Poll: Do you want Shadowstep back?

  1. #5421
    Quote Originally Posted by Letalius View Post
    Could you elaborate please?
    Energetic stabbing trait is roughly 35-37ilvls worth of equivalency.

    Evis crit trait is worth roughly 25ilvls worth of equivalency.

    The ES relic is 880, the evis crit is 900, the evis crit is better overall as 900+25 = 925 vs 880 + 35 or 37 = 915/917.

    Also ES relics are useless for AoE, so that's another bonus to using the evis crit relic.

  2. #5422
    With sub boots, how many energetic stabing relics do we need, is their value decreased or sommthing?
    How much energy do we need to pool?

    Thx!

  3. #5423
    Quote Originally Posted by Ainurr View Post
    With sub boots, how many energetic stabing relics do we need, is their value decreased or sommthing?
    How much energy do we need to pool?

    Thx!
    ES relics lose about 5ilvls worth when you have the boots and gutripper gains slightly more value than before. There's no specific amount of ES relics needed for the spec, and in regards to energy pooling 70 is fine with the boots and 75 without.

  4. #5424
    Quote Originally Posted by T18Z View Post
    ES relics lose about 5ilvls worth when you have the boots and gutripper gains slightly more value than before. There's no specific amount of ES relics needed for the spec, and in regards to energy pooling 70 is fine with the boots and 75 without.
    having the boots actually makes ES better since you get more SSs out ergo you get more overall energy from it

  5. #5425
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    having the boots actually makes ES better since you get more SSs out ergo you get more overall energy from it
    Really doubt that is the case. I haven't looked since the nerf, but previously the boots plummeted the value of Energetic Stabbing, and even without the boots two Energetic Stabbing relics was enough to drop it below some others in value.

  6. #5426
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Really doubt that is the case. I haven't looked since the nerf, but previously the boots plummeted the value of Energetic Stabbing, and even without the boots two Energetic Stabbing relics was enough to drop it below some others in value.
    yes but the boots dont overflow your energy anymore, so ES is still by far and away the best for them

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...view?sle=true#

    you can check how the boots make them slightly better

  7. #5427
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    yes but the boots dont overflow your energy anymore, so ES is still by far and away the best for them

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...view?sle=true#

    you can check how the boots make them slightly better
    1) A spreadsheet showing the addition of one relic is not going to be very accurate. You need to sim having zero relics and adding one, having one relic, and adding one, and having two relics, and adding one. Previously I found that without boots or any legendaries, Energetic Stabbing dropped below third place for the third relic.

    2) Even your spreadsheet shows it dropping with legendary boots. It goes from 1.56% to 1.46%.

    I would seriously suggest simming two Energetic Stabbing + Gutripper vs three Energetic Stabbing though. I'll do it later after work but I'm fairly sure three Energetic Stabbing will be worse, possibly even just two will be worse.

  8. #5428
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    having the boots actually makes ES better since you get more SSs out ergo you get more overall energy from it
    Not really how it works, their value is decreased with the boots alone, which it clearly shows on the spreadsheet you linked.

  9. #5429
    Quote Originally Posted by T18Z View Post
    Not really how it works, their value is decreased with the boots alone, which it clearly shows on the spreadsheet you linked.
    yeah kinda misread it, wasnt looking at the % diffs just the ilvl

    it's still bis tho

    the decrease in value isnt even close to reducing it's effectiveness to warrant not using it
    yes i t might be worth not using a 3rd ES relic, but there isnt a single one in NH anyway so we'd be more than happy with two as it is.
    Last edited by shaunika123; 2017-02-14 at 06:27 PM.

  10. #5430
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    it's still bis tho
    Just simmed myself, and here are my results:

    3x Ghost Armor (worthless): 555372 dps
    3x Energetic Stabbing: 574490 dps
    3x Gutripper: 573548 dps
    2x Gutripper, 1x Energetic Stabbing: 575558 dps
    2x Energetic Stabbing, 1x Gutripper: 575998 dps

    Each sim was done with 50k iterations, so it should be fairly accurate.

    So Energetic Stabbing does fall off quite a bit after the first one for me. Considering it has no effect on multi target I'd prefer 1x Energetic Stabbing and two non-energetic stabbing relics of either Gutripper/Demon's Kiss.

    Edit: I was in my mythic+ set which only uses 2pc and higher ilvl gear. Energetic Stabbing is overvalued in these results, and its likely not optimal to have more than one even on single target.

    Edit2:
    Important bits in my raid set:

    2x Gutripper, 1x Energetic Stabbing: 600361 dps
    2x Energetic Stabbing, 1x Gutripper: 600453 dps

    So not quite as good still, but its easy to see more than one energetic stabbing is not worth it in my gear.
    Last edited by Maelstrom51; 2017-02-15 at 03:34 AM.

  11. #5431
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Just simmed myself, and here are my results:

    -snip-
    And what about Soul Shadows relics. Is it worth it to have 3 only with CoF or you have to have both CoF and bracers?

    Currently running with 2xES and 1xNB + CoF and it seems ok.

    Just curious what is the general approach, I'll probably sim it before today's raid.

  12. #5432
    Quote Originally Posted by Tataracek View Post
    And what about Soul Shadows relics. Is it worth it to have 3 only with CoF or you have to have both CoF and bracers?

    Currently running with 2xES and 1xNB + CoF and it seems ok.

    Just curious what is the general approach, I'll probably sim it before today's raid.
    I have no idea, sorry.

  13. #5433
    can someone please tell me why i suck

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...-done&fight=11

    dont count spellblade because my parse was great on that fight, im talking every other fight - im running anticipation and mos, maybe i need to switch to weaponmaster?

    any help is appreciated

    edit: im simming at 575 with weaponmaster however, and 585 with mos
    Last edited by Rixan; 2017-02-17 at 04:13 AM.

  14. #5434
    I got my 4th legendary, and it's the shoulders. Was hoping cloak or bracers but that's life. Is it any good? Is it better then cinidaria? Do I have to use sprint as dps cd now if I want to use them?

  15. #5435
    Quote Originally Posted by cface View Post
    I got my 4th legendary, and it's the shoulders. Was hoping cloak or bracers but that's life. Is it any good? Is it better then cinidaria? Do I have to use sprint as dps cd now if I want to use them?
    when used to it's full potential it's our best legendary

    yes use sprint offensively whenever you can

  16. #5436
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    when used to it's full potential it's our best legendary

    yes use sprint offensively whenever you can
    Any tips on how to use it to its full potential? Does simulationcraft sim it properly? Before I enter stealth, what condition should I be in regarding cp, finality etc? Anyone already written an article on how to use it ?
    Sorry, that was a lot of question, but it got me triggered.

  17. #5437
    Quote Originally Posted by cface View Post
    Any tips on how to use it to its full potential? Does simulationcraft sim it properly? Before I enter stealth, what condition should I be in regarding cp, finality etc? Anyone already written an article on how to use it ?
    Sorry, that was a lot of question, but it got me triggered.
    well the buff lasts 9 seconds due to subterfuge
    so what you want to do is 2x shadowstrike+evis and then get a full dance out before it expires
    same with vanish

  18. #5438
    Quote Originally Posted by Rixan View Post
    can someone please tell me why i suck

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...-done&fight=11

    dont count spellblade because my parse was great on that fight, im talking every other fight - im running anticipation and mos, maybe i need to switch to weaponmaster?

    any help is appreciated

    edit: im simming at 575 with weaponmaster however, and 585 with mos

    Would seriously appreciate someone experienced looking at this, trying to understand how I go from parsing 99% in one fight to 50-60% in most others, especially when last week I was running deeper strat instead of anticipation and parsing 75-85% most encounters

    Would be greatly in your debt

  19. #5439
    As someone currently leveling my rogue as a main alt, is sub considered the "difficult" rogue spec comparing all 3 specs?

    I started leveling as Assa which is obviously not optimal but its been the fotm spec and i'll be using it in alt raids. However as it'll also be used in mythic+ alot I figured the more involved rotation of sub interests me considering its like the middle ground of ST/AoE between Assa and Combat.

    From my outsider point of view having read Icy veins for all 3 specs, in terms of "difficulty" rogue specs are like Assa < Combat < Sub with the latter being the toughest. Am I right in that?

  20. #5440
    Deleted
    Everyspec is easy and I'd say outlaw is the most difficult one. Not arguing just my impression.
    As for Rixan, many raiders are using DFA on tichondrius, skorpyron and so on in order to top the logs.

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