Nighthold difficulty

[Lellybaby]

some of the later fights are not so forgiving if you have a melee heavy roster, which is a bit unfortunately.

Two that were giving us the most trouble were Tich and Botanist, both would be easier with more ranged.

[EzG]

If I were to rank everything (heroic) it would be:

Skorpyron
Anomaly
Trilliax
Krosus
Aluriel
Star Augur
Tichondrius
Botanist
Elisande
Gul'dan

IMO I think everything that is nonlinear is pretty close in difficulty (not krosus) with botanist out on top. I don't feel Tichondrius gave much issue at all from what I saw contrary to what some people have been saying here. Gul'dan was definitely a fun and interesting fight and felt pretty good as a heroic end boss. He felt how Helya should have been as an end raid (not tier) boss, above the others, but not miles ahead.

[adynn]

Tichondrius is also a lot easier with a BrM tank.

Interesting to see if there's a 1 tank strat with them for mythic.

[renatompassos]

Most of the opinions here don't reflect the majority of players. I for example raid in a casual guild with a lot of bad to average players (mechanically speaking because ilvl is definitely not the best measure nowadays, we all know) and this was how our 1st week went: 1-shot Skorp, Anomaly and Trilliax, 2-shot Spellblade, 7-8 shot Star Augur and didn't kill Botanist after 7-8 wipes. Top dps was around 400k and lower ones 250k with most people around 340k. Healers were not that great either. Main tank is the GM and he knows his stuff but yeah.. Normal people suck, that's how real WoW life is.

So I believe for the majority, the raid is tuned just fine. The above average players (huge minority) will usually find things easy, no matter what.

[OrcsRLame]

If I were to rank everything (heroic) it would be:

Skorpyron
Anomaly
Trilliax
Krosus
Aluriel
Star Augur
Tichondrius
Botanist
Elisande
Gul'dan

IMO I think everything that is nonlinear is pretty close in difficulty (not krosus) with botanist out on top. I don't feel Tichondrius gave much issue at all from what I saw contrary to what some people have been saying here. Gul'dan was definitely a fun and interesting fight and felt pretty good as a heroic end boss. He felt how Helya should have been as an end raid (not tier) boss, above the others, but not miles ahead.

I think Tich is all about your healers. Like, if your entire healing team is just rocking it, Tich is easy. If you have any slack the ticking damage from the Carrion Plague can get really out of hand.

[Deleted]

Nom we got stuck because we were following the vid. Then I said we'd be fine when we go back tonight and do it our way.


No, you've just shown you didn't read what I wrote properly for the second time. You are rude and not very good at reading comprehension.

Tell you what, I'll put you on ignore, and you carry on being negative, horrible and poorly read on your own. Bye.

If you got stuck after three bosses in normal you arent as good as you Think. We winged ecerything after trilliax. Missing two bosses in there for sunday. The normal tactics really are deductable after a single wipe

Should have also known better then to trust fat boss alpha guides. Go look at icy veins if you need tacs early

[Isadora]

Most of the opinions here don't reflect the majority of players. I for example raid in a casual guild with a lot of bad to average players (mechanically speaking because ilvl is definitely not the best measure nowadays, we all know) and this was how our 1st week went: 1-shot Skorp, Anomaly and Trilliax, 2-shot Spellblade, 7-8 shot Star Augur and didn't kill Botanist after 7-8 wipes. Top dps was around 400k and lower ones 250k with most people around 340k. Healers were not that great either. Main tank is the GM and he knows his stuff but yeah.. Normal people suck, that's how real WoW life is.

So I believe for the majority, the raid is tuned just fine. The above average players (huge minority) will usually find things easy, no matter what.

I feel like this is more important than most people realize. I changed to a better guild after EN and boy was it a huge difference. My old guild was more of a "family and friends"-guild and it took them months to finally beat EN HC.

If your average dps pulled 300k dps 4 weeks into the expansion, you were way ahead of the curve. In my old raid, 300k dps was, at that point, the absolute top dps.

I'm pretty sure NH HC will give normal guilds enough of a hard time.

[Sarevokcz]

the amount of trash in Nighthold is already getting old and it's been one week. They need to remove some of the trash.

there isnt that much trash, people are just spoiled after EN, where bosses had like 1-2 trashpacks before them and you could reset the whole nythendra gauntlet for months before it got fixed, most raids had more trash than Nighthold

[Deleted]

It is actually 880, yes. But that is exactly the problem here: For every heroic raiding guild it is no problem to have this item level at this point. Even without farming m+ up and down. So the question is: Why is this content tuned for 860-865?

In addition to that: Just from the feeling I had (no hard data) it would have been the same way with ~875.

I am not really complaining about normal difficulty (although the last few bosses felt too easy in general, but whatever, thats fine for me) but about heroic. Again, this content is supposed to last for another ~6 months and I simply do not see that happening for the majority of the players that do this kind of content.

The issue here is that you are not an heroic guild based on skill and gear, you are by choice. What you're saying is that blizzard should increase the difficulty of Heroic simply because some guilds of players with all the skill and gear needed for mythic refuse to enter mythic just because.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Normal was easy but that is what I expected. Heroic has been ok and I feel like we will wrap it up Sunday when we raid again because we just have the last 3 to go.

I mean we crushed normal in one night and their was this strange DC thing going on for half the raid Tuesday.

Thursday we cleared all but the last 3 heroic. Confident we will get the rest and if not at least to the last boss with some work Sunday.

Next reset we will likely work on the first boss or two on mythic depending on how things feel (the first one is usually a push over) and also take a day to clear heroic for gearing / more tier tokens.

Tell you the truth I am not that surprised. I mean mythic level players should only be seriously challenged by mythic content and maybe one or two in heroic if they curve the difficulty arch right. I am happy a wide range of players and guilds have this content to play, enjoy, and eventually progress in.

[Deleted]

We had our first raid wednesday, managed to get 8 kills in normal before running out of time, leaving Elisandre and Gul'dan for sundays raid.
We 1-shot everything except botanist (2 wipes due to people thinking they could skip helping with tactics) and Star Augur (1 wipe due to some failing on tactics). Aiming to clear normal this weekend and then really looking forward to HC!

I'd say normal was tuned about as expected on the first 8 bosses at least.
Our guild raided HC NH right away, got some mythic kills, managed to get HC ToV down pretty quickly too.
Feel like most fights in NH were pretty nice. Reeeeeeally like Star Augur!

[Deleted]

Normal mode is an absolute joke, went in with 22 mythic raiders and 8 semi casuals, cleared it in one night with hardly any wypes.

Heroic starts to pick up once you get past Tichondrius, Krosus is also a really good way to spot a bad player (that orb does not forgive).

It felt like a lot of the fights were first designed in heroic, then gimped of some abilities for normal. Bosses like Etraeus or Botanist just dont feel complete on normal.

Also : Did they buff the trash loot drop chance ? Because last night we got like 6 or 7 in a row before aluriel.

Also again : The fucking trash mobs in this instance, god damn, one shot aoe casting mages even in normal was pretty brutal.

[Dracodraco]

Normal mode is an absolute joke, went in with 22 mythic raiders and 8 semi casuals, cleared it in one night with hardly any wypes.

Heroic starts to pick up once you get past Tichondrius, Krosus is also a really good way to spot a bad player (that orb does not forgive).

It felt like a lot of the fights were first designed in heroic, then gimped of some abilities for normal. Bosses like Etraeus or Botanist just dont feel complete on normal.

Also : Did they buff the trash loot drop chance ? Because last night we got like 6 or 7 in a row before aluriel.

Also again : The fucking trash mobs in this instance, god damn, one shot aoe casting mages even in normal was pretty brutal.

A lot of fights have one ability removed in normal mode, rather than all of the abilities, but gimped down. For instance, Star Augurer doesn't do the Novas in normal mode, and Elisande doesn't do her echo-ability either. This is how heroic->mythic looked in expansions past, usually a single or maybe two specific mythic abilities added that changed the encounter significantly (such as adding the dino's to horridon, or the debuff that electrocuted the water on jinrokh).

That said, Botanist is the one fight where I think all abilities are *intact*, so why it doesn't feel complete to you is beyond me.

[Deleted]

Normal mode is an absolute joke, went in with 22 mythic raiders and 8 semi casuals, cleared it in one night with hardly any wypes.

Heroic starts to pick up once you get past Tichondrius, Krosus is also a really good way to spot a bad player (that orb does not forgive).

It felt like a lot of the fights were first designed in heroic, then gimped of some abilities for normal. Bosses like Etraeus or Botanist just dont feel complete on normal.

Also : Did they buff the trash loot drop chance ? Because last night we got like 6 or 7 in a row before aluriel.

Also again : The fucking trash mobs in this instance, god damn, one shot aoe casting mages even in normal was pretty brutal.

uuh look at him 22 OVERGEARED Players go in a Raid Mode designed for far less ilvl than you have and easy cleared it

what a fucking surprise ...

[Adramelch]

That said, Botanist is the one fight where I think all abilities are *intact*, so why it doesn't feel complete to you is beyond me.

Don't be silly, clearly having 2 Lashers spawn rather than 1 adds a whole new layer to the fight.

[Jingbaby]

we only did normal yesterday and had 2 lasher spawns as well so it may be connected to amount of people in raid (16 for us).

[Deleted]

The dungeon journal states that "a lasher" is supposed to spawn on normal and that "two lashers" are supposed to spawn on HC. I think I saw two spawn every time on our normal kill though, not sure if intended.

[Creekz]

Same here. 21 man Normal raid and we had 2 lashers every time (and many, many, many more lashers when people failed to switch to them ).

[Deleted]

I think the tuning is done quite good, im in a semi-hardcore guild. We went in on first raidnight and cleared 10/10 normal, traded tier sets to the people that needed them the most and called it for the day. Second raidnight we clealed 6/10 HC with no more then 3 wipes on any fights. Our players were mostly prepared for the raid so we didnt have to waste alot of time to explain strats.
Only thing i see as problem in tuning is for the people that arent geared like our guild, are the arcane mobs on Spellblade, we had trouble killing them with BL and quite good positioning of the orbs (mostly mythic geared players). It was really tight and we decided on the second arcane detonation we would just nuke the boss down.
The rest was quite easy to deal with (for now), Tich also didnt feel really like a hard boss but on the other hand, we have really good healers.

[upslash]

All of the bosses are pretty easy on normal.... until we got to Botanist.

Last night we wiped on Botanist 12 times before we killed it. The lashers are rough, and there is very little room for error. I would say that fight is a little overtuned for normal, but that is just my opinion so far. All of the other bosses that our guild has seen were very easy.