Warcraft Chronicle Vol 2 (Warning: Spoilers)

[Mgann-Morzz]

I'm glad about this Grom, probably thought his son was dead so never abandoned him. Was probably the biggest thing on his road to attempted redemption.

Yeah it's nice to know Grom did really care about Garrosh, Grom wasn't the best guy but he did try to better himself and I have no doubt he'd of been disappointed in what his son ended up doing to in his own eyes be like the father he barely knew.

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N'Zoth was behind Deathwing in Cata, but Metzen said it was the Old Gods' power (not specifically their deaths, though) that had boosted Deathwing power ("What has happened in recent years is that the whispers of the Old Gods have gotten worse. The power of the Old Gods, as seen rising with C'Thun and Yogg-Saron (there are more). Their power has magnified Deathwing's power ten-fold").

I believed he referred to Deathwing in Cata quite literally BEING "The Hammer of Twilight" as well at one point. And referred to him as ultimately basically just being the Old Gods weapon at that point more than anything else.

sucks that he lost that cunning manipulator side though.

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I think Dal'Rend just CONSIDERED his Horde to be the ''True Horde''. Same with Kargath in the Shattered Halls says ''Ours is the TRUE Horde! The only Horde!''. Dal'Rends Horde was considered by everyone else as the ''Dark Horde''.

Pretty much yeah, every crazy asshole who broke off from the main Horde has considered THEIR Horde to be the "TRUE" Horde.

[Friendlyimmolation]

And I am left wondering why they were obsessed with being any kind of Horde given the "achievements" of the previous Horde . . .

being "wild" and "free" not having to live in a shitty desert etc.

[Rend Blackhand]

being "wild" and "free" not having to live in a shitty desert etc.

Durotar, Blackrock Mountain or Hellfire Peninsula. Which would you rather live in if you had to choose between the three Hordes?

All are equally shite, no wonder Garrosh wanted to conquer Kalimdor and build a new city in Ashenvale.

[steelballfc]

god i can't wait

[Devonitar]

Old Hordes seem to be very... incompetent.

[Tart]

How did alliance communicate with the Gronn and did Khadgar still get turned old?

[Avateau]

How did alliance communicate with the Gronn and did Khadgar still get turned old?

It only says Khadgar and Turalyon were quickly able to demonstrate that the Alliance was also the enemy of the black dragonflight, so they struck a simple bargain with Gruul.

And yes, Khadgar's life force is drained by Medivh, which ages him.

[Rend Blackhand]

Old Hordes seem to be very... incompetent.

The old Horde wasn't incompetent, they were just defeated. Losing a war doesn't mean you're stupid or you didn't know what you were doing. In fact, the Horde were close to winning but Gul'Dan betrayed them.

[Tart]

It only says Khadgar and Turalyon were quickly able to demonstrate that the Alliance was also the enemy of the black dragonflight, so they struck a simple bargain with Gruul.

And yes, Khadgar's life force is drained by Medivh, which ages him.

Thanks a lot mate.

[Rend Blackhand]

I'm truly surprised that there is not a single picture of Orgrim Doomhammer in this book even though his is such a huge character. We should have had an epic piece of him vs Lothar I think.

Oh well, maybe in volume 3 if it covers the internment camps.

[Deleted]

They only ever were close to winning in Lordaeron because of unexpected allies (Deathwing, the Amani, the truce with Ragnaros) and the betrayal of Alterac. If it wasn't for Deathwing and the Demon Soul, Proudmore would have sunk them outside of Hillsbrad before they ever set foot in Lordaeron.

And yet, Gul'dan and his forces never fought on the frontline, against the might of the Alliance strenght.

Yes, the Old Gods got allies, but at the same time they were undermined by some of those allies (Amani never leaving Quel'thalas, Cho'gall more interested with Ragnaros) and their own forces (Gul'dan, Cho'gall and the Blackhand brothers).

[Rend Blackhand]

They only ever were close to winning in Lordaeron because of unexpected allies (Deathwing, the Amani, the truce with Ragnaros) and the betrayal of Alterac. If it wasn't for Deathwing and the Demon Soul, Proudmore would have sunk them outside of Hillsbrad before they ever set foot in Lordaeron.

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Btw remind me again why did we ever attack Gruul in Outland? Ogri'la happened after people had killed Gruul after all. I think he was required for some attunement?

You could say that about everything 'oh but if it wasn't for this then...' doesn't mean anything. It happens the way that it happened.

I don't know why we attacked Gruul. Just because I think. TBC did a terrible job of the lore.

[Darkarath]

Thanks to the OP for the wonderful work.

Focusing in Chronicles II, I have to say that after the first one this one is a dissapointment.

I excepted way more about Draenor, it seems to me that they're following the lazy way, featuring just one continent when Draenor was supposed to be bigger than Azeroth. So much waiting for the Apexis and Ogre civilizations and their story are a big MEH.

The rest of the content that it deals with was already well known, with some changes here and there, nothing major IMO. I guess that its a good read for those who doesn't know much about the lore and novels.

[Deleted]

And the Alliance got an entire nation betraying them. And really, Deathwing and the Demon Soul are by far the most important part of this fight. If it wasn't for Deathwing the other Dragon Flights would most likely have destroyed the Horde by themselves after all; not much they would have been able to do against dragons flying above them and just using their breath weapons. The Horde really was not that impressive and the idea that it could overcome all defenses on Azeroth seems laughable not counting all the allies they suddenly got there (and Sargeras could not possibly know that would happen). In all honesty it would have made far more sense if Sargeras or KJ had sent Gul'dan to the Tomb immediately and used the rest of the Horde as a distraction.

Alterac and Gul'dan and his clans are hardly comparable. Gul'dan alone would destroy Alterac if it was a problem for him.

Deathwing and the Demon Soul became more important because Gul'dan could care less about the war against the Alliance, even the Horde fleet was actually built so he could reach the Tomb in the near future.

[Aucald]

I vaguely recall him trying to pull off a con once or twice, like trying to manipulate the blues' succession crisis, but yeah overall he was a major disappointment. They really dumbed the character down to just a flying ogre in Cata.

I think they somehow managed to pull another Illidan with Deathwing - while he showed up more often, his machinations were still far too behind-the-scenes and understated. If you read "Twilight of the Aspects" you got a completely different read on him. There he was pulling the strings on the Blue Dragonflight, positioning pawns like the Twilight Father, subverting the Dragon Sanctums at Wyrmrest, etc. etc. He was a very active villain, but you see little to none of that in-game where he just sort of flies around and nukes random zones, or makes the occasional cameo in a zone cut-scene.

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Btw remind me again why did we ever attack Gruul in Outland? Ogri'la happened after people had killed Gruul after all. I think he was required for some attunement?

While the Gruul raid encounter was available before Ogri'la was, I think the stories were supposed to be connected with Ogri'la first and have Gruul as the capstone. Mog'dorg the Wizened is the Ogri'la NPC that sends you after the bulk of Gruul's sons (save for Goc who gets taken out by Rexxar or Sabellion) - but due to the disconnect they don't send you after Gruul. Story-wise the only connection Gruul has is with the Earthen Signet, which you need to return to a Naga heretic named Skar'this in the Slave Pens as part of the old Coilfang Reservoir attunement.

[Deleted]

IMO, the most interesting part was Gul'Dan channeling K'ure power (The Dark Star) to destroy Karabor.

[Ethenil]

I'm thinking they'll completely retcon Med'an out, and have Khadgar do stuff in his place with Garona after TBC, dealing with Cho'gall and acquiring Atiesh.

[Rend Blackhand]

I'm thinking they'll completely retcon Med'an out, and have Khadgar do stuff in his place with Garona after TBC, dealing with Cho'gall and acquiring Atiesh.

Med'an should be completely swept under the carpet and forgotten.

[Ethenil]

Med'an should be completely swept under the carpet and forgotten.

Indeed, that's what I'm saying xD

[Deleted]

I'm truly surprised that there is not a single picture of Orgrim Doomhammer in this book even though his is such a huge character. We should have had an epic piece of him vs Lothar I think.

As I said, I found it weird we had artwork of Maraad mourning his sister (which was out of place in terms of artstyle) and of Medivh fending of Trolls.
Yet no artwork of the battle at Hellfire Citadel, the fight against Medivh or Blackhand vs Orgrim.