Pro Trump supporters attacked at Berkeley

[dvaz]

I dont think they were attacked per se, is not like they were waiting for them to ambush them Serenity funeral style. Looks like they crashed and it escalated pretty quick and fights broke.

Question is... who won?

[Orange Joe]

i see the usual liberals in here being OK with this since it was against trump supporters.. im surprised the liberal king endus hasn't been here yet to do the same.

10 people were arrested for violence. Only 3 of them being anti Trump protesters. Sorry but this wasn't violence against Trump supporters. This was violence against anti trump protesters.

[Stacyrect]

There is one question about it. It's fairly simple. Why? Berkely University is not condoning the actions of the black bloc anarchists, so why punish it? Neither the university, nor its students have the means or the right to stop these people, yet for some reason you want the government to punish them, instead of the violent people.

Please, they had a faculty member assaulting people last time. Faculty has all but explicitly advocated for this. CTR students are constantly the victim of harassment and assault on campus, nothing is done about it. But it goes beyond the university into local government as well.

If masked Trump supporters showed up to a BLM rally, or womans rally, or immigrant rally, or w/e and started clubbing the shit out of people en mass. Not once, but twice, and the police literally stood down and did nothing you would be crying foul.

[Deleted]

Honest question. Why can't people March in support of Trump?

Gout mostly.

[Activi-T]

10 people were arrested for violence. Only 3 of them being anti Trump protesters. Sorry but this wasn't violence against Trump supporters. This was violence against anti trump protesters.

That just goes to show the police are anti-Trump and pro-left fascists! They were paid by Obama to enforce his laws after all... /s

No matter what country you are from and what you're political beliefs are you will always find people in protests/rallies that incite violence/destroy property. It's just the nature of people in a crowd, they think they can get away with it and don't care how it'll play out in the media as long as they got their kicks that day. I'm just glad our nation is one of the most surveiled so we can crack down on these anarchic elements.

[dcschess05]

It's funny you say this. My experience shows me I get way more harassment for letting my liberal side show. Maybe it's more based on where you live? Cause were I live you wouldn't want to walk around wearing a Hillary shirt.

You say you aren't biased and are independent. I call bullshit. You are already blaming liberals when you don't even know the facts of what happened.

No one is unbiased. I was raised with lesbian parents, so of course I am a firm supporter of equal rights under the law. I recognize my bias though, unlike a lot people in here. The Right isn't absolved of blame in any of this, there are verifiable instances where they are baiting a confrontation. That isn't acceptable at all. However, the violence in return is far more negative IMO.

It's funny you mention arrests as a metric of culpability. How many were arrested in the Milo/Berkley protest?

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Gout mostly.

That was priceless LOL

[Orange Joe]

No one is unbiased. I was raised with lesbian parents, so of course I am a firm supporter of equal rights under the law. I recognize my bias though, unlike a lot people in here. The Right isn't absolved of blame in any of this, there are verifiable instances where they are baiting a confrontation. That isn't acceptable at all. However, the violence in return is far more negative IMO.

It's funny you mention arrests as a metric of culpability. How many were arrested in the Milo/Berkley protest?

Can I use an excuse the right uses all the time? Milo was a false flag event meant to trigger the right into hating the left more.

[Barnabas]

The Common Enemy and the Group Norm Theory of Prejudice is strongly at play here. It's not a winning strategy in the end.

[dcschess05]

Can I use an excuse the right uses all the time? Milo was a false flag event meant to trigger the right into hating the left more.

You can, it doesn't mean logical people will believe you... or the Right when they do it.

[Orange Joe]

You can, it doesn't mean logical people will believe you... or the Right when they do it.

Bolded part doesn't seem to be true anymore.


But to answer your question it seems only 1 person was arrested during the milo thing.


http://www.dailycal.org/2017/02/02/u...tion-protests/

[Adolecent]

The pro-Trump forces were trying to march through the city ...

Why are pro-trump supporters "marching through a city"? The election is over, right? Are they for some reason trying to intimidate people?

[mage21]

Supporting what actions. Can you tell me how many trump supporter were arrested for violence compared to protesters?

After what happened in San Jose, using the "arrested" metric seems a bit unfair. Evidence suggests that the police were given marching orders not to arrest violent anti-Trump protesters. Interestingly, some mostly non-political people I know were really upset when this happened and Trump as a candidate garnered some interest from them.

http://abc7news.com/politics/san-jos...rally/1369862/

[dcschess05]

Bolded part doesn't seem to be true anymore.


But to answer your question it seems only 1 person was arrested during the milo thing.


http://www.dailycal.org/2017/02/02/u...tion-protests/

Interesting.

So if I follow your narrative correctly, that individual and his ideologies speak to who was at fault and the police got all the "bad guys". /s

Of course not. So don't use it as a metric to persuade people.

Either way this is off message of the entire reason I posted here. I want to see which side stands up and unites the people. Which side is going to have thoughtful discourse and lead our country in the right direction. So far it's neither side, with one being a bigger offender than the other. Sprinkled with hypocrites and liars on both sides to top it off. Really a sad time in the US.

And this may just be my bias kicking in, but I would rather see the progressives be the better party in the end. If you support or excuse violence/anarchists though I don't see it happening.

[Kiri]

Please, they had a faculty member assaulting people last time. Faculty has all but explicitly advocated for this. CTR students are constantly the victim of harassment and assault on campus, nothing is done about it. But it goes beyond the university into local government as well.

If masked Trump supporters showed up to a BLM rally, or womans rally, or immigrant rally, or w/e and started clubbing the shit out of people en mass. Not once, but twice, and the police literally stood down and did nothing you would be crying foul.

I am crying foul to the police doing nothing when violence happens in front of them either way. That has nothing to do with punishing the university and all of its students for the actions of these masked people. What if one of those black bloc people worked at Starbucks, would you go and have Trump fine that company? That is not how the justice system works. The police is to go and find these people, then bring them to justice.

[Orange Joe]

After what happened in San Jose, using the "arrested" metric seems a bit unfair. Evidence suggests that the police were given marching orders not to arrest violent anti-Trump protesters. Interestingly, some mostly non-political people I know were really upset when this happened and Trump as a candidate garnered some interest from them.

http://abc7news.com/politics/san-jos...rally/1369862/

Typical with the right. Provide claim but no proof of said claim.

Interesting.

So if I follow your narrative correctly, that individual and his ideologies speak to who was at fault and the police got all the "bad guys". /s

Of course not. So don't use it as a metric to persuade people.

Either way this is off message of the entire reason I posted here. I want to see which side stands up and unites the people. Which side is going to have thoughtful discourse and lead our country in the right direction. So far it's neither side, with one being a bigger offender than the other. Sprinkled with hypocrites and liars on both sides to top it off. Really a sad time in the US.



And this may just be my bias kicking in, but I would rather see the progressives be the better party in the end. If you support or excuse violence/anarchists though I don't see it happening.

I'm using arrests as a measure of who committed more violence. Seems logical to me that the side that was more violent would have more people arrested right? I mean the article in the op even shows this. I mean unless you want to start getting into conspiracy theories on how everyone is against Trump and his supporters except the common man.


Don't see how I'm excusing violence. Just pointing out what evidence shows.

[mage21]

Typical with the right. Provide claim but no proof of said claim.

Well, the Mayor of San Jose was an ardent Hillary supporter, and blamed Trump for the violence that occured. Couple that with the fact that the police stood by while the violence happened, and you have a reasonable suspicion that the order for the police not to intervene was politically motivated.

From the law group that filed a lawsuit over this:

“San Jose’s Mayor compounded the enflamed situation by effectively blaming the victims for attending an event sponsored by a politician the Mayor disagrees with, which he made clear in his public statement following the riots. Victims waited for weeks to see if the city would take action aggressively to prosecute the offenders, but to date the City has failed to hold the rioters and their organizers fully accountable for the violence and the threats chilling the free speech and association rights of the victims.”

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I'm using arrests as a measure of who committed more violence. Seems logical to me that the side that was more violent would have more people arrested right? I mean the article in the op even shows this. I mean unless you want to start getting into conspiracy theories on how everyone is against Trump and his supporters except the common man.


Don't see how I'm excusing violence. Just pointing out what evidence shows.

No, I've clearly shown how numbers of arrests is an unfair metric. How about we use numbers of violent attacks? Property damage totals?

If an attacker gets away, does the attack not count because he wasn't arrested?

[Dmitro]

Violence creates violence, but i thought the lefties learned that lesson from Germany, where a decade of communist attacks towards their opponents basically raised Nazi support group

Looks like they wanna do this course all over again

[dcschess05]

Typical with the right. Provide claim but no proof of said claim.





I'm using arrests as a measure of who committed more violence. Seems logical to me that the side that was more violent would have more people arrested right? I mean the article in the op even shows this. I mean unless you want to start getting into conspiracy theories on how everyone is against Trump and his supporters except the common man.


Don't see how I'm excusing violence. Just pointing out what evidence shows.

My issue is with the evidence you are showing, not that you specifically are excusing violence. In a riot/violent protest scenario, it can't be expected that every wrong doer be caught... if anything your evidence shows the ineptitude/inability of the police department to impart justice totally and fairly. In my view insignificant arrest numbers doesn't link to which side was more at fault, just who got caught. If the arrest numbers were a true correlation to wrong doing, many more people would have been arrested at Berkley.

[Orange Joe]

No, I've clearly shown how numbers of arrests is an unfair metric. How about we use numbers of violent attacks? Property damage totals?

If an attacker gets away, does the attack not count because he wasn't arrested?

Ok, got a number on those for the article in op?

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My issue is with the evidence you are showing, not that you specifically are excusing violence. In a riot/violent protest scenario, it can't be expected that every wrong doer be caught... if anything your evidence shows the ineptitude/inability of the police department to impart justice totally and fairly. In my view insignificant arrest numbers doesn't link to which side was more at fault, just who got caught. If the arrest numbers were a true correlation to wrong doing, many more people would have been arrested at Berkley.

Here are some pictures from the article in the op.


Trump suporter getting in someones face while he has his hands up. (this is the old man that was hit with mace too from what I can see)


Protesters trying toget a large stick from Trump supporter. Second picture shows him with a balled up fist going to hit someone.



Another Trump supporter with his arm back looking like he is about to hit someone.


Same guy trying to grab megaphone from someone.


Magaman came ready for....... peace.




Funny part is. While I can find Trump supporters that are injured. I can't find any of them just being attacked outright.

[dcschess05]

Ok, got a number on those for the article in op?

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Here are some pictures from the article in the op.


Funny part is. While I can find Trump supporters that are injured. I can't find any of them just being attacked outright.

Looks like a shit show. People on both sides behaving poorly, and maybe the claim even more Rightwingers were being confrontational this time around than Lefties is actually true. I don't know for sure yet in this scenario.

When violence is the chosen action, you are wrong no matter what you believe in.

So far I see far more support to overthrow Trump by any means necessary than I do to unite the people and peacefully prove to everyone that his policies are bad for the US.

Edit - I recognize it makes for boring politics when you are purely pragmatic and makes it difficult to energize your voterbase behind you. However, don't stoop to the level of violence and anarchy.