New Gaming PC Help ($3000 budget)

[Oxhart]

Howdy. I am looking to buy a new PC and sell my current one to a buddy of mine so we can both get upgrades. I have built many PCs in the past, but I've not messed around with SLI or liquid-cooling. My goal here is to be able to play graphically intensive games like Ghost Recon: Wildlands at or above 60fps. I will settle for 60fps, but I am reaching more towards the monitor's refresh rate if possible (144hz+) at the highest graphics settings. I am seeking wisdom, advice, and if possible, a build I can start setting up on PCPartPicker. My budget is around $3000.00 USD; but before I go off spending that cash, I have a few questions.


1. Should I wait for the Ryzen chips to come out and settle in price or should I go ahead and get my hands on an i7 4930k or something else?

2. Should I go for the 1080Ti or is there something else coming out soon that is better?

3. I have never done the SLI thing with GPUs because I've been told it isn't worth it in the past (5 years ago). I've read it is not a 100% gain, but more like a 25-50% gain at best in performance. Does this still hold true?

4. I am finally thinking about doing a liquid cooled PC but I've never done one before. I do have a few guides I can follow that I've saved in my favorites on how to set one up, but my question is, is this something of a jewel I've been missing out on over the years or should I bother? I hardly overclock but my room gets pretty toasty as is.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and offer your two cents; I appreciate the help fellas/ladies.

[Denpepe]

This thing should handle most of what you want

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i7-7700K 4.2GHz Quad-Core Processor ($329.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-D15 82.5 CFM CPU Cooler ($85.49 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: Asus MAXIMUS IX HERO ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($217.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Patriot Viper 4 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3000 Memory ($114.97 @ Jet)
Storage: Samsung 960 Evo 500GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($249.99 @ B&H)
Storage: Western Digital BLACK SERIES 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($123.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB Founders Edition Video Card ($699.89 @ OutletPC)
Case: Phanteks Enthoo Luxe ATX Full Tower Case ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic PRIME 750W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($157.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $2110.28
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-03-12 08:43 EDT-0400

Now I would advise to wait for non founders edition GPU's to come out of the 180Ti they should run cooler and faster.

SLI is still somewhat hit or miss, when correctly implemented the gains can be quite substantial but the drawbacks when it does not can be frustrating and we usually recommend just buying the single most powerfull card you can afford.

For liquid cooling, I would not do it (a custom loop that is) whatevcer solution you use will not get the CPU cooler then ambient, getting an AC for your computer room may have a better effect.

The setup I made can be made a bit cheaper if you wanted but I chose good quality stuff that should last you some years and still falls well within your budget.

The Rysen CPU's are not bad, if you have need for the extra cores you xould look into it, but for gaming only the intel i7 7700k is more or less the best option atm.

[Deleted]

Let's say his room is a true hotbox and sits around 100F all day. That is 37.7C... So, yeah. A custom loop is preferable in situations where you have a hot room you're gaming in. Yes, it'll dump more heat into the room than standard cooler, it'll also do a better job cooling your hardware.

doesn't cool that much better to be worth all the drawbacks imo, most notably the hassle if you have to swap a component and the increased maintenance required. only reason to get custom loop is if you like how it looks and have spare money imo.

now ofc if you wanna be super fancy and put the radiators outside of the computer room, then were talking. but even then AC prolly smarter if your room gets very hot, not just for the PC but also your personal comfort.

[Deleted]

When AC isn't available the difference between air and liquid becomes more noticeable. And the drawbacks are negligible.

well i mean an entry level AC unit cost about the same as a custom loop so that's kinda a stupid argument.

the drawbacks are only negligible if you enjoy messing with your pc.

[Vargur]

Electricity isn't free, yet.
Why are you guys comparing AC vs liquid cooling?

[Deleted]

They seem to think air cooling combined with an AC unit is the best cooling solution for his PC. Personally, I prefer liquid cooling as I don't have to put a 5 lbs. cooler hanging off my CPU socket.

Actually, this video goes into decent depth of this;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSOcUnn1mtQ

Water just takes longer to heat up, but since no benchmark run has been done with the temps checked 1 hour later, the temps are inline with air coolers.

[Karon]

Let's say his room is a true hotbox and sits around 100F all day. That is 37.7C... So, yeah. A custom loop is preferable in situations where you have a hot room you're gaming in. Yes, it'll dump more heat into the room than standard cooler, it'll also do a better job cooling your hardware.

physics dictate that you have no clue.

Watercooling has a advantage most people ignore: they can, if set up correctly, be less noisy than any air cooler you'll usually find. The fans on your air cooler will spin up and make lots of noise, the fans on a radiator don't (if done right)

Actually, this video goes into decent depth of this;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSOcUnn1mtQ

Water just takes longer to heat up, but since no benchmark run has been done with the temps checked 1 hour later, the temps are inline with air coolers.

I wouldn't trust a guy who can't even put a PC together and then claims that he is a "electrical engineer" and knows better while still in university.

[Deleted]

physics dictate that you have no clue.

Watercooling has a advantage most people ignore: they can, if set up correctly, be less noisy than any air cooler you'll usually find. The fans on your air cooler will spin up and make lots of noise, the fans on a radiator don't (if done right)






I wouldn't trust a guy who can't even put a PC together and then claims that he is a "electrical engineer" and knows better while still in university.

I was gonna say that, but hes not wrong about the properties of water, theres a reason why water is used as the fluid medium in central heating is because of its ability to hold heat and give it out, law of physics says what goes in, also comes out. Water does in fact hold heat and takes time to heat, this is fact and not opinion as much as that guy is a retard in other areas when it comes to computing building ( its very obvious hes a rich kid trying to make a name for himself on youtube).

[Deleted]

You can replace the fans on an air cooler to be just as quiet and because liquid cooling does a better job cooling physics dictates more heat is being expelled into the environment(it's not magically lowering that temp by holding heat somewhere in the loop). Also, liquid cooling will typically have a higher db rating as you're going to have a pump that's adding noise, no matter how little. I'm not saying liquid cooling is loud or anything, I can barely tell my PC is on when I'm not gaming(fan curve is set to pretty low RPMs), but it's not necessarily any quieter than air cooling. The question is whether you get more dbs from air passing over your air cooler compared to it passing over radiators in combination with the pump.

Theres an issue with this, there isn't a single AIO make that uses proper fans, all the GOOD fan makers, noctua, Bequiet have their own air coolers and they come supplied with their top of the range fans, Corsair, NZXT and anyone else don't make good fans yet.

[Deleted]

We're talking more about custom loops as the budget allows for such things...

Point still stands either way, the good air coolers come presupplied with the best fans you can get - period, air coolers in this sense are not noisy.

[Karon]

You can replace the fans on an air cooler to be just as quiet and because liquid cooling does a better job cooling physics dictates more heat is being expelled into the environment(it's not magically lowering that temp by holding heat somewhere in the loop). Also, liquid cooling will typically have a higher db rating as you're going to have a pump that's adding noise, no matter how little. I'm not saying liquid cooling is loud or anything, I can barely tell my PC is on when I'm not gaming(fan curve is set to pretty low RPMs), but it's not necessarily any quieter than air cooling. The question is whether you get more dbs from air passing over your air cooler compared to it passing over radiators in combination with the pump.

The CPU creates the same amount of heat no matter how you cool it. Be it AC or LC, the heat has to be dissipated. AC can't just cut off some of the heat, nor can LC add to it. It's called Conservation of energy. The only difference here will be the efficiency in how fast the cooler is able to transfer the heat from the CPU to the air.

Point still stands either way, the good air coolers come presupplied with the best fans you can get - period, air coolers in this sense are not noisy.

With exception of the biggest Air coolers I'd disagree with you on that. A normal Air cooler has not enough surface area in its cooling fins for the fans to run on slow RPMs. The fan has to compensate for the smaller cooling area by pushing more air through the cooler, making it noisier than a decent LC loop.

[Karon]

Wow. I just. Wow. Yes, the cpu will generate the same heat. A liquid cooler lowers the operating temp, that means that heat goes into the air instead of being held by the cpu.... basic physics.

you just tried to explain that the CPU is a timebomb.

[Deleted]

The CPU creates the same amount of heat no matter how you cool it. Be it AC or LC, the heat has to be dissipated. AC can't just cut off some of the heat, nor can LC add to it. It's called Conservation of energy. The only difference here will be the efficiency in how fast the cooler is able to transfer the heat from the CPU to the air.



With exception of the biggest Air coolers I'd disagree with you on that. A normal Air cooler has not enough surface area in its cooling fins for the fans to run on slow RPMs. The fan has to compensate for the smaller cooling area by pushing more air through the cooler, making it noisier than a decent LC loop.

If you are comparing water cooling AIOs/custom loops, then big air coolers are your equivalents, a 120 mm AIO Vs a smaller air cooler, then this is a more difficult area I would be honest.

Also to Vegas, if you buy a noctua heatsink or Bequiet heatsink, you get what is THE quietest fans on the market presupplied.

[Karon]

If you are comparing water cooling AIOs/custom loops, then big air coolers are your equivalents, a 120 mm AIO Vs a smaller air cooler, then this is a more difficult area I would be honest.

Also to Vegas, if you buy a noctua heatsink or Bequiet heatsink, you get what is THE quietest fans on the market presupplied.

Yeah you're right, but with big aircoolers my irrational fear of a damaged mainboard kicks in

[Deleted]

Yeah you're right, but with big aircoolers my irrational fear of a damaged mainboard kicks in

That fear was felt when I installed my Zalman performa heatsink years ago, was a huge ass pain to install, and then seeing it hang there was not a comfortable thing, but it survived a house move while attached and don't have that fear anymore, mind you my Cryorig H5 is a big lighter then the Zalman before it.

[willtron]

Yeah you're right, but with big aircoolers my irrational fear of a damaged mainboard kicks in

the Noctua mounting system is super sturdy and really easy to use, frankly if you use anything other than Noctua for air cooling, you're mad.

[Deleted]

Also to the OP, stick to one GPU, get the 1080TI or wait for Vega, though the 1080 ti is out now, with CPU choice, I would go for the 8 core/16 thread Ryzen right now and this is someone with a 5820K, going down cores is a no go for me.

But the Kabylake CPUs do have better peak performance but I can see that diminish soon, you have decided to time an expensive build when new hardware is launching, like new new, I would try give it a month during this hardware storm.

[Karon]

No, I just explained that when your cpu is operating at a lower temp under load it means that heat went somewhere.

When the CPU is operating at a lower temp it only means that the temp delta between the CPU and air is lower and therefore needs more surface area or higher airflow to stay as effective. The same amount of heat must be dissipated by the air cooler. The difference to a LC is that it needs a higher temp delta since it has a lower surface area and therefore the core runs hotter.

Or where do you think the heat goes when you say "somewhere"?

And when I bought my loop I got THE quietest fans when I got everything else. How is this a selling point?

Then please enlighten us which fan you do consider THE quietest?

[Vargur]

They seem to think air cooling combined with an AC unit is the best cooling solution for his PC. Personally, I prefer liquid cooling as I don't have to put a 5 lbs. cooler hanging off my CPU socket.

If you OC, then go for it. Otherwise air is fine, even a 1Kg one. It's holding on to the motherboard, not to the socket.

[Beckers]

This turned into a pretty heated argument about something that is really broken down into one simple question, do you mind the hassle?

I had a custom loop and the second I wanted to upgrade a part I hated myself for going into it.

The fact is, you will get better temps on a custom - no argument there. But do you need them? You can comfortably build a computer that will run on air or on a decent AIO cooler and overclock it while staying in the safe range of operating temperatures without causing throttling or damage to the components.

You won't be able to push an extreme overclock but again, why should you other than benchmark bragging?

I recommend that you would get a solid machine with a SINGLE 1080ti that is not a founders edition, a strong i7 with a good AIO cooler and a nice case with good airflow.