Who would've won

[Friendlyimmolation]

NO....odyn CREATED the val'kyr. Odyn wanted to find someone worthy enough to become one, they declined, then helya decided to go against odyn's plans of a gateway person of the HoV, so she became a val'kyr. Being a val'kyr isn't even a bad thing, as seen from the HoV! It's like a fucking blessing to the valajar ladies there. Helya didn't like the low pay, likely...that's possibly why she left...

You can't Just shout "nuh uh!"

I Corrected you on this shit last time you tried posting that. Chronicle made it quite clear he enslaved Val'kyr. It took Generations of Odyn's propoganda for the Vrykul to think Undeath was a good thing.

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No, But take out the arrow, and stab her in the chest from behind, and you win.

I know you aren't knowledgeable on alot of this stuff, but if you rip an arrow out, especially one that's in your chest and has been poisoned, you will die before you can do anything.

For the alliance, It wouldn't be because the Horde would likely attack the fucking alliance, and destroy them. IDC what you say, the forsaken will NEVER have peace, not with the horde, or the alliance. Sylvanas only became warchief so she could piss of the legion more for dissing out her pussy troll, not because she cared about the races of the horde. She does this for the forsaken, and herself, mainly for herself though. She KILLED liam, cold-heartedly...

"that arrow was not meant for you" Damn she Merc'd him didn't she?

Sylvanas was going to shoot genn, and the prince took the shot. And what did sylvanas do? RUN LIKE A BITCH! Yeah, run, not like arthas did the same thing to you, and your people, and spoiled necro shit...

Easy there and people will take you (even less?) seriously. Also if Sylvanas was like Arthas there wouldn't be any Worgen left. Is Greymane a cowardly shit too because he ran away from 2 people instead of a mob?

[TheFirstOnes]

The Forsaken want peace. But that peace comes with staying the fuck away from their lands which Varian apparently finally gave into. Then he died and Genn went full fucking retard.

Hahaha. They didn't even want peace. Varian was just like "Hey, get your shit together, we're kicking the legions ass. We need to work together to defeat em, and when that's done, we're back to war", which sylvanas was just like "You're lucky we're in a war right now". It's not a peace treaty, it's a temporary work together thing. Remember when vol'jin got stabbed, sylvanas was RIGHT above varian, not a warning, nor a yell, and they left. She only cares for her people, and her own survival, and SOMETIMES the horde. And during that cinematic, sylvanas only saved varian because varian was a key component at the time, which was needed to defeat the legion....nothing new...

[De Lupe]

As a Horde player...

To hell with Sylvanas. GO GREYMANE!

Werewolves > Zombies

[Deleted]

NO....odyn CREATED the val'kyr. Odyn wanted to find someone worthy enough to become one, they declined, then helya decided to go against odyn's plans of a gateway person of the HoV, so she became a val'kyr. Being a val'kyr isn't even a bad thing, as seen from the HoV! It's like a fucking blessing to the valajar ladies there. Helya didn't like the low pay, likely...that's possibly why she left...

wait what. in your version of events, how exactly did helya become a valkyr without odyn empowering her?

[anaxie]

NO....odyn CREATED the val'kyr. Odyn wanted to find someone worthy enough to become one, they declined, then helya decided to go against odyn's plans of a gateway person of the HoV, so she became a val'kyr. Being a val'kyr isn't even a bad thing, as seen from the HoV! It's like a fucking blessing to the valajar ladies there. Helya didn't like the low pay, likely...that's possibly why she left...

he created the Val'kyr against their will. Why don't you read about who Helya is.

actually were done. I dont discuss lore with people who don't even know basic parts.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

An old man with a Werewolf curse that grants him superhuman strength and agility.

And the answer is neither of them. It would be a draw, since they both have plot invulnerability.

Plot Invulnerability only works until the story requires Plot Vulnerability...RIP Cairne, Varian, Tirion, Vol'Jin...etc

[anaxie]

Hahaha. They didn't even want peace. Varian was just like "Hey, get your shit together, we're kicking the legions ass. We need to work together to defeat em, and when that's done, we're back to war", which sylvanas was just like "You're lucky we're in a war right now". It's not a peace treaty, it's a temporary work together thing. Remember when vol'jin got stabbed, sylvanas was RIGHT above varian, not a warning, nor a yell, and they left. She only cares for her people, and her own survival, and SOMETIMES the horde. And during that cinematic, sylvanas only saved varian because varian was a key component at the time, which was needed to defeat the legion....nothing new...

The horn of retreat is a universal warning you fucking moron.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Hahaha. They didn't even want peace. Varian was just like "Hey, get your shit together, we're kicking the legions ass. We need to work together to defeat em, and when that's done, we're back to war", which sylvanas was just like "You're lucky we're in a war right now". It's not a peace treaty, it's a temporary work together thing. Remember when vol'jin got stabbed, sylvanas was RIGHT above varian, not a warning, nor a yell, and they left. She only cares for her people, and her own survival, and SOMETIMES the horde. And during that cinematic, sylvanas only saved varian because varian was a key component at the time, which was needed to defeat the legion....nothing new...

Please stop coming up with things, or post actual dialogue between them. Also now you are hating on Sylvanas BECAUSE she worked with the Alliance?

[Shortsy]

People seem to be over-inflating how powerful Sylvanas' banshee powers are as well as how strong a ranger can be.

She is indeed powerful with magic (She was able to overpower Koltira Deathweaver) and is extremely potent with archery, but we're talking the alpha Worgen, who even at his age stands alongside Varian (they both work together to hunt in Wolfheart) in terms of raw strength.

At long range sure, Sylvanas will have the advantage, but the main advantage of a worgen is gap-closing speed, strength and ferocity. We know that Genn did not intend to kill her when they confronted each other, but to distract her long enough to obtain the lantern. Imagine what Genn would have done to her, had he had the intent to kill? Have you seen what worgen can do? Now replace that worgen with the STRONGEST worgen, who is already pissed off at Sylvanas. No contest in terms of close-quarters.

Not to mention Genn is pretty damn skilled at the pistol, and we all know what happened the last time a Gilnean came at her with a firearm. She's not invincible.
I will give her credit that she's most likely a better shot than Genn, so I'll give her the advantage at long range.

When it comes down to it, if both parties were together on even grounds, I'd give the win to Genn. His natural worgen speed would be too fast for her to get a shot in as he closes in, and by the time she could cast some magic he'd probably be on top of her, doing what worgen do best.

But of course Blizzard and their damn plot armor would see their Warchief win so we don't have to have another election for the throne. By the way: #Saurfang2020.

[anaxie]

Plot Invulnerability only works until the story requires Plot Vulnerability...RIP Cairne, Varian, Tirion, Vol'Jin...etc

Dont forget super duper Emo thrall. He probably will kill himself soon.

[Lady Dragonheart]

Lets have your brilliant deduction on how anything I said compares to sylvanas. Sylvanas is idolized by the forsaken, not the entire Horde, Varian was idolized by humans/dwarves/night elves/ orcs/tauren/trolls/ worgen. Sylvanas is not young, that's obvious, nor was she low rank. She has "saved the day " for the forsaken by killing Garithos, and using the Valkyre on the broken shore if you are going to moan about unrealistic abilities I will point out nearly every faction leader. Unless any of the Writers were men wanting to be a undead woman in real life I dont think she is a self insert or wish fulfillment. Basically you only think she is a Mary Sue because you don't like the character, and actually reading a definition and thinking on it for more than a minute is apparently too hard.

Varian is dead and gone, made a public example of by Gul'dan when he essentially disenchanted him. Are you saying that Sylvanas deserves this route as well with that comparison?

Also, your points on Sylvanas point even more now to her being a Mary Sue as to as she raised rank in a city that she didn't even originally command, being foreign to Lordaeron entirely.

I love Sylvanas, she's actually one of my favorite lore character as well as model for my own RP within the game. So, I don't know where you're getting this idealistic bias stating that I disdain the character when the opposite is glaringly true. I can accept, however, that she is a Mary Sue with how drastically overpowered she is, and how everything from leadership, to political power, to narrowly escaping a permanent death over, and over, and over again, to being one of the most revered characters in the entirely of not just WoW as a franchise, but all of Blizzard. All of which feel less and less thrilling over time as she more and more has this plot-dynamic "luck" that is commonly associated with "perfect" Mary-Sue character archtypes.

All you're doing is proving my point better than I can, over and over. Are you sure that you don't know what a Mary-Sue is?

[anaxie]

People seem to be over-inflating how powerful Sylvanas' banshee powers are as well as how stronger a ranger can be.

She is indeed powerful with magic (She was able to overpower Koltira Deathweaver) and is extremely potent with archery, but we're talking the alpha Worgen, who even at his age stands alongside Varian (they both work together to hunt in Wolfheart) in terms of raw strength.

At long range sure, Sylvanas will have the advantage, but the main advantage of a worgen is gap-closing speed, strength and ferocity. We know that Genn did not intend to kill her when they confronted each other, but to distract her long enough to obtain the lantern. Imagine what Genn would have done to her, had he had the intent to kill? Have you seen what worgen can do? Now replace that worgen with the STRONGEST worgen, who is already pissed off at Sylvanas. No contest in terms of close-quarters.

Not to mention Genn is pretty damn skilled at the pistol, and we all know what happened the last time a Gilnean came at her with a firearm. She's not invincible.
I will give her credit that she's most likely a better shot than Genn, so I'll give her the advantage at long range.

When it comes down to it, if both parties were together on even grounds, I'd give the win to Genn. His natural worgen speed would be too fast for her to get a shot in as he closes in, and by the time she could cast some magic he'd probably be on top of her, doing what worgen do best.

But of course Blizzard and their damn plot armor would see their Warchief win so we don't have to have another election for the throne. By the way: #Saurfang2020.

and were talking to former Ranger General of the Entire Elven Faction and Now the Former Ranger General turned Dark Lady with all her old skills for hundreds of years vs a fucking 70 year old Wolf. She the ranger general for a reason. because she could of pincushioned and killed Genn if she had actually wanted to just go all out war and have no fucks given like that dipshit Genn.

[Friendlyimmolation]

People seem to be over-inflating how powerful Sylvanas' banshee powers are as well as how stronger a ranger can be.

She is indeed powerful with magic (She was able to overpower Koltira Deathweaver) and is extremely potent with archery, but we're talking the alpha Worgen, who even at his age stands alongside Varian (they both work together to hunt in Wolfheart) in terms of raw strength.

At long range sure, Sylvanas will have the advantage, but the main advantage of a worgen is gap-closing speed, strength and ferocity. We know that Genn did not intend to kill her when they confronted each other, but to distract her long enough to obtain the lantern. Imagine what Genn would have done to her, had he had the intent to kill? Have you seen what worgen can do? Now replace that worgen with the STRONGEST worgen, who is already pissed off at Sylvanas. No contest in terms of close-quarters.

Not to mention Genn is pretty damn skilled at the pistol, and we all know what happened the last time a Gilnean came at her with a firearm. She's not invincible.
I will give her credit that she's most likely a better shot than Genn, so I'll give her the advantage at long range.

When it comes down to it, if both parties were together on even grounds, I'd give the win to Genn. His natural worgen speed would be too fast for her to get a shot in as he closes in, and by the time she could cast some magic he'd probably be on top of her, doing what worgen do best.

But of course Blizzard and their damn plot armor would see their Warchief win so we don't have to have another election for the throne. By the way: #Saurfang2020.

She can also turn incorperal at will and in the worst case scenario leave her body. If sylvanas felt threatened enough, she could just sink through the floor or whatever. And her banshee scream doesnt need a build up, unless it requires loathing, even then she has alot of that, to incapacitate him. If Genn got the jump his odds would be better imo, if its just them on even ground, she will make his bones break with her wail.

[Deleted]

People seem to be over-inflating how powerful Sylvanas' banshee powers are as well as how stronger a ranger can be.

She is indeed powerful with magic (She was able to overpower Koltira Deathweaver) and is extremely potent with archery, but we're talking the alpha Worgen, who even at his age stands alongside Varian (they both work together to hunt in Wolfheart) in terms of raw strength.

At long range sure, Sylvanas will have the advantage, but the main advantage of a worgen is gap-closing speed, strength and ferocity. We know that Genn did not intend to kill her when they confronted each other, but to distract her long enough to obtain the lantern. Imagine what Genn would have done to her, had he had the intent to kill? Have you seen what worgen can do? Now replace that worgen with the STRONGEST worgen, who is already pissed off at Sylvanas. No contest in terms of close-quarters.

Not to mention Genn is pretty damn skilled at the pistol, and we all know what happened the last time a Gilnean came at her with a firearm. She's not invincible.
I will give her credit that she's most likely a better shot than Genn, so I'll give her the advantage at long range.

When it comes down to it, if both parties were together on even grounds, I'd give the win to Genn. His natural worgen speed would be too fast for her to get a shot in as he closes in, and by the time she could cast some magic he'd probably be on top of her, doing what worgen do best.

But of course Blizzard and their damn plot armor would see their Warchief win so we don't have to have another election for the throne. By the way: #Saurfang2020.

what you say is true, but doesn't apply here. (although one can argue wether sylvanas would get in a fight on even grounds knowing shed be as a disadvantage). it's not genn vs sylvanas, it's poisoned genn in human form because he was stupid vs sylvanas who took a blow or two. no contest.

[anaxie]

Varian is dead and gone, made a public example of by Gul'dan when he essentially disenchanted him. Are you saying that Sylvanas deserves this route as well with that comparison?

Also, your points on Sylvanas point even more now to her being a Mary Sue as to as she raised rank in a city that she didn't even originally command, being foreign to Lordaeron entirely.

I love Sylvanas, she's actually one of my favorite lore character as well as model for my own RP within the game. So, I don't know where you're getting this idealistic bias stating that I disdain the character when the opposite is glaringly true. I can accept, however, that she is a Mary Sue with how drastically overpowered she is, and how everything from leadership, to political power, to narrowly escaping a permanent death over, and over, and over again, to being one of the most revered characters in the entirely of not just WoW as a franchise, but all of Blizzard. All of which feel less and less thrilling over time as she more and more has this plot-dynamic "luck" that is commonly associated with "perfect" Mary-Sue character archtypes.

All you're doing is proving my point better than I can, over and over. Are you sure that you don't know what a Mary-Sue is?

Do you? Sylvanas isn't portaryed as can do no wrong. Shes portrayed as an extremely morally grey character even by her peers in the Horde in the cinematic.

Sylvanas has something Genn doesn't have. Character and Depth.

All Genn exists for is to be angry at Sylvanas and the Forsaken.

Sylvanas however actually has plenty of a story and complexities.


SHE CLAIMED LORDAERON FROM ARTHAS AND THE DREADLORDS

Conquest by might and I think she earned the city. Or would you rather have her left it to Balnazzar?

[TheFirstOnes]

You can't Just shout "nuh uh!"

I Corrected you on this shit last time you tried posting that. Chronicle made it quite clear he enslaved Val'kyr.

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I know you aren't knowledgeable on alot of this stuff, but if you rip an arrow out, especially one that's in your chest and has been poisoned, you will die before you can do anything.



"that arrow was not meant for you" Damn she Merc'd him didn't she?



Easy there and people will take you (even less?) seriously. Also if Sylvanas was like Arthas there wouldn't be any Worgen left. Is Greymane a cowardly shit too because he ran away from 2 people instead of a mob?

Corrected? All you did was prove my point as to why the whole "Enslavement" thing was pathetic. Helya was the one that actually said "Nuh uh." and she got a consequence for it. How can you say that the "Nuh uh" BS was odyn's shit? Also, AGAIN, BEING A VAL'KYR ISN'T BAD! Idc if it's an enslavement thing, or not. Once you're done bringing the warriors up from the dead, YOU CAN EAT, DRINK, DANCE, AND DO FREE SHIT UP THERE! Wtf?! It's a job, yes. It's enslavement, yes. But it can be an amazing after-job. Helya ruined the val'kyr bullshit though, when she did some shit that was even worse than what odyn ever did to his val'kyr. Helya torments whoever fails her, even val'kyr. Odyn just facepalms, and lets you train, or think about your shit, that's it.

2 Wrongs don't make a right. Both are not right, just 1 had the better idea...

Genn, while he was leaving, took the arrow OUT of his chest, and used his gryphon to return back to the area. It doesn't matter if he did so for not, if he had just stabbed her, and ran to his gryphon, he would've made it the same way....

Also, The whole "That arrow was not for you" bullshit, is some pathetic excuse. She litterally tried to use it ON GENN! It doesn't matter if she had killed genn, or not. She STILL MURDERED SOMEONE! Hell, she had the intention of doing so in the beginning. So, just because she killed a guy, and said "Oh no, shouldn't have hit that shit, belonged to someone else" that it makes such a situation any less horrific? FUCK NO! They both did damage to gilneas. Genn has no heir to the throne, and if liam survived, he would've had a good story-line, but the same out-come would've happened...


And lastly, what? Sylvanas is EXACTLY like arthas, raising val'kyr, and so forth, and trying to gain immortality, by enslaving val'kyr. If she has successfully gained her immortality, she would've been able to DESTROY the gilneans, once and for all, and them aim for the legion. Meanwhile, odyn (Havi, as of now) is here going "....Oh god damn it. Warrior, deal with the pest that thinks she's in command of things, will ya? Talk to me when you're done helping the wolves, then i'll show ya glory. "

And yes, I know that odyn has no careness for sylvanas, hence why he sent the warrior/Future Battlelord.

[Aquinan]

Bow beats claws every time.

[Shortsy]

and were talking to former Ranger General of the Entire Elven Faction and Now the Former Ranger General turned Dark Lady with all her old skills for hundreds of years vs a fucking 70 year old Wolf. She the ranger general for a reason. because she could of pincushioned and killed Genn if she had actually wanted to just go all out war and have no fucks given like that dipshit Genn.

Experience in commanding rangers means absolutely nothing when you're facing an enemy 1v1 you've had very little experience with. Not to mention, as I said, that 70 year old wolf fights as well and strong as VARIAN WRYNN, who was VASTLY stronger than Sylvanas, Especially in 1v1 combat.

[TheFirstOnes]

People seem to over-wank Sylvanas' capabilities. Look, she IS skilled, and she IS granduer. And I have no problem thinking she could deal damage to genn easily. But, genn was at his worgen state, with no gun, or anything. He wanted to attack sylvanas from melee, and sylvanas isn't good at tanking a worgen at melee, and many others, in that matter. Genn DID knock out sylvanas, and he did have the killing chance, but he waited. He wanted her to suffer. He wanted her to understand the same torment sylvanas caused him. And because of that, sylvanas went ranger, and poison'd him, similar to how she poison'd arthas. Difference is, genn has no insta cure, cause he's alone...

That was genns flaw. He dropped his guard...

[anaxie]

Experience in commanding rangers means absolutely nothing when you're facing an enemy 1v1 you've had very little experience with. Not to mention, as I said, that 70 year old wolf fights as well and strong as VARIAN WRYNN, who was VASTLY stronger than Sylvanas, Especially in 1v1 combat.

Uhhhh commanding and being the BEST ranger of her Entire fucking race

She would pincushion Genn before he knew what hit him

just like she did to his weak son

Just like she did to him and CHOSE not to finish him in Stormhiem.

Also Stronger?

Shes a fucking Banshee. and a ranger. Melee combat isn't needed.

Sylvanas has fought worse then Genn fighting Arthas Fighting 3 of the highest ranked dreadlords in the burning Legion.

Genn is nothing. hes a joke she could dispatch if she didn't care about the consequences of all out war.