Should the game have MORE exclusive content?

[Hctaz]

No, because what you're talking about here exclusivity by means of restriction. When content was gated from one to the other you had to clear T4 to get access to T5 to get access to T6. That kind of content cannot exist in the world of MMORPGs anymore. When the concept was relatively new and competition was minimal you could get away with that. But now this game is 12 years old and there's no way they're going to backtrack and regate content.

I don't see a problem with this. It made each instance feel scary and hard. You gotta farm t4 to do t5 to do t6. Made for a sense of wonder and accomplishment when you got there and a HUGE sense of progression. The reason why people complain so much about never having anything to do is because nothing actually feels meaningful to do anymore. Like what's the point? There isn't any. You just do one of the easier modes of the newest dungeon and you aren't restricted from seeing the newest content at all. There should be some exclusivity to push people to feel good about progressing their character.

[callipygoustp]

No
{10char}

[Deleted]

You should have added a simple Yes/No poll, Jaylock. Would be interesting to see actual numerical results.

[Hiricine]

Well it depends what makes it exclusive. Players well below mythic raiders have managed to have some great success in M+, which on some level can't be done by most casual players. Players eventually grinded their way to Pathfinder, which is a substantial achievement in terms of the amount of questing that needs to be done, and seems pretty exclusive to me.

So exclusive content is great, it just doesn't always have to follow the "elite raider/pvp" paradigm that we saw in the earliest expansions. Heck, endless proving grounds 30 is not doable by most people in normal/heroic raiding guilds.

[Deleted]

More exclusive content needs to come back.

It does in 7.2 its called class pets - DKs have to grind 3 artefacts to full to get them

[Sail into the wind]

Nah. Exclusivity breeds toxic behavior, and toxic groups never get to see the best that the game has to offer, since they get too hung up on stupid shit to really make any kind of long term progress.

[Makorus]

Yes.

Of course you should have more prestigious stuff if you put more effort into the game.

Mythic Raiders ATM have no exclusive stuff outside of a FOS per raid tier.

[Hctaz]

I don't think you guys understand what world we're talking about. I don't think we're really saying to gate more cool things behind harder content but rather to make the newer content harder to get into so that if you want to see the content you need to actually progress your character. The problem now is that many players see LFR or Normal mode Gul'dan and think "Eh, I've done this whole place. I've seen the bosses what's the point in trying heroic or mythic?" There was even a thread earlier today with somebody asking how hardcore players find motivation to go past normal mode. The problem is that these modes exist for all raid content. The other problem is that it really wouldn't be feasible to make "Weenie Hut Raid Dungeon" though I wish they would. Put LFR and Normal into a different raid so that they have a reason to want to work towards heroic and mythic raiding.

[ComputerNerd]

Raid attunements should make a come back. They were fun ways of setting goals for you and your raid team and when you got attuned, it was the greatest feeling.

More exclusive content needs to come back.

When you were ahead of, or on the curve perhaps.
Not when you started late, and the attunement content simply became an artificial gate with no relevance beyond the attunement.
It only pressured the more progressed players into going back there to catch others up.

No matter what the high-tier players get, they want more exclusivity.
The usual phrase has slipped my mind at present, the one where casuals are apparently demanding that they are the centre of attention.
Ironic given how that is utterly false.

[Hctaz]

When you were ahead of, or on the curve perhaps.
Not when you started late, and the attunement content simply became an artificial gate with no relevance beyond the attunement.
It only pressured the more progressed players into going back there to catch others up.

No matter what the high-tier players get, they want more exclusivity.
The usual phrase has slipped my mind at present, the one where casuals are apparently demanding that they are the centre of attention.
Ironic given how that is utterly false.

Yeah and you SHOULD fall behind if you aren't current. Why should the old raid content become obsolete just because the new one came out? It's called "Progression"

[SirCowdog]

no

/10chars

Agreed. No, absolutely not. I really wish people would get off the train of trying to recreate vanilla.

[ComputerNerd]

Yeah and you SHOULD fall behind if you aren't current. Why should the old raid content become obsolete just because the new one came out? It's called "Progression"

And that "progression" actually pressures players to go backwards.
Attunements only force relevance of the content through a gate, having the actual encounters themselves mean nothing.

[Accendor]

Raid attunements should make a come back. They were fun ways of setting goals for you and your raid team and when you got attuned, it was the greatest feeling.

More exclusive content needs to come back.

he is actually right.

[Desparil]

One legendary per server and statue of that person in front of blizz hq with tattoo on its head saying "vanilla is life!".

[Hctaz]

And that "progression" actually pressures players to go backwards.
Attunements only force relevance of the content through a gate, having the actual encounters themselves mean nothing.

And that's a bad thing because? If you're new you should have to catch up. You can get your friends to run you through stuff if you want and help you catch up. I don't see any problem with this.

[Deleted]

And that's a bad thing because? If you're new you should have to catch up. You can get your friends to run you through stuff if you want and help you catch up. I don't see any problem with this.

The problem, genius, is that you'd lose the majority of your playerbase. It's fortunate your MMO development insights are confined to the keyboard or we'd have another Wildstar on our hands (look it up).

Also, posting in a bait thread.

[Cæli]

what's the definition

[Heathy]

I think its a shame there aren't any dedicated 10 mans any more, I don't think exclusive content would really matter that much as soon as ppl get wind of it, it'll be pugged, the LFR/LFD tool only shortens the time it takes to form a group, instead of spamming chat channels and sifting through reams of text.

thats all its does is form groups, having to spam for groups again doesn't really make something more exclusive you just force ppl to go back to spamming LFM.

the real exclusive content is mythic, because most guilds will do normal/heroic so not many ppl are going to be clad in full mythic raiding gear. likewise if you see someone wearing m+15 gear you know they aren't completely useless. you can kinda gauge a players skill by the level of m+ pieces they are wearing. all 2-5 hasn't done much challenging group content, all 11-15 knows how to play their class.

[ls-]

And that's a bad thing because? If you're new you should have to catch up. You can get your friends to run you through stuff if you want and help you catch up. I don't see any problem with this.

I guess you didn't raid seriously in TBC, guild poaching was a HUGE issue back then, the plague of TBC raiding...

Many lower tier guilds were stuck behind every higher tier guild, not cuz they weren't skilled enough, but simply cuz as soon as they got their tanks, healers, DDs geared and attuned for the next big raid, many people from their rosters would be "recruited" by higher tier guilds, and higher tier guilds were losing their members to even higher tier guilds. Unless you were in bleeding edge guild, or on a low pop realm w/ very few raiding guilds, you're pretty much fucked.

Although I like attunements in general, forced content obsolescence is a MUST, cuz people LOVE fucking each other over, that's in our competitive nature, community itself can't sort these issues out, so devs have to step in.

[Jngizu]

And that's a bad thing because? If you're new you should have to catch up. You can get your friends to run you through stuff if you want and help you catch up. I don't see any problem with this.

The problem is for new players or players coming back. Good luck finding a decent guild during Vanilla or TBC if you started late or took a break. You were basically forced to join smaller guilds and leave them once you got geared and so on until finally you could join a top guild on your server. That sucked big time. That being said, AP is a form of attunement. Maybe not the best one sure, but with the current system, I see a lot of people still running EN and ToV.

I do agree that too strong catch-up mechanics are not healthy for the game but Vanilla's or TBC's grindfests were way way worse. Wouldn't shock me if WoW lost 90% of its player base if they went back to that kind of system.