Blizzard have effectively gotten rid of flying

[-Joker-]

Look around you. You're on MMO-C. What aren't people bitching about here?

There are a handful of legitimate gripes, but even this thread doesn't meet that criteria given that 7.2 is in the PTR and flight is almost here.

[SirCowdog]

I agree that people who come in just to insult the fliers is a bit much. But there are those of us who feel the need to remind them they are getting flight with 7.2, and this constant complaining is doing no one any good. But thankfully, they have a white knight or two who will swing in to their rescue and respond to every post that doesn't endorse immediate flight without the meta.

Irony much?

[-Joker-]

Irony much?

It's only ironic if I were using terms like fly-babies... or whiny bitches. The terms whiner and complainer are merely descriptors and not insults. But these days, people seems to be overly sensitive and even the tiniest of words seem to hurt their feelings.

Addition:

Also, if I were part of the problem, and violating the forum rules in any way while posting in this thread, I am confident a mod would address the situation.

[SirCowdog]

It's only ironic if I were using terms like fly-babies... or whiny bitches. The terms whiner and complainer are merely descriptors and not insults. But these days, people seems to be overly sensitive and even the tiniest of words seem to hurt their feelings.

Thank you for proving my point so...perfectly.

[-Joker-]

Thank you for proving my point so...perfectly.

Well, since I've never used those insults in this thread, or any other, to provoke another poster, I've not really proven anything on your behalf.

[Effenz]

Well, since I've never used those insults in this thread, or any other, to provoke another poster, I've not really proven anything on your behalf.

He's a moron, don't bother.

[SirCowdog]

He's a moron, don't bother.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This could very quickly degenerate into a flame-war, and there's already more than enough of that.

The sad part is that you guys don't even seem to realize that you're doing it. You're dismissive and insulting of any viewpoint that stems from the desire to add flying to the game. Suggestions on how to better implement it into the game are immediately labelled as "flybabies" or "whining/complaining" without actually considering the point of view or the details of the suggestion.

I've been around the flying/no-flying argument for longer than most, and I can tell you for a fact that a vast majority of the negativity comes from people seeking to ridicule and demean people who are, in essence, only trying to suggest ways to make the game better for everyone. And not because these suggestions are innately stupid, or poorly considered, but simply because they are not perfectly in-line with what has been posted in Blue.

And then to have those same people attempt to claim that they're the ones being reasonable, when they've done nothing but insinuate, imply, and outright insult PEOPLE instead of civilly discussing the topic itself? It's ridiculous. Meanwhile, people who are simply talking about the game are being called trolls, idiots, and morons. All because they have the temerity to...(gasp!)...disagree with the idea that the game is fine as it is, and that every decision Blizzard makes is always correct.

I'll be glad when the final version of Flying is in the game so we can have some resolution on the topic. Most of the disagreement stems from Blizzard's inability to be straight with the playerbase in the first place. This constantly dragging out of the issue, and the waffling back and forth, and stringing the players along has caused more damage and argument than any other topic I've seen.

[Kazgrel]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This could very quickly degenerate into a flame-war, and there's already more than enough of that.

The sad part is that you guys don't even seem to realize that you're doing it. You're dismissive and insulting of any viewpoint that stems from the desire to add flying to the game. Suggestions on how to better implement it into the game are immediately labelled as "flybabies" or "whining/complaining" without actually considering the point of view or the details of the suggestion.

I've been around the flying/no-flying argument for longer than most, and I can tell you for a fact that a vast majority of the negativity comes from people seeking to ridicule and demean people who are, in essence, only trying to suggest ways to make the game better for everyone. And not because these suggestions are innately stupid, or poorly considered, but simply because they are not perfectly in-line with what has been posted in Blue.

And then to have those same people attempt to claim that they're the ones being reasonable, when they've done nothing but insinuate, imply, and outright insult PEOPLE instead of civilly discussing the topic itself? It's ridiculous. Meanwhile, people who are simply talking about the game are being called trolls, idiots, and morons. All because they have the temerity to...(gasp!)...disagree with the idea that the game is fine as it is, and that every decision Blizzard makes is always correct.

I'll be glad when the final version of Flying is in the game so we can have some resolution on the topic. Most of the disagreement stems from Blizzard's inability to be straight with the playerbase in the first place. This constantly dragging out of the issue, and the waffling back and forth, and stringing the players along has caused more damage and argument than any other topic I've seen.

Take the high road. Don't quote things like the low hanging fruit bait you just quoted. Just roll eyes at the monitor and move on to other conversations. Replying in the manner you have here is exactly why people continue to dole out such bait.

[A dot Ham]

They really have. By only enabling it when it doesn't matter anymore.

7.2 will enable flying, but it will be done after people have spent months on the Broken Isles doing their quests while not flying. After we unlock it, that will probably be it in terms of content, before they release the Argus patch. At that point we won't need to fly on the Broken Isles, because we'll be on Argus, which will probably be not flyable either.

It's just like with WoD, where we were only able to fly once nobody needed to anymore anyway. Because the expansion was over. When the flying patch came out, I had 2 days of gametime left. And I didn't renew my sub at that point and went on a 1-year break, because the expansion was over anyway.

This will be the standard now. Flying is gone.

As long as a viable alternative is in place... I'm okay with it.

Whether I jump on a fp and afk while I piss and get a drink... or I point my mount in the right direction and auto run/fly while I afk piss and get a drink... in the end I get to the same place.

[-Joker-]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This could very quickly degenerate into a flame-war, and there's already more than enough of that.

The sad part is that you guys don't even seem to realize that you're doing it. You're dismissive and insulting of any viewpoint that stems from the desire to add flying to the game. Suggestions on how to better implement it into the game are immediately labelled as "flybabies" or "whining/complaining" without actually considering the point of view or the details of the suggestion.

I've been around the flying/no-flying argument for longer than most, and I can tell you for a fact that a vast majority of the negativity comes from people seeking to ridicule and demean people who are, in essence, only trying to suggest ways to make the game better for everyone. And not because these suggestions are innately stupid, or poorly considered, but simply because they are not perfectly in-line with what has been posted in Blue.

And then to have those same people attempt to claim that they're the ones being reasonable, when they've done nothing but insinuate, imply, and outright insult PEOPLE instead of civilly discussing the topic itself? It's ridiculous. Meanwhile, people who are simply talking about the game are being called trolls, idiots, and morons. All because they have the temerity to...(gasp!)...disagree with the idea that the game is fine as it is, and that every decision Blizzard makes is always correct.

I'll be glad when the final version of Flying is in the game so we can have some resolution on the topic. Most of the disagreement stems from Blizzard's inability to be straight with the playerbase in the first place. This constantly dragging out of the issue, and the waffling back and forth, and stringing the players along has caused more damage and argument than any other topic I've seen.

First, I've never insulted you. Second, I do not condone his post. Third, Blizz has been far more forth coming with Legion than they were with WoD. Like most things, when there is a fundamental design change, things can take time to find their groove and become just as second nature as the previous scheme. The trick is being able to understand the amount of time change takes, and acknowledging when the designer is actually willing to inform their playerbase, and not just keep them guessing. WoD failed in that fashion. Communication has been far superior in Legion, but the fliers choose to gloss over the improvements to the new process and go straight to the negatives. Patience and understanding would suit a great many people on BOTH sides of this topic.

[SirCowdog]

Take the high road. Don't quote things like the low hanging fruit bait you just quoted. Just roll eyes at the monitor and move on to other conversations. Replying in the manner you have here is exactly why people continue to dole out such bait.

I generally do. I've got a pretty long list of people who are on the ignore list. But at some point I just can't stand to let baseless claims of how flying ruins the game go completely unanswered. Somebody has to call them on that bullshit, if only to prevent it from getting believed through pure repetition.

[Effenz]

I generally do. I've got a pretty long list of people who are on the ignore list. But at some point I just can't stand to let baseless claims of how flying ruins the game go completely unanswered. Somebody has to call them on that bullshit, if only to prevent it from getting believed through pure repetition.

Lmao, you've made nothing but wrong posts since day 1. "call them on the bullshit?" Lol.

And Kazela is another one of you whiny crybabies, he(she?) just has enough balls to actually follow through with quitting.

[Thimagryn]

There are a handful of legitimate gripes, but even this thread doesn't meet that criteria given that 7.2 is in the PTR and flight is almost here.

Honestly if this entire discussion on flight is only reflective of Legion and only Legion, then there really isn't much to talk about. I would agree on that basis, that would not be a legitimate discussion.

But we all know this is well beyond that, and 7.2 does not bring the promise that flight will never be removed in the future. So really, I don't know who you're kidding here thinking 7.2 changes anything that's being said right now. This topic is inevitably going to continue again once we get news of the next expansion and Blizzard's latest stance on flight.

[SirCowdog]

Third, Blizz has been far more forth coming with Legion than they were with WoD. Like most things, when there is a fundamental design change, things can take time to find their groove and become just as second nature as the previous scheme. The trick is being able to understand the amount of time change takes, and acknowledging when the designer is actually willing to inform their playerbase, and not just keep them guessing. WoD failed in that fashion. Communication has been far superior in Legion, but the fliers choose to gloss over the improvements to the new process and go straight to the negatives. Patience and understanding would suit a great many people on BOTH sides of this topic.

The only significant difference between WoD and Legion in regards to flying is simply that we've known all along that flying would be in the expansion. But for all other practical points, Blizzard has been very nearly just as bad about their communication on the subject. We still don't actually have any clue as to what good flying will be for any future content. Flying is still a terrible reward in terms of value when compared to the time and effort required to unlock it. We still have no idea if flying will be good for anything that hasn't already been cleared ad nausem.

All Blizzard has to do is be 100% clear and honest with the players. Say something like: "We never intend flying to be usable on current content. It will only ever be something that is meant for alts and older content which has already been cleared and irrelevant." None of this bullshit about it feeling like a reward. No garbage about how it hurts the design or presentation. Just complete honesty that they don't want it to ever be relevant.

Alternatively: "We fully plan on integrating flight into the open world going forward. We want it to be something that players have to work to obtain, but also something that will be useful and interesting in current content without making that content trivial in the process. "


No details required. We don't need to know exact dates or fully itemized lists of every requirement to unlock it. Just a clear and non-evasive statement of their intent for what flight will be, one way or the other.

[Effenz]

The only significant difference between WoD and Legion in regards to flying is simply that we've known all along that flying would be in the expansion. But for all other practical points, Blizzard has been very nearly just as bad about their communication on the subject. We still don't actually have any clue as to what good flying will be for any future content. Flying is still a terrible reward in terms of value when compared to the time and effort required to unlock it. We still have no idea if flying will be good for anything that hasn't already been cleared ad nausem.

All Blizzard has to do is be 100% clear and honest with the players. Say something like: "We never intend flying to be usable on current content. It will only ever be something that is meant for alts and older content which has already been cleared and irrelevant." None of this bullshit about it feeling like a reward. No garbage about how it hurts the design or presentation. Just complete honesty that they don't want it to ever be relevant.

Alternatively: "We fully plan on integrating flight into the open world going forward. We want it to be something that players have to work to obtain, but also something that will be useful and interesting in current content without making that content trivial in the process. "


No details required. We don't need to know exact dates or fully itemized lists of every requirement to unlock it. Just a clear and non-evasive statement of their intent for what flight will be, one way or the other.

You got complete honesty in WoD and you cried like babies.
Calling out the bullshit as I see it.

[provaporous]

They really have. By only enabling it when it doesn't matter anymore.

7.2 will enable flying, but it will be done after people have spent months on the Broken Isles doing their quests while not flying. After we unlock it, that will probably be it in terms of content, before they release the Argus patch. At that point we won't need to fly on the Broken Isles, because we'll be on Argus, which will probably be not flyable either.

It's just like with WoD, where we were only able to fly once nobody needed to anymore anyway. Because the expansion was over. When the flying patch came out, I had 2 days of gametime left. And I didn't renew my sub at that point and went on a 1-year break, because the expansion was over anyway.

This will be the standard now. Flying is gone.

Flying kills the Warcraft, we've had this thread before and we have gotten very good at it by now.

[Shakari]

I have more mounts than that and I'm fine with being grounded

Well good for you, though your reply does nothing to answer the problem, others are not as happy to have years of collecting made pointless permanently.

Flying kills the Warcraft, we've had this thread before and we have gotten very good at it by now.

Flying kills nothing really with correctly designed content to go with it.

[Effenz]

Well good for you, though your reply does nothing to answer the problem, others are not as happy to have years of collecting made pointless permanently.



Flying kills nothing really with correctly designed content to go with it.

I can still use them. In more places than i can't, actually.

[-Joker-]

Honestly if this entire discussion on flight is only reflective of Legion and only Legion, then there really isn't much to talk about. I would agree on that basis, that would not be a legitimate discussion.

But we all know this is well beyond that, and 7.2 does not bring the promise that flight will never be removed in the future. So really, I don't know who you're kidding here thinking 7.2 changes anything that's being said right now. This topic is inevitably going to continue again once we get news of the next expansion and Blizzard's latest stance on flight.

So we are going to have circular arguments based on events that have not happened and may not likely happen? Maybe we should worry about 8.2 when 8.0 is announced. Pretty sure Blizz has seen the "outcry" for the last 2 expacs and really doesn't care. Given that they have taken their time in both expacs, smart people would see that result a mile away.

[Chapel]

Flying, once implemented by Blizzard, has never been 'removed'. You can still fly everywhere Blizzard intended, and can then fly in new areas when Blizzard intends it there. Blizzard has always said that flying in the beginning of an expansion is not conducive to good gameplay. You are meant to 'survey the playfield at ground level' and not 'skip content by flying over it to ninja quest mobs and items'. Blizzard never lied, never took anything away from you, never told your mom that you pooped in the school sandbox...