Great news: Employers are allowed to ban burquas!

[Themius]

Which would fall under anti-discrimination laws.

Good luck trying to get that seen seriously when you have growing racist sentiments in Europe with fucking legit racist far right parties getting ground.

[Mehrunes]

LOL! Was just talking to my g/f about the limits of freedom of Religion in the exact same way. Though I used the example of ritual suicide, or sacrifice.

Well, ritual suicide wouldn't be that great of an example to be honest, given how most places don't prohibit suicide. Though I suppose it depends on the ritual and if any people assist with it.

[Moratori]

Good luck trying to get that seen seriously when you have growing racist sentiments in Europe with fucking legit racist far right parties getting ground.

I don't see why it wouldn't be taken serious.

What does racist sentiments have to do with religion though?

[Themius]

the first one is not a burqa. that is a headscarf.

This is a burqa :

Okay obviously you didn't read the shit and that's why you're ignorant of what I am talking about.

They banned Burqas, yes... THEY ALSO BANNED HIJABS, WHICH JUST A HAIR COVERING.

[PassingBy]

I don't agree with a ban on any clothing. Unless it's a danger to the wearer or others it should be allowed.

When I started my career in a big 4 company the first thing that I got after getting my internship was 2 pages long document about how should I dress for work, and how should I look, and how shouldn't I.

Including the specific rules regarding the acceptable colors of the suit, acceptable color of the shirt, acceptable color of the tie, how the shirt, suit and tie colors should correlate with each other. How long should the tie be, how far should the cuffs of the shirt show from the sleeve of the jacket, and so on.

The employer sets ground rules, and usually you know those ground rules when you are applying for the position.

One of the selling points for my current job was the fact that I am expected to wear a suit only on the days that I have meetings with the customers or government officials. And I can imaging myself turning down an offer with slightly larger salary in order to keep this convenience.

So if a person wants to wear some specific outfit to work - they can find an employer that allows that.
It is easy as that.

[Underverse]

Good luck trying to get that seen seriously when you have growing racist sentiments in Europe with fucking legit racist far right parties getting ground.

There's no evidence that the law won't be enforced.

[Themius]

When I started my career in a big 4 company the first thing that I got after getting my internship was 2 pages long document about how should I dress for work, and how should I look, and how shouldn't I.

Including the specific rules regarding the acceptable colors of the suit, acceptable color of the shirt, acceptable color of the tie, how the shirt, suit and tie colors should correlate with each other. How long should the tie be, how far should the cuffs of the shirt show from the sleeve of the jacket, and so on.

The employer sets ground rules, and usually you know those ground rules when you are applying for the position.

One of the selling points for my current job was the fact that I am expected to wear a suit only on the days that I have meetings with the customers or government officials. And I can imaging myself turning down an offer with slightly larger salary in order to keep this convenience.

So if a person wants to wear some specific outfit to work - they can find an employer that allows that.
It is easy as that.

Sikhs can wear turbins... while in a suit... and not be any less serious of a business man, in fact it's not uncommon to see thanks to our freedom of religion laws.

[Deleted]

Okay obviously you didn't read the shit and that's why you're ignorant of what I am talking about.

They banned Burqas, yes... THEY ALSO BANNED HIJABS, WHICH JUST A HAIR COVERING.

You tried to spread propaganda before. One must be wary of folks like you. Burqas are dangerous, because you can't know who is hiding beneath it. It would be a perfect way for child molesters to disguise themselves and we wouldn't want that, do we?

The ban is a good thing and I fully support it.

[Underverse]

Okay obviously you didn't read the shit and that's why you're ignorant of what I am talking about.

They banned Burqas, yes... THEY ALSO BANNED HIJABS, WHICH JUST A HAIR COVERING.

Easy now. They didn't ban jack shit. They simply said that a company has the right to disallow the presentation of any religious symbolism while at work if they choose.

[Moratori]

You tried to spread propaganda before. One must be wary of folks like you. Burqas are dangerous, because you can't know who is hiding beneath it. It would be a perfect way for child molesters to disguise themselves and we wouldn't want that, do we?

The ban is a good thing and I fully support it.

[Mehrunes]

Well that'll never happen in our country because we have freedom of religion, so you can't ban people from wearing crosses.

It's not like European Union doesn't have freedom of religion as well.

[Themius]

You tried to spread propaganda before. One must be wary of folks like you. Burqas are dangerous, because you can't know who is hiding beneath it. It would be a perfect way for child molesters to disguise themselves and we wouldn't want that, do we?

The ban is a good thing and I fully support it.

Who is talking about fucking burqas, why are you ignoring the fact they can say "fuck hijabs too!" even though you can clearly see faces. It's in the fucking OP What the fuck do you mean i'm trying to spread propaganda.

[Moratori]

Sikhs can wear turbins... while in a suit... and not be any less serious of a business man, in fact it's not uncommon to see thanks to our freedom of religion laws.

Freedom of religion in the US is way too permissive.

[Acidbaron]

Good luck trying to get that seen seriously when you have growing racist sentiments in Europe with fucking legit racist far right parties getting ground.

Far right always rises up in a cycle of 20 years or so they pop up again, they never get far since the other parties take over some talking points on a much more moderate level. Also the only point of appeal with their demographic is the chatter about immigrants, once people become aware about their authoritarian view of how society should look like (such as curfews, capital punishment for all sort of crimes..) they tend to lose their base rather fast.

There is also plenty of "centrum" right parties in the EU, something the US lacks and we also aren't build around a 2 party system, having 3 to 5 or more parties in power and an equal amount in opposition is generally normal.

[Themius]

It's not like European Union doesn't have freedom of religion as well.

Obviously the laws are terribly weak if they're like "okay you can ban all religious symbols."

[Moratori]

Who is talking about fucking burqas, why are you ignoring the fact they can say "fuck hijabs too!" even though you can clearly see faces. It's in the fucking OP What the fuck do you mean i'm trying to spread propaganda.

It's about employers being allowed to decide what people wear when working for them. There's no ban on hijabs or burqas.

[Thage]

I'm trying to figure the 'symbol of oppression' logic as it applies in Western society, where Muslim women often come out to say they wear it as a choice and from respect to their faith. I thought the point of religious freedom was just that; that's why people cry foul when burqas specifically get targeted with some weird justification like "it's for the women!" How is taking the choice away from them supposed to be empowering?

However, as it applies to this topic, OP misrepresents the ruling. The ruling is that banning religious symbols is OK in the workplace, but it must be exercised evenly. You can't ban burqas from your office but allow someone to hang a cross on their wall. You can ban both, though, and decide that religious expression has no purpose or place in your office with the justification that your employees should be focused on work, not on religious statements.

[Allatar]

Well that'll never happen in our country because we have freedom of religion, so you can't ban people from wearing crosses.

We have freedom of religion in Europe but I think it means something subtly different: here you have the freedom to practice whatever religion you wish, should it be legal, but you are discouraged from displaying overtly religious iconography in the workplace should your employer see fit to enforce that. You cannot be discriminated against in terms of opportunity because you practice a religion IN PRIVATE but you can be told to rein in the displaying of it in public and the workplace if it constitutes a nuisance.

[Themius]

Freedom of religion in the US is way too permissive.

It's only too permissive when we allow discrimination against people based on one religious rights, or when they use their religion to make laws; however, being allowed to wear a damn hair covering and being unable to ban it, isn't too permissive imo.

[Mehrunes]

Good luck trying to get that seen seriously when you have growing racist sentiments in Europe with fucking legit racist far right parties getting ground.

Because political parties mean so much for judges over here. Especially once you get to Union level in appeals.