Sustaining ST DPS 6min+

[Auberdeen]

Having trouble sustaining good DPS through a few single target boss fights in heroic NH

As one would assume, seems to get sketchy while Nemesis/ChaosBlades/trink on CD. But in my case DPS is dropping far below other DH's in the raid. On pull i'll hit 1.2M through meta, then trickle down to 800+ for about 30secs there after, struggle to stay 600+, and then end up around 450-600k. Feel like I am not managing my potential enough, or am using my abilities incorrectly.

On pull: old war pre-pot -> Felblade -> ArcTornt -> wait till 80+ Fury -> Meta -> Nemesis -> ChaosBlades -> FotI and then just annihation and Felblade.
After meta down: Chaos Strike -> Felblade -> Blade Dance.

Should I be Throw Glaive and Fel Rushing when fury starved, or when I need to be mobile, or does that just lower my DPS?

While meta on CD, should I stagger ChaosBlades, Nemesis, post-pot, trink CD's as opposed to stacking them?

I'm doing it wrong, and need to figure out how and why.

884 4pc T19 6/10H 10/10N NH
34%crit / 15%haste / 29%mastery / 4%vers
Felblade - DemonBlades - First Blood - NW - Nemesis - MotG - Chaos Blades
Trinkets: PvP Versa 1minCD use, Thrice-Accursed Compass(both trash, horrid luck with trinks)

[Zasriel]

Having trouble sustaining good DPS through a few single target boss fights in heroic NH

Couple of things to help out. First, prioritize gear, gems, enchants and food towards crit. 34% is way too low. Even with 4pc that's 44% on CS/Anni, shoot for 40% base.

Secondly, you want to add Death Sweep (Blade Dance in Meta) to your rotation while in Meta. It does more damage than Annihilation.

Third, you do want to use Fel Rush as much as you can. On smaller bosses, if using Fel Rush puts you out of melee range, time it with your Felblade procs. Otherwise, on bosses with larger hitboxes where you can rush from the left side to the right side, should use Fel Rush basically on CD. Also, you should be using Throw Glaive ONLY during complete downtime, I.E. fury starved, or everything else is on CD.

And fourth, I use Meta on pull. Regardless of Fury gen. And don't split up your CDs. Use them all together, later on in the fight. So at the 4min mark, you should be using Meta, Nem, CB, all at the same time. Ideally in that order.

[Stanislav]

Couple of things to help out. First, prioritize gear, gems, enchants and food towards crit. 34% is way too low. Even with 4pc that's 44% on CS/Anni, shoot for 40% base.

Secondly, you want to add Death Sweep (Blade Dance in Meta) to your rotation while in Meta. It does more damage than Annihilation.

Third, you do want to use Fel Rush as much as you can. On smaller bosses, if using Fel Rush puts you out of melee range, time it with your Felblade procs. Otherwise, on bosses with larger hitboxes where you can rush from the left side to the right side, should use Fel Rush basically on CD. Also, you should be using Throw Glaive ONLY during complete downtime, I.E. fury starved, or everything else is on CD.

And fourth, I use Meta on pull. Regardless of Fury gen. And don't split up your CDs. Use them all together, later on in the fight. So at the 4min mark, you should be using Meta, Nem, CB, all at the same time. Ideally in that order.

what this guy said.

1.2mil burst is low for someone doing NH heroic.

you should be around 2mil or atleast 1.5mil if you dont got the waist, can you link a log or something?

also: blade dance > anhi > felblade is the prio.

[Auberdeen]

Couple of things to help out. First, prioritize gear, gems, enchants and food towards crit. 34% is way too low. Even with 4pc that's 44% on CS/Anni, shoot for 40% base.

Secondly, you want to add Death Sweep (Blade Dance in Meta) to your rotation while in Meta. It does more damage than Annihilation.

Third, you do want to use Fel Rush as much as you can. On smaller bosses, if using Fel Rush puts you out of melee range, time it with your Felblade procs. Otherwise, on bosses with larger hitboxes where you can rush from the left side to the right side, should use Fel Rush basically on CD. Also, you should be using Throw Glaive ONLY during complete downtime, I.E. fury starved, or everything else is on CD.

And fourth, I use Meta on pull. Regardless of Fury gen. And don't split up your CDs. Use them all together, later on in the fight. So at the 4min mark, you should be using Meta, Nem, CB, all at the same time. Ideally in that order.

awesome will do.

as for the low crit, i have just been unlukcy with gear, Agi trumps all though, correct?

- - - Updated - - -

what this guy said.

1.2mil burst is low for someone doing NH heroic.

you should be around 2mil or atleast 1.5mil if you dont got the waist, can you link a log or something?

also: blade dance > anhi > felblade is the prio.

it is? now 8/10 and have yet to see any1 burst over 1.4 in first 45secs.

thanks

[Deleted]

With waist 1.4m is low, without waist 1.4m means mediocre crits with annihilation.

[Roibale]

i have no belt and have 1.9m-2.2m burst. The other guys said it before use ur cds directly on pull and use Death Sweep on cd.

[Extremity]

Yes, you should absolutely be using Glaive/Rush when Fury starved. If you do not have enough Fury to Chaos Strike, Blade Dance is on CD (or you also don't have the Fury for that), FoTI is on CD and/or you are holding it for adds (and are ABSOLUTELY SURE holding it is the right thing to do even though you're starved, which it may not be, depends on the situation), then you should absolutely fill the blanks with Throw Glaive or Fel Rush. I generally default to TG first on most fights simply because of current average hitbox size. If I've been starved for a while, the second Felblade comes up I generally Fel Rush immediately before Felblading; I also keep an eye on my swing timer to ensure I'm doing it between swings, but you don't really *have* to go that far.

Downtime is bad. Casters have ABC, always be castin' -- we should have ABS, always be swingin'. You want to be doing something at all times. Your only TRUE downime should be when you have no fury, no FOTI, both charges of Throw Glaive are down, and both charges of Fel Rush are down. That will not happen very often, at all, even with low crit.

As for your crit, I can completely understand. There are tons of pieces that are technically upgrades that have little or no crit on them, including many tier pieces. Remember not to rely 100% on simcraft/Pawn. Even if it says an item is a 9% upgrade, if it's going to cause you to lose more crit than you're comfortable with you may want to trust your instincts over the Sim. I am at around 38.75% crit right now, and it's BARELY enough. If I didn't have 4 piece I'd be entirely screwed; unfortunately, I've gotten pieces that were significant enough upgrades to warrant lowering my crit for them. Now that I'm 900+ I'm trying to slowly work towards those specific pieces I've been eying for my personal BiS list. Don't stress if you lose a little crit on your way to your tier set, just remember not to blindly follow Pawn or sims. You know your toon, you know what it feels like if you do or do not have enough Fury for an encounter, adjust your crit/gear accordingly.

[Deix-EU]

i have no belt and have 1.9m-2.2m burst. The other guys said it before use ur cds directly on pull and use Death Sweep on cd.

Without belt, this is absolute luck OR heavy gear hence should not be given as an example.
1.4/1.5 without belt is what you'll have the most. 2m happens sometimes, even very bad RNG can only output 1.2~.

[Deleted]

Without belt, this is absolute luck OR heavy gear hence should not be given as an example.
1.4/1.5 without belt is what you'll have the most. 2m happens sometimes, even very bad RNG can only output 1.2~.

This. I have got belt and I do 2+ mill burst for a brief moment of time and with 895 eq. If im lucky with crits i'll go to 2,5 mil.

[oneclosetothesun]

In Nighthold it is more important to manage your cd and combine them with boss mechanics, way more than it was in emerald nightmare or trial of valor. You also want to use your legendaries when you have good benefit of them.

For example lets say Tichondrius, I start fight with only nemesis+chaos blade, not using meta, because after the illusion phase where you collect dmg buff orbs, we use bloodlust and my cd on meta wouldn't be ready(nemesis will be rdy), but I gain more benefit saving it for that moment as there is bloodlust and 30% dmg buff from orbs, also boss is near dead after this so there will be no more time to use cd. I also have glaive legendary wrist so I use it on blobs where I get the bonus dmg from hitting multiple targets, same apply for fury of the illidari.

This is just an example, you have to play around it a little based on your raid strats etc. but manage those cd properly and you will get nice perf.

and do not go bellow 40% crit, you will feel difference in gameplay big time, also you want to minimize bad luck on annihilation crits as it will affect your dps alot and it is usually what separate you from other dh in dps meter

[Krobane]

awesome will do.

as for the low crit, i have just been unlukcy with gear, Agi trumps all though, correct?

- - - Updated - - -



it is? now 8/10 and have yet to see any1 burst over 1.4 in first 45secs.

thanks

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&source=128

very easy to hit 2mil single target on opener, and you can see I didn't get that many crits during meta.

[Sarevokcz]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&source=128

very easy to hit 2mil single target on opener, and you can see I didn't get that many crits during meta.

its a norm for someone with a belt and BL at start, I spiked 2.8M on Krosus, too, but pulls without BL on start, I can range from 1.3 to 2.1M depending on luck, anyone without the belt can probably have 1M pull easily.

[Deix-EU]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...one&source=128

very easy to hit 2mil single target on opener, and you can see I didn't get that many crits during meta.

With belt, trinket and 36k agi, you don't say ?

[MisterBigglez]

With belt, trinket and 36k agi, you don't say ?

Not to mention 4pc also

[Raiju]

You can point out all his advantages but he still did over 2m peak on the burst with prolonged power. I have belt / 4 set / elemental foci / 33k agi and using old war on krosus open over 3m peak.

My crit before fiery enchant is 40.32% (so 50.32% for CS) - my opening annihilation critrate as 52% with a fiery enchant & over the fight 47% annihilation & 49% CS

The guy you're looking at only had a 33% crit on annihilation WITH the fiery enchant proc. KJBW did less than 4% of his opening damage.

TL;DR if you're in 895+ gear region there's no reason you can't be aiming for 2m openers without the ideal pieces.

[Sarevokcz]

You can point out all his advantages but he still did over 2m peak on the burst with prolonged power. I have belt / 4 set / elemental foci / 33k agi and using old war on krosus open over 3m peak.

My crit before fiery enchant is 40.32% (so 50.32% for CS) - my opening annihilation critrate as 52% with a fiery enchant & over the fight 47% annihilation & 49% CS

The guy you're looking at only had a 33% crit on annihilation WITH the fiery enchant proc. KJBW did less than 4% of his opening damage.

TL;DR if you're in 895+ gear region there's no reason you can't be aiming for 2m openers without the ideal pieces.

the opener isnt some rocket science, either you get procs and crits or you dont, and either you have the belt or not, its that simple.

[Raiju]

the opener isnt some rocket science, either you get procs and crits or you dont, and either you have the belt or not, its that simple.

Getting a trinket proc at the start of the fight isn't particularly lucky, and as I explained his critrate was far below, and the example I used from myself was on par.

The point is people are saying 2m is impossible to hit without the belt / rng / whatever, which is BS. If you're decently geared you should be expecting 2m without the belt.

It's not rocket science but the most common issue I see with DH gameplay is people fuck up the opener / burst windows. It's what the entire spec is about with chaos blades, but people mess it up doing... something.

[Deix-EU]

Getting a trinket proc at the start of the fight isn't particularly lucky, and as I explained his critrate was far below, and the example I used from myself was on par.

The point is people are saying 2m is impossible to hit without the belt / rng / whatever, which is BS. If you're decently geared you should be expecting 2m without the belt.

It's not rocket science but the most common issue I see with DH gameplay is people fuck up the opener / burst windows. It's what the entire spec is about with chaos blades, but people mess it up doing... something.

It's not like ilvl means nothing. You can have 895 with shitty stats, that's all about this expension because of the diablo like way of gear.
Expect 1.5M average yes, not 2M. I do it, but when lucky with crit / fury gen. Even having full spam Anni / Death Sweep is lucky. If sometimes you don't have 5 sec without fury / Felblade proc on opening, well congratz on your luck. We speak about average here, not "achievable" not to give "hope" or "judgment feeling" for some players. in 894 ilvl with less than 40% and 31k agi I do 2M burst with old war, but 1 out of 5 opening, with ring and chest leg. This is not "average".

And don't forget he has also new trinket. It's absolute for burst.

[Extremity]

I agree, it's very luck dependant. I've had openers where I flat out didn't crit for 8+ abilities in a row and was gasping for Fury for almost half of Meta's duration. It's what sucks about being balanced around crits; when you don't get them, you're screwed. I'm around 40% baseline (just shy) crit with 4 piece, and still I get long streaks of unlucky crits/DB procs. The problem with having a terrible opener is you're pretty much guaranteed to have a terrible attempt. Even if after the opener I do extremely well, you never really quite catch up. We rely 100% on that absurd burst at the pull, so having a bad one REALLY sucks.

And the belt is tremendous. We frontload so much of our damage at the pull that the belt is a bigger DPS increase for us than anybody else. There are Demon Hunters in my guild that have the belt (I do not) that can keep up with me, or even beat me if they're lucky and I'm not, on the opener with 10 fewer item levels and no tier bonuses. 30% more damage at a point you're doing 3-5 times normal DPS is absurd... and on bosses that have artificially longer health bars, such as Odyn, it's even crazier.

[actiwe]

I agree, it's very luck dependant. I've had openers where I flat out didn't crit for 8+ abilities in a row and was gasping for Fury for almost half of Meta's duration. It's what sucks about being balanced around crits; when you don't get them, you're screwed. I'm around 40% baseline (just shy) crit with 4 piece, and still I get long streaks of unlucky crits/DB procs. The problem with having a terrible opener is you're pretty much guaranteed to have a terrible attempt. Even if after the opener I do extremely well, you never really quite catch up. We rely 100% on that absurd burst at the pull, so having a bad one REALLY sucks.

And the belt is tremendous. We frontload so much of our damage at the pull that the belt is a bigger DPS increase for us than anybody else. There are Demon Hunters in my guild that have the belt (I do not) that can keep up with me, or even beat me if they're lucky and I'm not, on the opener with 10 fewer item levels and no tier bonuses. 30% more damage at a point you're doing 3-5 times normal DPS is absurd... and on bosses that have artificially longer health bars, such as Odyn, it's even crazier.

The belt is 3% overall damage increase on a ST fight, no matter if you are DH or another leather class.