1. #3301
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marweinicus View Post
    I'm just gonna reply to this and not address all points.

    There's a difference between staying near your Rein and throw missiles (Which every noob can do) and playing the flanking Pharah that's usually on her own, and aims to deal with the backline, killing healers. Now that is tough. That's Pharah's job, much like a Genji and Tracer, harass the backline and try and kill their healers without dying.

    A great Pharah stands out much better than for instance a Soldier does. Same goes for a sick Genji or extremely hard to hit Tracer.
    Sure, but the same principles apply to EVERY hero. *This isn't a learning curve unique to Pharah, and she's not particularly difficult to figure out in this respect, compared to other flankers. *Like I said; you can do some crazy stuff with Soldier 76 about getting to spots that aren't expected, but that involves learning to use his rockets to boost your jump and such. *Reaper needs to know where drop zones are, while Pharah IS her drop zone.

    Which isn't saying she's "easy". *I'm just taking issue with the idea that she takes way more skill than Roadhog. *A good Roadhog is ALSO gonna be flanking and getting at people from unusual angles, and his fat ass has no mobility advantages.

    There's so many tricks a Pharah can use that I don't see many others use at all. But then again, I haven't really been up against exceptional Pharah's myself. It's not just throwing missiles and hope for the best. Long-range Pharah = Bad Pharah. Close combat ambush Pharah is what you need to fear. (Unless you spam missiles as the defending team, like a Junkrat spams a certain doorway to prevent them from going in, but those are only a few situations).
    It depends on team comp/awareness. If they're watching for flanking, you'll be dead in seconds. If they don't have long-distance direct damage, which basically means Widowmaker, McCree, and Soldier 76 (Ana too, but if your team's playing right, she's too busy to focus you), she's almost unassailable at long range. And even there, McCree and Soldier 76 have issues with damage falloff and, in Soldier 76's case, bloom. This can make it difficult to take her out at those distances, even with those heroes (and Widowmaker's not really great outside of this one thing, for the most part), while she rains down explosive death. What she loses in accuracy she gains in carpet bombing with impunity and never dying, especially if her team has an Ana or Mercy keeping her topped up (Zenyatta works too, but slower).

    At high comps, people will swap and do their best to wreck this anyway, but that happens regardless of what you're picking.


  2. #3302
    You guys are really too wrapped up in 'categories' for no damn reason. If they took the word category out of the game it wouldn't change the game for you one bit. It's not like HotS where you gets quests to play 3 games as a defender or 4 games as a tank. The only thing that comes close is the all healer game and Sym is essential in that mode as she is one of the few healer class who can break through a defensive team if properly healed.

    I see people demanding characters stay in categories to be about as ridiculous as people who still think blizzard sticks to a pattern when it comes to expansion classes/races. "Oh we are going to get a new race in next expansion because it goes race, class, race, class, race class!" when if you actually spend a moment looking at the facts there is no pattern, blizzard does what it thinks feels right and doesn't follow a pattern at all.
    BC: 2 new races
    Wrath: 1 new class
    Cata: 2 new races, several old races get new classes
    Mop: New Race, New Class
    Draenor: New Character models for most races
    Legion: New Class

    There is no pattern. Anyone who says they don't like X in Y role in Overwatch is really just reacting to an opinion that means absolutely nothing in the game or their experience of the game. It's ridiculous to argue something so passionately when it doesn't effect the game or how you play it at all.
    Last edited by DeadmanWalking; 2017-01-30 at 07:16 AM.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  3. #3303
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    You guys are really too wrapped up in 'categories' for no damn reason. If they took the word category out of the game it wouldn't change the game for you one bit. It's not like HotS where you gets quests to play 3 games as a defender or 4 games as a tank. The only thing that comes close is the all healer game and Sym is essential in that mode as she is one of the few healer class who can break through a defensive team if properly healed.
    The issue boils down to their comp suggestions. Right now, two healers and a Symmetra prompts a "too many support heroes" warning. If it were three healers, I could see that, but Symmetra fills a purpose completely unlike other supports, and much more akin to a Defense hero. Hence the suggestion. I admit it's a minor issue, but it lays groundwork for new hero additions as to which category to flag them in. I'd argue that healers are critical enough they need their own category, though I'm willing to extend "healer" to include preventative "healing" in the form of targeted shields/barriers (Sym USED to have that, technically, with her 25-hp shield buff, but that's no longer the case).


  4. #3304
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    The issue boils down to their comp suggestions. Right now, two healers and a Symmetra prompts a "too many support heroes" warning. If it were three healers, I could see that, but Symmetra fills a purpose completely unlike other supports, and much more akin to a Defense hero. Hence the suggestion. I admit it's a minor issue, but it lays groundwork for new hero additions as to which category to flag them in. I'd argue that healers are critical enough they need their own category, though I'm willing to extend "healer" to include preventative "healing" in the form of targeted shields/barriers (Sym USED to have that, technically, with her 25-hp shield buff, but that's no longer the case).
    That warning is merely a suggestion, there is no effect on the game if you take all healers. Will you win? Probably not, but it isn't like you are unable to enter the game if one of those warnings is lit up.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  5. #3305
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Her turrets main purpose is to slow, then her shield is obviously a shield and both ults are Support. It's only really her gun that's properly for killing, she's fine as Support.
    Those turrets, when set up right, are a death gate that can kill on their own with great efficiency. Both her ults also are a great show of power within a selected area, Kind of the second half of the Defense trademark. Her gun is a powerhouse but not in all aspects. IMO she's about as 'support' as Torbjorn...

    Quote Originally Posted by Daws001 View Post
    That's because the category is mislabeled. People don't want support, they want a healer. Symmetra is the odd duck out. I understand them wanting to make the category more than just "Healer" but...good luck with that.
    Well Sym's the only 'support' who can be outhealed by assaults (Soldier and Sombra) AND a defense (Torb).

    I mean, Symmetra really excels at securing a location and making it hell for another team to take. Drop her shield generator, set up a death gate... and get ready to mop up stragglers with her primary fire.

  6. #3306
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickybrighteyes View Post
    Those turrets, when set up right, are a death gate that can kill on their own with great efficiency. Both her ults also are a great show of power within a selected area, Kind of the second half of the Defense trademark. Her gun is a powerhouse but not in all aspects. IMO she's about as 'support' as Torbjorn...
    Except for Torbs ult being an absolute menace. But, it really, really does not matter. There's no fixed slots in the game in respect to filling a composition, and advice on the select screen is just that advice; in most cases once you know better you know better. The meta now throws 'too many tanks' and 'low team damage' warnings at you. They're completely irrelevant notifications. As I said above, recatagorising her may fix your OCD, but it'll trigger someone elses. The only really relevant categories are Tank, DPS, Healer; but that's not how Blizz decided to break things down.

    While I'm here, if anyone can recommend a new mouse pad?
    Last edited by Jessicka; 2017-01-30 at 11:11 AM.

  7. #3307
    The Unstoppable Force Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    They're completely irrelevant notifications.
    While I'm here, if anyone can recommend a new mouse pad?
    Sorta irrelevant, since they are designed for newer players...but new players come all the time, so idk. It's semi relevant to how Blizzard views the game ideologically.

    As for mousepad? Steelseries is pretty good. This one is nice and not too expensive. If you want to save more money, just go the normal size one:
    https://www.amazon.com/SteelSeries-X...s.gallery.1310
    BAD WOLF

  8. #3308
    The Insane Raetary's Avatar
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    i really love playing sombra.
    https://gfycat.com/MindlessBlondAssassinbug

    i just wish you could get achievement while playing arcade....


    btw, bastion will get a buff.
    https://us.battle.net/forums/en/over...ge=17#post-325

    Originally Posted by Geoff Goodman
    Here are some high level stuff we're likely to have testable in the next PTR:

    Recon Mode - Lowered spread and increased magazine size, to help with general viability in this mode.

    Sentry Mode - We're looking at focusing this mode into more of a tank-buster and barrier-buster mode, while also making it feel less suicidal to be transformed. To that end we're testing stuff like increased spread and removing headshots, but taking less damage while transformed.

    Self-Repair - We've been testing a few big changes to this that are feeling really good so far. Currently our internal build has Bastion able to use Self-Repair while moving and also having it no longer interrupted when taking damage. To balance that out it is now on a resource system (similar to the route D.Va's defense matrix went). These changes have turned this ability from a more niche rarely used ability, to a much more powerful and core survivability tool.

    We're still testing and tweaking things with Bastion but we'll hopefully have a PTR build coming fairly soon so you guys can try it out!


    Formerly known as Arafal

  9. #3309
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witcher arafal View Post
    i really love playing sombra.
    https://gfycat.com/mindlessblondassassinbug

    i just wish you could get achievement while playing arcade....


    Btw, bastion will get a buff.
    https://us.battle.net/forums/en/over...ge=17#post-325

    Originally Posted by geoff goodman
    here are some high level stuff we're likely to have testable in the next ptr:

    Recon mode - lowered spread and increased magazine size, to help with general viability in this mode.

    Sentry mode - we're looking at focusing this mode into more of a tank-buster and barrier-buster mode, while also making it feel less suicidal to be transformed. To that end we're testing stuff like increased spread and removing headshots, but taking less damage while transformed.

    Self-repair - we've been testing a few big changes to this that are feeling really good so far. Currently our internal build has bastion able to use self-repair while moving and also having it no longer interrupted when taking damage. To balance that out it is now on a resource system (similar to the route d.va's defense matrix went). These changes have turned this ability from a more niche rarely used ability, to a much more powerful and core survivability tool.

    We're still testing and tweaking things with bastion but we'll hopefully have a ptr build coming fairly soon so you guys can try it out!
    Be gone Pharah! Be gone Tank Meta! Be gone!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Sorta irrelevant, since they are designed for newer players...but new players come all the time, so idk. It's semi relevant to how Blizzard views the game ideologically.

    As for mousepad? Steelseries is pretty good. This one is nice and not too expensive. If you want to save more money, just go the normal size one:
    https://www.amazon.com/SteelSeries-X...s.gallery.1310
    You're the third person to recommend that mouse pad, so it's ordered and on its way.

  10. #3310
    Pandaren Monk ThatsOurEric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If anything, I'd say Pharah's the bigger issue, than Roadhog. You constantly see people saying "we need a direct damage to take out that Pharah", "Pharah is eating the supports, someone counter her", etc. I never hear the same thing about Roadhog.
    I legitimately hate Pharah more than any other character.

  11. #3311
    I dunno, I think now that people have "figured out" the meta the game feels super stale to me. I was having so much fun and now I just mad when I'm facing the same team comp over and over and our only dps picks Junkrat into their Pharah. Maybe it's only because of my 3k rating but man...I'm getting bored.

    Tank meta plus Pharah/76 has to go, and quickly.
    Bleh

  12. #3312
    The Unstoppable Force Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Don't know how people are complaining about Pharah. If your team has a good Ana, she'll eliminate the Pharah in seconds and then go back to healing everyone. Most of the time I play Ana this season I make the Pharah switch in one minute.
    BAD WOLF

  13. #3313
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Don't know how people are complaining about Pharah. If your team has a good Ana, she'll eliminate the Pharah in seconds and then go back to healing everyone. Most of the time I play Ana this season I make the Pharah switch in one minute.
    Whenever I'm playing Ana, I'm usually too busy to focus on Pharah. She gets attention if I've got a lull, but keeping the team alive comes before playing secondary-DPS.


  14. #3314
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Be gone Pharah! Be gone Tank Meta! Be gone!
    I'm not even sure those changes are even moving in the tank busting direction, seems more like the opposite. Less damage to hit Rein's shield with. All the damage in the world isn't going to do any good against D.va's right click. And Roadhog will still grab him out of his sentry mode and 1 shot him with his new and improved hook.

    Either way its probably not even going to up his pickrate in the higher level leagues where the tank meta takes place. Standing still will always be a death sentence in these games.
    Last edited by Very Tired; 2017-01-31 at 07:14 AM.

  15. #3315
    Quote Originally Posted by Very Tired View Post
    I'm not even sure those changes are even moving in the tank busting direction, seems more like the opposite. Less damage to hit Rein's shield with. All the damage in the world isn't going to do any good enough D.va's right click. And Roadhog will still grab him out of his sentry mode and 1 shot him with his new and improved hook.

    Either way its probably not even going to up his pickrate in the higher level leagues where the tank meta takes place. Standing still will always be a death sentence in these games.
    Recon mode makes him another very viable hitscan hero against the likes of Pharah. Bastion already has a pretty low spread on main weapon and with a bigger magazine to the weapon really helps bring down Pharah. Biggest issue against is that he's such a big counter target.
    Sentry Mode will help very much for long halls and passages to bring down Rein's shield. The spread will be higher which means a giant target like Rein's shield will always be taking damage, yet won't be so overpowered by headshots. Bastion also takes less damage in Sentry mode, not does less damage. If far enough away or behind a Rein shield RH's hook won't ever touch him. These changes allow players to not be forced into feeling like they only have to do Sentry mode to do damage.
    The healing boost will be nice to allow you to heal while relocating instead of being chased down immediately or taking that last Pharah grenade.
    The biggest downside to Bastion has always been immobility to do consistent damage and how big of a target he is. The changes help with 1 of these issues, but the huge target thing will still be a drawback.

  16. #3316
    Mechagnome Maletalana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Roadhog, his hook combo is no longer a combo, that "consistency" basically automated the whole thing. The Hook to Kill conversion must be close to 100% now. It's ridiculous. It's very well saying don't get within 20m but there are such things as chokes and corners and bends that make that impossible for anyone not called Pharah or Mercy; the latter only if the former is playing. It takes 3 players to bring him down. Now, I see people saying 'but heal immobilises him'; it buys him time, time buys help, help saves you. There's no counter play to his 6s hook because the saves that are Zarya's shield and Ana's Sleep have longer cool-downs. He was 'okay' where he was when there was a chance of failure to fully execute the combo. Now, like Symm, he can just tilt half a team from existing.
    I've said it before but I think it bares worth repeating here, Roadhog is a front-line sniper. His purpose is the same purpose as Widow, but with an opposite approach: 1-shot the squishies. Widow 1-shots a squishy if her aim is good. Roadhog 1-shots a squishy if his tracking and aim is good. Now I know, it is more difficult to survive a surprise Roadhog around a corner, than it is to survive walking out into the open where a Widow happens to be already scoped in.

    Do they have a fair and balance tradeoff of range vs close-up when it comes to their squishy 1-shotting? Probs not, which could be addressed, but that is still his purpose.

    inb4 BUT MAL ROADHOG IS A TANK NOT A DAMAGE HE HAS TO PUSH

    Sure, every hero has multiple uses. Some used to say Sym's purpose with those weak turrets was to notify her when a back alley route was being taken, rather than for death rooms.

    Widow's mine can be used defensively, as well as precautionary to guard her escape route, or inform if a side route is being taken.

  17. #3317
    I wish they wouldn't remove mystery duels from the arcade during events. I would already be done with the 9 wins instead i'm grinding the shit out of bad modes and trolls.... i'm frustrated enough...
    Here was a level 85 Enhancement Shaman. Now there is just an epitaph.

  18. #3318
    Pit Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seifa View Post
    I wish they wouldn't remove mystery duels from the arcade during events. I would already be done with the 9 wins instead i'm grinding the shit out of bad modes and trolls.... i'm frustrated enough...
    You must have some really bad luck if mystery duel usually gets you the boxes faster than 3v3 elim

    That or I get unlucky with my opponents in mystery duels.

  19. #3319
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Just shelled out for a new 144Hz monitor, and holy hell its like another world. It's a shade bigger than my old one, but the image is miles better and its so much smoother; feel like my accuracy has improved just immediately. Why did I not do this sooner?

    People still vexxing me though by going reluctant Roadhog or Zarya on defence so we just get rolled. You'd think with multiple levels of prestige people would learn... but then still, backfilled on a group where Genji insisted I heal. They had no tank at all. I guess they don't. Seldom happens for the other team though, but there does always seem to be a Hog now, always, but as Widow he's my favourite target, such a big head and no defences

  20. #3320
    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    I legitimately hate Pharah more than any other character.
    Pharah is bae. How dare you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Just shelled out for a new 144Hz monitor, and holy hell its like another world. It's a shade bigger than my old one, but the image is miles better and its so much smoother; feel like my accuracy has improved just immediately. Why did I not do this sooner?

    People still vexxing me though by going reluctant Roadhog or Zarya on defence so we just get rolled. You'd think with multiple levels of prestige people would learn... but then still, backfilled on a group where Genji insisted I heal. They had no tank at all. I guess they don't. Seldom happens for the other team though, but there does always seem to be a Hog now, always, but as Widow he's my favourite target, such a big head and no defences
    The human eye cannot perceive more than 30 fps
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