Mass burnout.

[Halstinavos]

I am an officer in a fairly large guild that consistently had people on (until recently) always doing things. We would fill a 30 man raid at one point for heroic and cut down to 20 for mythic. We also had people on every day running keys and we always cleared up to a 15 in multiple groups for weekly cache.

Within the past 2 weeks, we have had a massive drop-off in activity from anyone, raiders and non-raiders alike. We went from constantly having at least 15 people on at any given point to having maybe 3 on at the same time. The only time anyone gets on is for raid (for those that are still actually raiding).

I know every xpac goes through a point like this, but it happened very suddenly and dramatically for my guild. I feel like it was weird, because from one week to the next, our raid attendance was basically cut in half and nobody left the guild, they all just simply stopped playing the game. Many of them have not even logged in now for 2 weeks or so.

I've never seen this happen so fast and so dramatically. We are now basically on a break until Tomb of Sargeras, which some people have said they will come back for, but a lot are just 100% done and not coming back. The majority have stated burnout as their reason and that they have entirely lost interest in the game.

Anyone else experiencing this level of burnout in their guild?

[Deleted]

until recently we had enough for Mythic but now we're filling slots with socials and bads. I think this week will be only the second time we've not been able to fill a mythic raid team and I actually raided with another guild on the server on tuesday due to this. Granted we're on a very low pop realm but yeah, the AP grind has killed a fair few people in our guild, I love it, but I'm only on 49 traits so not massively invested like some of my other guildies.

[Echocho]

Yeah same story with my guild. We've been losing a person here and there since launch but suddenly in the last 2 resets we lost like half of our remaining raiders. I don't think it's the grind per se but that there's no end in sight. Blizzard bringing everyone back down to 34 traits and starting the whole thing all over again was the final nail in the coffin. Just when people was feeling relieved that the insane grind was finally over Blizzard instantly invalidates all that effort.

[Deleted]

Yeah same story with my guild. We've been losing a person here and there since launch but suddenly in the last 2 resets we lost like half of our remaining raiders. I don't think it's the grind per se but that there's no end in sight. Blizzard bringing everyone back down to 34 traits and starting the whole thing all over again was the final nail in the coffin. Just when people was feeling relieved that the insane grind was finally over Blizzard instantly invalidates all that effort.

I have been gone from the game for a few months now, did they really reset AP partially?

[Halstinavos]

I have been gone from the game for a few months now, did they really reset AP partially?

Yes, new traits, more AP grind, then a new AP dump trait that goes up to 50 points.

[FelPlague]

I have been gone from the game for a few months now, did they really reset AP partially?

its not a reset its a refund, it gives you your points back to use them where you please, your AP has not been "Reset" it has been refunded

- - - Updated - - -

Yes, new traits, more AP grind, then a new AP dump trait that goes up to 50 points.

see above, reset and refunded are different

[xrtc]

Everyone keeps blaming the "AP grind" that they enforced on themselves.. on an rpg game..

[Halstinavos]

its not a reset its a refund, it gives you your points back to use them where you please, your AP has not been "Reset" it has been refunded

- - - Updated - - -



see above, reset and refunded are different

You get the AP back from anything you spent over level 35 and then the new traits cost 15 million+ AP, plus all the existing traits now go up to 4 instead of 3.

[Deleted]

Pretty much, my guild master also said he's burned out and going to stop playing for a while.

[Halstinavos]

Everyone keeps blaming the "AP grind" that they enforced on themselves.. on an rpg game..

Many of the MYTHIC NH bosses are tuned around 54 traits.

[Adlian]

Not everyone like the grind RNG fest this expansion.

Im slowly starting to hate this TF gearing system. I kinda feel forced to do Norma+HC and Mythic and praying for good titanforged roll...

[Showtimes24]

We are feeling the same thing, lost 4 raiders last week.

[Deleted]

Same here. The amount of time you need to put in the game if you want to be a semi-hardcore Mythic raider, outside of raids, is simply too much.
In previous expansions you needed to bring your A-game to raids and outside of raids you spent time collecting your consumables (farming themself or farming gold), farming your valor points and that was about it. The rest of the time you could spend on more leisurely activities, which helps with the feeling of being burnt out.

Right now, you have to (you technically don't. You don't have to do what you don't want to do, but if your goal is somewhat competitive raiding then you don't have much a choice because you will be replaced by people who do) do the following:
- Raid
- Mythic+ to farm AP/legendaries/TF upgrades
- LFR to farm AP/legendaries/TF upgrades
- Normal Mythics to farm legendaries/AP
- World Quests to farm AP

I'm much more casual than I was 5 years ago, but even I feel the pressure to farm 54 traits (the rest of our raid team has 54 or very close to it) and to farm LFR for TF upgrades. Luckily I have my bis legendaries, so I don't feel too hard-pressed to go out of my way to farm them.

I think the progress-outside-of-raids to progress in raids model has failed. And this has nothing to do with World of Casualcraft or entitledness, it has to do with being in a performance mode almost all the time, there's little downtime spent on old raids, alts, fishing, pets, etc. Sure, if you play 10h/day, you'll find time to do some of these other things, but your regular raider who goes hard during his 15-25h of weekly raid time and has limited play time outside of his planned raids, has the feeling that he's never off the hook.

That doesn't mean the Mythic + is a bad system, it's great and the way non-raiders can progress through it is a great change. It does mean that raid performance shouldn't be linked to extensive time spent outside of raids. WoW is a game, it's not a competitive sport where time spent in the gym translates to your performance on the pitch.

[smaktat]

Within the past 2 weeks, we have had a massive drop-off in activity from anyone, raiders and non-raiders alike. We went from constantly having at least 15 people on at any given point to having maybe 3 on at the same time. The only time anyone gets on is for raid (for those that are still actually raiding).

3 words: Zelda, Mass Effect

[FelPlague]

You get the AP back from anything you spent over level 35 and then the new traits cost 15 million+ AP, plus all the existing traits now go up to 4 instead of 3.

yeah thats refunded as in you are getting everything you spent, back
also as above says

A. zelda, and mass effect
B. we are starting to hit the cycyle, once the next patch comes out it will raise up again quickly. this happens every expansion, after awhile it starts to drop, patch comes out and it goes back up, happens for patches and expansions

[ItachiZaku]

Nothing new, the game is old as shit, so the long timers are getting burnt out more quickly and the game only had a small boost due to the meh movie. Old games don't get new players very frequently.

[Halstinavos]

yeah thats refunded as in you are getting everything you spent, back

Right, but my point is, you only get the AP back from whatever you spent over the 35th trait and now there will be a whole bunch of new traits that are tremendously more expensive, so anyone that was at 54 now has to grind AP again. Everyone will be back to grinding AP.

[Reachie10]

Yeah, the game is no fun anymore, grinding everyday blows.

[Raelbo]

Legion has a lot of stuff to do and burning oneself out is really easy to do. I have to admit that even though I am enjoying the expansion greatly, for the first time in nearly 10 years I am feeling on the edge of burnout. That being said I don't blame the game. It is up to me to moderate how much I play, prioritise what is important, and let the rest go. Last week was particularly brutal because in addition to all the regular weekly stuff there was the Timewalking event (for me with 3 high level toons that was 15 instances), the HotS promotion (15 games to do), the Darkmoon Faire and the final wing of NH LFR is now open.

I think that for people who can't self moderate, the risk of burnout is very real. So take it easy, figure out what is absolutely necessary and what you enjoy the most and set limits on how much time you play. If you aren't getting to everything you want to do, relax, it will still be there next week/month/year. This game is like a marathon, rushing is only going to mess you up in the long run.

[Deleted]

My guild is thriving. Gotta start recruiting soon