Need advice as a raid leader

[kamuimac]

I'm a raid leader in a social guild on an RP realm, and we've mostly done mythic+ until recently. I want to get into heroic and mythic NH, and a few people seem to also want more progression. However, we have a huge problem with under performance. Instead of profession this week, we regressed and couldn't even get heroic Trilliax or normal Gul'Dan down this week when we'd killed both on previous weeks.

I've tried to be Mr. Mean and required 350k dps for heroic, along with saying people who die to fire get benched. It's hard to enforce those things though when it's co-GMs who are screwing up. And I get called an elitist and a terrible person for wasting people's time when they get kicked from raids.

I study my class and pull dps in 90th percentile and it shows me at 95-97 for my bracket. (this is normal mode as we haven't gotten anything past Trilliax on heroic). There are a rogue and warlock who also parse high. We still die to enrage timers or get super clutch kills. If I kick low dps, I get called out and the GM invites them back for another go so they don't gquit. She's a lot more forgiving than I...

I just don't know how to get people in shape for heroic progression. I learned my class by watching a bunch of guides. If I link guides to people, they just say their dps is low because they don't have Legendary XYZ. And some people pull very high in mythic plus and bad damage in raids.

seems to me like you are the rong fit in this guild not they - they are clearly super casual and you want more - either accpet their rules or find a new guild -

[Deleted]

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I've tried to be Mr. Mean and required 350k dps for heroic.

350k is ok to run EN heroic(well, maybe a bit less tbh), not NH. Are there still ppl who cant do more than 350k? I mean, I'm not in super mega uber hardcore raiding guild, but 350k wasn't even enough for mythic ursoc in the early legion days, when ppl whad 850+ gear. Now lfr rewards 855 items. Btw whats the point of raiding normal or hc if you can't even play properly? If they play minesweeper, do they click random boxes and consider it "fun" or what? Am i missing something from the game?

[kamuimac]

350k is ok to run EN heroic(well, maybe a bit less tbh), not NH. Are there still ppl who cant do more than 350k? I mean, I'm not in super mega uber hardcore raiding guild, but 350k wasn't even enough for mythic ursoc in the early legion days, when ppl whad 850+ gear. Now lfr rewards 855 items. Btw whats the point of raiding normal or hc if you can't even play properly? If they play minesweeper, do they click random boxes and consider it "fun" or what? Am i missing something from the game?

are you trying to look ignorant on purpose ? OP is talking about super casual guild not mythic guild doin early mythic progress - there are ton of guilds where 350k ST is considered as not so bad dps.

[sourmonkey]

I'm a raid leader in a social guild on an RP realm, and we've mostly done mythic+ until recently. I want to get into heroic and mythic NH, and a few people seem to also want more progression. However, we have a huge problem with under performance. Instead of profession this week, we regressed and couldn't even get heroic Trilliax or normal Gul'Dan down this week when we'd killed both on previous weeks.

I've tried to be Mr. Mean and required 350k dps for heroic, alon g with saying people who die to fire get benched. It's hard to enforce those things though when it's co-GMs who are screwing up. And I get called an elitist and a terrible person for wasting people's time when they get kicked from raids.

I study my class and pull dps in 90th percentile and it shows me at 95-97 for my bracket. (this is normal mode as we haven't gotten anything past Trilliax on heroic). There are a rogue and warlock who also parse high. We still die to enrage timers or get super clutch kills. If I kick low dps, I get called out and the GM invites them back for another go so they don't gquit. She's a lot more forgiving than I...

I just don't know how to get people in shape for heroic progression. I learned my class by watching a bunch of guides. If I link guides to people, they just say their dps is low because they don't have Legendary XYZ. And some people pull very high in mythic plus and bad damage in raids.

Recruit to fill raid spots , setup a night for tryouts and do normal NH and check the logs of that . This gives current guildies the opportunity to prove they worked on their class also proves new recruits know how to play .

We clear normal NH in 2hrs so it shouldn't be difficult to use that as a benchmark

[Kazuchika]

are you trying to look ignorant on purpose ? OP is talking about super casual guild not mythic guild doin early mythic progress - there are ton of guilds where 350k ST is considered as not so bad dps.

Yeah in guilds that never plan on progressing past normal maybe.

[potis]

I am not sure if people can read.

He clearly said, himself and a few others feel like they could do more and they arent, because you know, carrying too much "luggage" while the "luggage" also want to do more, but they wont do anything to improve themselves.

To you OP since i am in a similar position.

There is nothing you can do, the only things you can do:

1)Gquit, find another guild.

2)Stop raiding with them, find a guild and their "alt raid" and request to join those days.

3)Stop raiding with them and PuG.

4)Keep raiding with them, and simply leave the group when you think they capped out, its a social guild they should forgive you, right? Socials are all about that, reality is they will get butthurt and start calling you out

The problem is, most people, online and in these forums dont realize that Nighthold was made with a few "requirements" in sense of Enrage meters/Add health and if your group doesnt meet those requirements, they cant progress.

And those requirements are not for the casual/afker/luggage type of player, it requires a minimal dedication to the game.

[Deleted]

Mmo-Champion never and i say never deludes me. I mean, the most of you poster are shitting on the Guild, when the only solution for the OP is to leave the Guild. For fuck sake it's a social guild, why you need to come here and say "Drop the noobs, drop the plebs on the dirt etc.".
Just accept that some people just don't care to do high dps or raid hc and mythic (or raid at all). I mean, it's not like the Guild want to do hc or myt, it's only the OP and a really small number of members (as far as we know).

To OP, just change Guild, there are a lot of guild starving for mythic players, you just have to choose.

[potis]

Mmo-Champion never and i say never deludes me. I mean, the most of you poster are shitting on the Guild, when the only solution for the OP is to leave the Guild. For fuck sake it's a social guild, why you need to come here and say "Drop the noobs, drop the plebs on the dirt etc.".
Just accept that some people just don't care to do high dps or raid hc and mythic (or raid at all). I mean, it's not like the Guild want to do hc or myt, it's only the OP and a really small number of members (as far as we know).

To OP, just change Guild, there are a lot of guild starving for mythic players, you just have to choose.

Lets use logic.

I wanna play professional soccer but i refuse to learn soccer and work out.

I also wanna play NBA but i am refuse to learn basketball.

I also want to fix my car but i got no money so i am gonna be staring at it until it fixes itself.

OP's guild -is- the problem because its obviously full of players, including the GM that refuse to improve, yet want to participate.

There is a big difference between "I accept that i am casual and refuse to improve" versus "Carry me, i am casual, i pay and i am in this guild" mentality that exists in the "Social guilds".

Whether people like it or not, Normal NH last 3 bosses and HC NH after the first 3 bosses have -requirements- that if they are not met, you can not progress.

Emerald Nightmare spoiled everyone believing they can do anything, while Nighthold reminded them, and now every "social casual guild" cant do shit.

Every "Mythic guild" can barely progress after Trilliax.

[Deleted]

Lets use logic.

I wanna play professional soccer but i refuse to learn soccer and work out.

I also wanna play NBA but i am refuse to learn basketball.

I also want to fix my car but i got no money so i am gonna be staring at it until it fixes itself.

OP's guild -is- the problem because its obviously full of players, including the GM that refuse to improve, yet want to participate.

There is a big difference between "I accept that i am casual and refuse to improve" versus "Carry me, i am casual, i pay and i am in this guild" mentality that exists in the "Social guilds".

Whether people like it or not, Normal NH last 3 bosses and HC NH after the first 3 bosses have -requirements- that if they are not met, you can not progress.

Emerald Nightmare spoiled everyone believing they can do anything, while Nighthold reminded them, and now every "social casual guild" cant do shit.

Every "Mythic guild" can barely progress after Trilliax.

from the OP:
I'm a raid leader in a social guild on an RP realm, and we've mostly done mythic+ until recently. I want to get into heroic and mythic NH

Please, read carefylly before post. Op guild is forced to partecipate. That's why you can't expect them to do better. They don't want to do better, and that's why the only solution for the OP is to CHANGE GUILD.

[clevin]

Lets use logic.

I wanna play professional soccer but i refuse to learn soccer and work out.

I also wanna play NBA but i am refuse to learn basketball.

People like you mystify me. They DO NOT want to do the raiding equivalent of playing pro sports. They're perfectly fine playing rec league level stuff, i.e. normal difficulty. It's OP and a few others who want more.

I want to get into heroic and mythic NH, and a few people seem to also want more progression.I want to get into heroic and mythic NH, and a few people seem to also want more progression.

reading comprehension people. Use it. It keeps you from posting irrelevant, misguided arguments.

[Deleted]

People like you mystify me. They DO NOT want to do the raiding equivalent of paling pro sports. They're perfectly fine playing rec league level stuff. It's OP and a few others who want more.

reading comprehension people. Use it. It keeps you from posting irrelevant, misguided arguments.

+1 /10char

[Emerald Archer]

350k is ok to run EN heroic(well, maybe a bit less tbh), not NH. Are there still ppl who cant do more than 350k? I mean, I'm not in super mega uber hardcore raiding guild, but 350k wasn't even enough for mythic ursoc in the early legion days, when ppl whad 850+ gear. Now lfr rewards 855 items. Btw whats the point of raiding normal or hc if you can't even play properly? If they play minesweeper, do they click random boxes and consider it "fun" or what? Am i missing something from the game?

Just a note, 300k was the dps requirement to beat ursocs enrage timer. Pretty sure 350 is way way way more than enough for herioc EN.

[potis]

from the OP:
I'm a raid leader in a social guild on an RP realm, and we've mostly done mythic+ until recently. I want to get into heroic and mythic NH

Please, read carefylly before post. Op guild is forced to partecipate. That's why you can't expect them to do better. They don't want to do better, and that's why the only solution for the OP is to CHANGE GUILD.

Selective reading i see, how about you post the other 4-5 words after that.

[clevin]

Yeah in guilds that never plan on progressing past normal maybe.

Which is what this guild is OK with.

[potis]

People like you mystify me. They DO NOT want to do the raiding equivalent of playing pro sports. They're perfectly fine playing rec league level stuff, i.e. normal difficulty. It's OP and a few others who want more.


reading comprehension people. Use it. It keeps you from posting irrelevant, misguided arguments.

No its not, if they didnt they would quit the raid or never join it in the first place when the OP already explained he has a "minimum requirement" as he said so himself.

Its just a guild of people expecting to get carried, since they appeared on the HC raiding day, it means they want to raid HC, despite not being able to.

[clevin]

Selective reading i see, how about you post the other 4-5 words after that.

I did. You're still wrong.

[Deleted]

Selective reading i see, how about you post the other 4-5 words after that.

Sure smartypants:

and a few people seem to also want more progression.

Few people (not even the GM is among them) = a whole guild.

Shut the hell up next time please.

[clevin]

No its not, if they didnt they would quit the raid or never join it in the first place when the OP already explained he has a "minimum requirement" as he said so himself.

Its just a guild of people expecting to get carried, since they appeared on the HC raiding day, it means they want to raid HC, despite not being able to.

Go re-read the OP. OP and a FEW others want more. That means most don't.

This isnt hard. The entire raid can change, the guild can bend to OP... or OP can man the fuck up and leave if he's as hot shit as he claims.

[potis]

I did. You're still wrong.

I know i am not wrong cause i have been in social guilds.

There is nothing social about it, its literally "carry me" players, my opinion cant be changed cause i had the experience a few times, there is nothing about "not wanting to do more".

They WANT to do more, without ANY EFFORT.

If they didnt want more, they would accept the raid leaders decision like adults and get the fuck out of the raid.

But according to the OP, they barely do that themselves and when he does it, he is the mean guy.

Its simply players that WANT MORE WITHOUT EFFORT.

[clevin]

I know i am not wrong cause i have been in social guilds.

There is nothing social about it, its literally "carry me" players, my opinion cant be changed cause i had the experience a few times, there is nothing about "not wanting to do more".

They WANT to do more, without ANY EFFORT.

So now you know what other people think, eh? Go away child, adults are talking here. We're taking OP's words at face value. When they don't support your BS, you do this "well I know what's really going on" despite the fact that you're not in that raid. Making shit up isnt an argument.

Oh and note... OP hasn't ever come back to this thread. Hmm.