Sylvanas - The Lich Queen - Her only hope left?

[yetgdhfgh]

I want to introduce you to a little something called "Warlords of Draenor," an expansion to World of Warcraft where the horde literally turns against their warchief.

Difference is they are in no position to rebel and besides would the horde care if she did go full on lich king? I mean didnt Vol'jin once threaten a ally player that he would feed his body to slyvanas? Clearly the horde knows what she does and doesnt give a fuck.

As long as she doesnt affect the horde way of life which is just to survive they aint gonna go after her just because she can rez and control the undead which she has been doing since garrys time!

Had the Lich King not attack orgrimmar and had sylvanas not had a beef with arthas iam sure the Horde wouldve stayed home during the whole northrend thing!

[Friendlyimmolation]

Difference is they are in no position to rebel and besides would the horde care if she did go full on lich king? I mean didnt Vol'jin once threaten a ally player that he would feed his body to slyvanas? Clearly the horde knows what she does and doesnt give a fuck.

As long as she doesnt affect the horde way of life which is just to survive they aint gonna go after her just because she can rez and control the undead which she has been doing since garrys time!

Had the Lich King not attack orgrimmar and had sylvanas not had a beef with arthas iam sure the Horde wouldve stayed home during the whole northrend thing!

the thing is, no one would ever trust the lich king, the horde had hard enough time trusting sylvanas. What you are saying is if the lich king wasn't the lich king then no one would care. And for sylvanas to not have beef with the lich king, he would have not invaded Quel'thalas so you have a complete re work of WoW history here. Also the Horde would have went to Northrend anyways, if the lich king beat the Alliance, then the Alliance would be part of the scourge, and then they would die too.

PS. Sylvanas doesn't control any undead, she resurrects them but does not control them.

[Boogums]

Difference is they are in no position to rebel and besides would the horde care if she did go full on lich king? I mean didnt Vol'jin once threaten a ally player that he would feed his body to slyvanas? Clearly the horde knows what she does and doesnt give a fuck.

As long as she doesnt affect the horde way of life which is just to survive they aint gonna go after her just because she can rez and control the undead which she has been doing since garrys time!

Had the Lich King not attack orgrimmar and had sylvanas not had a beef with arthas iam sure the Horde wouldve stayed home during the whole northrend thing!

In that case, I'd like to introduce you to a little game called Warcraft III and it's expansion The Frozen Throne, where we learn there are quite a few reasons to rebel against a Lich "Royalty."

[yetgdhfgh]

In that case, I'd like to introduce you to a little game called Warcraft III and it's expansion The Frozen Throne, where we learn there are quite a few reasons to rebel against a Lich "Royalty."

Then why did Vol'jin elect sylvanas a person he knows resurrects the undead like i said he once threatened a ally player to feed his ass to her to the position of warchief?.

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PS. Sylvanas doesn't control any undead, she resurrects them but does not control them.

Well in the same way a queen controls its populace

Obviously she doesnt mind control them but she steers them like a queen does or anyone who is im supreme command.

[The Stormbringer]

Or she could accept her and her people's mortality like everyone else and let it eventually happen?

[yetgdhfgh]

Or she could accept her and her people's mortality like everyone else and let it eventually happen?

But she knows there is nothing but damnation when she and her people die.

She has been there she knows whats coming THATS the reason she will do ANYTHING to forestall the inevitable unless the light grants her redemption but they wont cause she didnt obviously pray to the right light god LOL

[The Stormbringer]

But she knows there is nothing but damnation when she and her people die.

She has been there she knows whats coming THATS the reason she will do ANYTHING to forestall the inevitable unless the light grants her redemption but they wont cause she didnt obviously prey to the right light god LOL

Well I mean, she could try converting her people to a religious movement, or go to the Naaru and ask what could be done, but I doubt she will.

[yetgdhfgh]

Well I mean, she could try converting her people to a religious movement, or go to the Naaru and ask what could be done, but I doubt she will.

I always wondered about that i mean why cant the damned be saved? Why should a resurrected soul who was damned by no choice of there own be fucked for all time?

[The Stormbringer]

I always wondered about that i mean why cant the damned by saved?

They probably can. For example, I'm sure the Forsaken who actually have faith in the Light and use it at the cost of their own suffering to aid others are going to be fine. The best example here would be Forsaken holy priests.

[Zulkhan]

Then why did Vol'jin elect sylvanas a person he knows resurrects the undead like i said he once threatened a ally player to feed his ass to her to the position of warchief?.

Because he's aware Sylvanas is not a Lich Queen? Hell, even Tirion was aware of that. He acknowledged a similarity in regards of the methods but never once implied Sylvanas was a "Lich Queen".

And besides the fact that Vol'jin apparently got his personal reasons to have a change of opinion on Sylvanas, even before that she never shown the same abilities the Lich King posseses, aka outright controlling the undead. Sylvanas herself is in fact powerless, raising the dead is something the Val'kyr alone can do. Obviously she can't forcibly control those undead when she's not even able to raise them by her own.

[Boogums]

Then why did Vol'jin elect sylvanas a person he knows resurrects the undead like i said he once threatened a ally player to feed his ass to her to the position of warchief?.

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Vol'jin knew about Sylvanas' valkyr or that she's using them to resurrect undead. Garrosh. his aide, and your character at the time were the only three that knew it was happening outside the Forsaken, told her to stop, which she said "as you wish my warchief" or w/e, and then they peaced out. Garrosh didn't really take Vol'jin's council, nor did he talk to him about a lot of the political and military goings-on of the horde.

It's safe to assume that vol'jin has no idea what sylvanas was doing with her valkyr, especially since there's no opportunity in the story for him to have known that.

[yetgdhfgh]

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Vol'jin knew about Sylvanas' valkyr or that she's using them to resurrect undead. Garrosh and his aide at the time were the only two that knew it was happening outside the Forsaken, told her to stop, which she said "as you wish my warchief" or w/e, and then they peaced out. Garrosh didn't really take Vol'jin's council, nor did he talk to him about a lot of the political and military goings-on of the horde.

It's safe to assume that vol'jin has no idea what sylvanas was doing with her valkyr, especially since there's no opportunity in the story for him to have known that.

Vol'jin cant be that stupid hell Sylvanas even boasts about resurrecting Lor'retmar during the siege (though granted its a when you lose) But there is no way the other members of the horde dont know she resurrects the dead. NO WAY IN HELL!

[Zulkhan]

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Vol'jin knew about Sylvanas' valkyr or that she's using them to resurrect undead. Garrosh. his aide, and your character at the time were the only three that knew it was happening outside the Forsaken, told her to stop, which she said "as you wish my warchief" or w/e, and then they peaced out. Garrosh didn't really take Vol'jin's council, nor did he talk to him about a lot of the political and military goings-on of the horde.

It's safe to assume that vol'jin has no idea what sylvanas was doing with her valkyr, especially since there's no opportunity in the story for him to have known that.

"I let ya siege Orgrimmar on ya own. See how far ya get. An' once da city be filled wit' corpses, den me shadow hunters come in, we mop up what left, kill Kor'kron an Alliance alike. Give ya dead ta Sylvanas."

[Boogums]

"I let ya siege Orgrimmar on ya own. See how far ya get. An' once da city be filled wit' corpses, den me shadow hunters come in, we mop up what left, kill Kor'kron an Alliance alike. Give ya dead ta Sylvanas."

Feeding a faction of zombies with corpses doesn't really suggest much. Especially since most of the alliance can't be raised by valkyr, so what good would giving them to Sylvanas be if not for food and making meat wagons.

[yetgdhfgh]

Feeding a faction of zombies with corpses doesn't really suggest much. Especially since most of the alliance can't be raised by valkyr, so what good would giving them to Sylvanas be if not for food and making meat wagons.

Only worgen cant be resurrected as undead.

I guess the whole point of my arguement is this

1. The horde dont give a shit if she resses the dead as long as it aint horde heroes (oh boy you DKs are gonna be fucked in the future)
2. There is very few beings left in azeroth who can postpone death seeing how she has lost the ability to control all the val'kyr and her supply is dwindling.
3. Unless she can find some magical potion which iam sure her apothacarys have failed then taking the lich kings powers is the only option left.
4. She is the warchief and what she says the horde does and i cant see there being a rebellion unless it starts to affect the horde way of life and surely being the lich queen wont affect it that much I mean when she gets the crown will it change her?

[Boogums]

Vol'jin cant be that stupid hell Sylvanas even boasts about resurrecting Lor'retmar during the siege (though granted its a when you lose) But there is no way the other members of the horde dont know she resurrects the dead. NO WAY IN HELL!

Well, I mean, she hasn't since, so...

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Only worgen cant be resurrected as undead.

This isn't right. A powerful enough being (Arthas) can resurrect whatever he wants (worgen or not). The worgen themselves couldn't be raised as Scourge through normal means because the worgen curse cancels out the undead-ness. Sylvanas' forces could only resurrect humans:

http://wow.gamepedia.com/Val%27kyr "However, the val'kyr were only able to reanimate human corpses as Forsaken."
http://wow.gamepedia.com/Quest:Lessons_in_Fear

[Zulkhan]

Feeding a faction of zombies with corpses doesn't really suggest much. Especially since most of the alliance can't be raised by valkyr, so what good would giving them to Sylvanas be if not for food and making meat wagons.

Unlikely that he referred to those corpses as food for the Forsaken when the subject is Sylvanas. It says giving the dead to her and consequently her Val'kyr.

The second point doesn't really matter since humans are and remain the major backbone of the Alliance army.

[yetgdhfgh]

This isn't right. A powerful enough being (Arthas) can resurrect whatever he wants (worgen or not). The worgen themselves couldn't be raised as Scourge through normal means because the worgen curse cancels out the undead-ness. Sylvanas' forces could only resurrect humans:

http://wow.gamepedia.com/Val%27kyr "However, the val'kyr were only able to reanimate human corpses as Forsaken."
http://wow.gamepedia.com/Quest:Lessons_in_Fear

So if she does become the lich queen she can take on the worgen? What more motivation can you have i mean to be able to fuck over greymanes worgen would be the cherry on the cake!!!!

[Friendlyimmolation]

Or she could accept her and her people's mortality like everyone else and let it eventually happen?

Forsaken aren't mortal , if they are left alone they will last forever. If Alliance show up, they will blight bomb them, rinse and repeat.

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So if she does become the lich queen she can take on the worgen? What more motivation can you have i mean to be able to fuck over greymanes worgen would be the cherry on the cake!!!!

Because Sylvanas fucking hates the lich king? And becoming the lich king takes away all your friends? And she'd probably lose even the support of the Forsaken if she did that? Just because you keep repeating the same stuff doesn't make it a good idea.

Unless she can find some magical potion which iam sure her apothacarys have failed then taking the lich kings powers is the only option left.
4. She is the warchief and what she says the horde does and i cant see there being a rebellion unless it starts to affect the horde way of life and surely being the lich queen wont affect it that much I mean when she gets the crown will it change her?

repeating that its the only option doesnt make it so.

Look what the being the lich king did to Bolvar, sylvanas would be dead in a week if she put on the crown.

[yetgdhfgh]

Because Sylvanas fucking hates the lich king? And becoming the lich king takes away all your friends? And she'd probably lose even the support of the Forsaken if she did that? Just because you keep repeating the same stuff doesn't make it a good idea.

No she doesnt she fucking hates ARTHAS!!!! It was Arthas the deathknight who resurrected her not the lich king she has no beef with the lich king plus she knows the meaning of the phase a means to a end!

To me and the whole point is that if the crown of domination is the only thing left to save her and her race then you better believe that will be her next target unless something else comes up cause she has said she will not rest and allow her race to wither and die and what else is left besides control of the val'kyr?