why do we have to endure things we already hate from RL, especially in REPETITIVE content?

This is very bad storytelling, this is very bad from the enjoyment perspective. Only people who take MMO-RPGs as character simulation games should be interested in such things, but then they also should walk, not run, because the stamina of their character is limited, and should make breaks so their mounts get a rest etc. But we don't simulate all these things, so why the hell do we get all these roadblocks?

It's not engaging, it's not fun, and falling to your death from a cliff because a lag prevents you from launching a glider, without the option to retrieve your corpse in a sensible time frame, is an insult.

This is just silliness here. Video games aren't passive entertainment like movies, not everyone hates walking places and taking in the scenery, enjoying riding places and taking in the scenery is not the same as wanting a full on life-simulator. My favourite part of this post is where you describe lagging as you jump from a cliff and die, that's pretty hilarious.

The whole zone design just stinks of a malevolent time sink idea. There are not many things that I want back from Vanilla, but zone design would definitvely be it. Large zones, where you either just can ride around, or fly above if you want to cross larger distances. I hate their claustrophobic mazes.

You either never played Vanilla or you've changed a lot since playing and haven't realised it. No way could you be this annoyed about lack of flying yet find the Vanilla layouts (with one flightpath per zone!) to be a superior system.

[clevin]

Right now they need to release content that revolves around flying.

Not they don't. I've seen a few areas of the Broken Isles from the air (jumping off high cliffs and gliding in Stormheim, flying in Suramar when dead) and they're really quite lovely. I'd be fine with just being able to see the place from the air.

[Thimagryn]

"skipping content" isn't a big deal. Skipping all the content with no restrictions is. With something like a glider you're actually earning the right to skip that bit of content by being in a good place to use it in addition to actually using the glider well (not hitting mountains or anything).

You realize that I've been pushing for 'Restrict flight, not remove it' this entire time right?

Like I said, skipping content is something that should be a right and allowed (eventually, not immediately) regardless. This has existed for all expansions and will continue to do so. Yet Blizzard has found ways to restrict it before with zones like Timeless Isles, early Tanaan etc.

A Glider is nice, but again, it is not a replacement for my hard-earned Flight mounts.