Poll: Do you want Shadowstep back?

  1. #5321
    With four set Anticipation is a significant DPS gain instead of a small loss.

  2. #5322
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    With four set Anticipation is a significant DPS gain instead of a small loss.
    Yeah, thats what I was thinking as well, now the question is: with the anticipation bug, what cp finisher should I use for evis for the finality bug? Should I go up to 7 and not risk getting the 4pc proc and overcapping? or got up to 9 for the 36% damage increase on my next evis? I was thinking staying at 7, you will prob buy 1 or 2 extra evis not wasting the CPs. What are your guy's thoughts?

  3. #5323
    From what I understand the bug only occurs with Weaponmaster procs, so its not that significant.

  4. #5324
    Underwhelmed by the 4p. It's only useful in pure ST situations - any point where we're using shuriken storm instead of shadowstrike, it's useless - and unfortunately most NH bosses have large portions of the fight where that's the case.

    In those ST situations though, it is excellent.

    I'm also starting to look into going DS for those multi-target/high hp cleave fights - where NB is a much larger portion of damage and more eviscerates via anticipation doesn't cover the difference. Specifically Botanist and elisande, maybe aluriel, Gul'dan is a mixed bag.
    Last edited by elfporn; 2017-01-25 at 05:49 AM.

  5. #5325
    Quote Originally Posted by elfporn View Post
    Underwhelmed by the 4p. It's only useful in pure ST situations - any point where we're using shuriken storm instead of shadowstrike, it's useless - and unfortunately most NH bosses have large portions of the fight where that's the case.

    In those ST situations though, it is excellent.

    I'm also starting to look into going DS for those multi-target/high hp cleave fights - where NB is a much larger portion of damage and more eviscerates via anticipation doesn't cover the difference. Specifically Botanist and elisande, maybe aluriel, Gul'dan is a mixed bag.
    I had a feeling that would be the case, I'm 3/4 and was actually planning to stay DS even for single target fights once I hit 4/4

    Only really felt worth it to switch anticipation when one got elisande trinket

  6. #5326
    Quote Originally Posted by elfporn View Post
    Underwhelmed by the 4p. It's only useful in pure ST situations - any point where we're using shuriken storm instead of shadowstrike, it's useless - and unfortunately most NH bosses have large portions of the fight where that's the case.

    In those ST situations though, it is excellent.

    I'm also starting to look into going DS for those multi-target/high hp cleave fights - where NB is a much larger portion of damage and more eviscerates via anticipation doesn't cover the difference. Specifically Botanist and elisande, maybe aluriel, Gul'dan is a mixed bag.

    most fights you'll still cast tons of shadowstrikes, the only fight where i barely cast any is skorpyron
    on botanist mythic you wont cast a single Shurriken storm inside dance at least
    on elissande you only really storm when it's both baloons and the boss at one place which is like 10-15% of the fight, hell if i had 4pc and the ring (which i do) i'd even consider shadowstriking on 3 targets as well.

    on our HC guldan firstkill i cast 192 shadowstrikes and 38 shurriken storms, that's still an extra 57 combo points that's 11 finishers
    on our normal elissande firstkill(our HC log got corrupted so cant check) i cast 118 shadowstrikes vs 23 shurriken storms that's another extra 35 combo points that's 7 finishers
    even on HC botanisti cast 71 shadowstrikes and 72 shurriken storms even there it's an extra 21 combo points and 4 finishers
    Last edited by shaunika123; 2017-01-25 at 02:23 PM.

  7. #5327
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    most fights you'll still cast tons of shadowstrikes, the only fight where i barely cast any is skorpyron
    on botanist mythic you wont cast a single Shurriken storm inside dance at least
    on elissande you only really storm when it's both baloons and the boss at one place which is like 10-15% of the fight, hell if i had 4pc and the ring (which i do) i'd even consider shadowstriking on 3 targets as well.

    on our HC guldan firstkill i cast 192 shadowstrikes and 38 shurriken storms, that's still an extra 57 combo points that's 11 finishers
    on our normal elissande firstkill(our HC log got corrupted so cant check) i cast 118 shadowstrikes vs 23 shurriken storms that's another extra 35 combo points that's 7 finishers
    even on HC botanisti cast 71 shadowstrikes and 72 shurriken storms even there it's an extra 21 combo points and 4 finishers
    It's not about shadowstrikes vs shuriken storm, it's about number of finishers vs finisher damage - nightblade in particular.

    On botanist, more nightblade damage should get us further than more eviscerates, on skorpyron, we barely Shadowstrike at all, a max mastery setup is best.

    Elisande it might depend how your guild does it, we've been thinking about cleaving adds instead of burning them, and just running through the wall.
    Nightblade damage is a larger portion there though.

    Best example i have where DS out-performs anticipation is our latest botanist log:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

    Here's krosus, where me and akakage are much closer - He has more mastery than i do by about 8%, and is running DS and has bracers+boots, i ran the guldan trinket here with EoC(i got my 4p from krosus and dropped eoc/draught of souls) with ring/belt and anticipation.

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

    Now we're in the situation where we both have 4p...ill still be just behind because of those damn bracers he has >.<

  8. #5328
    Quote Originally Posted by elfporn View Post
    It's not about shadowstrikes vs shuriken storm, it's about number of finishers vs finisher damage - nightblade in particular.

    On botanist, more nightblade damage should get us further than more eviscerates, on skorpyron, we barely Shadowstrike at all, a max mastery setup is best.

    Elisande it might depend how your guild does it, we've been thinking about cleaving adds instead of burning them, and just running through the wall.
    Nightblade damage is a larger portion there though.

    Best example i have where DS out-performs anticipation is our latest botanist log:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

    Here's krosus, where me and akakage are much closer - He has more mastery than i do by about 8%, and is running DS and has bracers+boots, i ran the guldan trinket here with EoC(i got my 4p from krosus and dropped eoc/draught of souls) with ring/belt and anticipation.

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

    Now we're in the situation where we both have 4p...ill still be just behind because of those damn bracers he has >.<

    on botanist you wont be spreading NB on mythic unless you're the biggest logwhore in existence tho :P
    and yeah while DS might net you more NB dmg, anticipation as a whole will net you way more dances

    i suppose it also matters what relics you use etc, but i think anticipation is just more flexible on most places.

    HC botanist is kindof an anomaly cos you constantly NB 3 targets for half the fight, that's not really how it works on other fights tho.
    and especially in mythic, and longer fights, higher SD uptime will matter a lot.

    skorp is probably the only boss where i'd definitely say DS is better, but that boss is a fucking joke anyway in more ways than one.
    Last edited by shaunika123; 2017-01-25 at 07:47 PM.

  9. #5329
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    on botanist you wont be spreading NB on mythic unless you're the biggest logwhore in existence tho :P
    and yeah while DS might net you more NB dmg, anticipation as a whole will net you way more dances

    i suppose it also matters what relics you use etc, but i think anticipation is just more flexible on most places.

    HC botanist is kindof an anomaly cos you constantly NB 3 targets for half the fight, that's not really how it works on other fights tho.
    and especially in mythic, and longer fights, higher SD uptime will matter a lot.

    skorp is probably the only boss where i'd definitely say DS is better, but that boss is a fucking joke anyway in more ways than one.
    I'm just disheartened because i'm fighting an uphill battle to compete against the competition, and you're definitely right about mythic botanist, i completely forgot it was like the bug fuckers in SoO.

    Anticipation definitely feels better all around, i just keep seeing akakage squeeze by on just the finisher damage when i do more SS/evisc than him....i need those damned bracers.

    We're starting mythic tonight so we'll see how it goes.

  10. #5330
    Don't mean to derail this convo, but just wanted to check and see what neck enchants people use. One source saying Satyr is go-to and another saying Trained Soldier.

  11. #5331
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    With four set Anticipation is a significant DPS gain instead of a small loss.
    Anticipation sims 1k ahead of DS for me with the 4 set and 892 ilvl, which is underwhelming to say the least. I also have close to 100% mastery.

  12. #5332
    Quote Originally Posted by T18Z View Post
    Anticipation sims 1k ahead of DS for me with the 4 set and 892 ilvl, which is underwhelming to say the least. I also have close to 100% mastery.
    I have a similar experience, and I'm 892 as well now. Was 895, but two tier pieces are 875. I have 93% Mastery at the moment.

    It's a DPS increase, but it's barely noticeable really.

  13. #5333
    Quote Originally Posted by T18Z View Post
    Anticipation sims 1k ahead of DS for me with the 4 set and 892 ilvl, which is underwhelming to say the least. I also have close to 100% mastery.
    for me it's 3k, but even if it was dead equal, the convenience anticipation provides is just awesome

    it's also less punishing if you mess up or WM procs the wrong time

    and the longer the fight goes the better it gets
    Last edited by shaunika123; 2017-01-26 at 12:17 AM.

  14. #5334
    Deleted
    Anyone has a spreadsheet with relic and trinket values updated?

    PS: Cloak nerf is coming, you saw first from me

  15. #5335
    Quote Originally Posted by Letalius View Post
    Anyone has a spreadsheet with relic and trinket values updated?

    PS: Cloak nerf is coming, you saw first from me
    Why would the cloak need a nerf? Even with it we can't compete with Windwalker's insane AoE. The big trash pull before Krosus: sure when all trash is massgripped and AoE starts it's easy to pull 10-20m DPS. However once your 30stack is gone - Rets and Windwalkers come in doing constant 2-3m dps while you are dropping down to 1.5m. That's my experience in Nighthold at least. The cloak is good because it makes sub viable for M+ and raid trash but it is far from OP in my opinion.


    For your question:
    http://roguedpsguide.com/rogue-legion-wow-relics-pve/
    http://roguedpsguide.com/rogue-legion-wow-trinkets-pve/

    Credits to Stjern
    Last edited by Todesbote; 2017-01-27 at 09:52 AM.

  16. #5336
    Deleted
    Thanks man, and imo you did answer your question. Cloak is good because it makes sub viable for M+, thus they wouldn't allow that, they'll just nerf the cloak and make sub not viable for anything.
    Last edited by mmoc1711c355d2; 2017-01-27 at 10:06 AM.

  17. #5337
    Deleted
    Not sure where I saw it but wasnt there some guys simming the Soul Shadows relics to see if its an DPS increase with 2p/4p setbonus and said it was?

  18. #5338
    Quote Originally Posted by Letalius View Post
    Thanks man, and imo you did answer your question. Cloak is good because it makes sub viable for M+, thus they wouldn't allow that, they'll just nerf the cloak and make sub not viable for anything.
    So you're saying rogue who haven't the cloak are not viable right now in mythic +?

  19. #5339
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaluna View Post
    So you're saying rogue who haven't the cloak are not viable right now in mythic +?
    He said it, but I agree. Cloak makes sub much more viable for mythic+

  20. #5340
    High Overlord panzaghor's Avatar
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    Only if it's a lower key, cloak is good for bursting down big packs on a +15 the pulls aren't that big so the diff isn't that big since most of the dps comes from nightblade in this case

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