Arthas redemption path in Argus?

[TriHard]

What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What What
?

[Aucald]

The assumption cannot be made that he would ever learn that or take that lesson to heart... simply because he was not given the chance to.

How many countless stories has a pupil learning from a master/teacher and only listens to the parts about gaining power and defeating ones enemies and ignores any wisdom in benevolence.

Agreed, as his story is pretty much over now it's a case of "he can't because he didn't" all around. Arthas' rise and fall is a pretty classic fantasy staple - from hero to villain to a heel-face realization (of a sort) on the occasion of his death.

[Gurluas]

Wait, isn't AU Draenor still connected to us? Afaik once such a connection is made it's pretty hard to shut it off, destroying a portal isn't enough.

[Unholyground]

No need to go to an alternate reality for Arthas, just retrieve his soul from the Void.

Hell, I'm half expecting the Void itself to resurrect Arthas as their agent to match Illidan when he goes all Light-happy. Another reason I'd want Jaina as the Avatar of Azeroth, so she can fight Void-Arthas and get double-ultra-closure.

Illidan will be true lawful neutral 50% light and 50% dark, about balance and that kinda stuff.

[Amazing R]

Our Azeroth is also the only one in any reality with a World Soul.

Where did you get this information? I have both WoW Chronicles, I haven't heard any devs mention that, and none of the wow wikis out there are 100% canon.

[Valynor]

That aspect of Arthas' personality is on display even before he was hardened by Stratholme and his vendetta against Mal'ganis - in one of the very first scenes with Arthas he is upbraided by Uther for his bloodlust against the demon-worshipping Orcs near Strahnbrad, and Uther tells him that vengeance can't be part of what it means to be a Paladin. It's a lesson that Arthas never internalizes and a mistake he repeats before he is eventually damned by Frostmourne and the Lich King.

that doesnt mean that 1 million of arthas´s will be as our arthas universe, just saying, the history for that AU changed cos we defeated the legion before they arrived to Alternative azeroth, it will not follow the same pattern, maybe that azeroth fell to the old gods, maybe the titans defeated the old gods and re create azeroth again.. so many paths.., again.. just saying xD

[Golden Yak]

Fighting a bunch of just random Old Gods and faceless creatures for an entire expansion would be boring, just like fighting only demons during Legion(which is why we have Xavius, Gul'dan, etc...) I think it would make a lot of sense for the Void forces to be led by powered up people we already know. People who would have been touched at one point by the void before their death and cast away by us. So I wont be surprised if Arthas and Garrosh are both brought back, maybe apart of a 4 horsemen void edition. Maybe throw in Ner'zhul and someone more alliance-y as the 4th.

I've had the same thought. Personally, I'd love to see Cho'Gall come back for round three, fully converted into a hideous Void monstrosity. Maybe those claimed by the Void become like demons - they can only be destroyed while within the Void, otherwise they reform and come back in new bodies.

[Hobbidaggy]

Pretty sure Blizzard has never done that - feel free to give me the quote and source if I somehow missed it (don't remember they did, and a quick Google search gave no result). On the other hand, there are evidences implying that there are other Azeroth with a World Soul.

The original Well of Eternity exist because Azeroth was "wounded" when Aman'thul ripped Y'Shaarj from Azeroth. The Well was pretty much the Azeroth's lifeblood, bled from the scar left behind when Y'Shaarj was torn from the world's crust. Later on, the Well's energy transformed the Night Elves into Night Elves from Dark Troll. The Aspects, and the Dragonflight was transformed from Proto-drake by the Pantheon channeling their powers through the Keepers. We all know about these fact. It should be safe to say that the existence of the Well of Eternity, or the Elves, or the Dragon as we know them can at least implying / hinting that Azeroth has a world soul (I wouldn't say that it's the conclusive proof, but those are that's the only case as far as we know). It had been shown at least a few times that there are AUs with those.

Firstly, in regards to the Legion: they actually did (and probably still do) bother with assaulting / invading alternate Azeroths. In "Illidan", when Vandel received his first vision of the multiverse ("This time he saw not just one universe but a near infinity of them, a complex fractal structure, where new worlds were born each minute from the decisions made a heartbeat before"), he noticed that "In every one of them, the Legion marched triumphant, leaving futures stillborn and presents empty of all life. He saw countless Azeroths, countless Vandels, and countless Khariels, and to every one of them came death". As it said, Vandel saw countless Azeroth being attacked with countless Vandels & Khariels as he knew it (that doesn't mean all those Azeroth were conquered, though). That means not only the Legion did assault alternate Azeroths, those AU Azeroths have Night Elves as well (since there are NEs, there likely was WoE, and a World Soul). It makes sense - the Legion can only put a fragment of their army on Azeroth (due to the restriction of needing portals / summons), it'd be stupid for them to have the rest of their army sit around doing nothing.
Secondly, in War Crimes, Kairoz summoned a number of alternate selves of Azeroth's leaders from their respective alternate universes. Among them, there were Kalecgos as a Dragon (which means the Pantheon in that AU did interact with that AU Azeroth) who knew and experienced Aveena's death (which means there were a Sunwell - and thus, likely a WoE as the Sunwell was created by a Vial of the Well's water). There was Jaina, so human exists there as well. I believe there were mentions of elves among those alternate versions, but I can't quite remember now.

Anyway, based on those, there are alternate Azeroths (countless, even) being invaded by the Legion, has Night Elves, Dragons, and WoE. I'd say that's a good indication that ours isn't the only Azeroth with a World Soul.

That was the most comprehensive and well thought out response I have read in a long one. Thank you

[Maxilian]

Despite it sounding as bad as wod, AU arthas's actions don't magically make everyone love MU arthas

That did not stopped Grommash, heck he didn't even needed to be a different Grommash, he just needed to jump the "Iron Horde Bandwagon" when he saw that the train was going to crash

[Friendlyimmolation]

That did not stopped Grommash, heck he didn't even needed to be a different Grommash, he just needed to jump the "Iron Horde Bandwagon" when he saw that the train was going to crash

Grom on his bad day was never so universally despised like arthas at-least /shrug.

[Fritters154]

Yeah sounds crazy, but.. with the New LK plotting and making weird things in Northrend.., this would be badass and see the full potential for an Older and Wiser Paladin arthas, along Muradin and Uther as a Team.

Just an opinion, or theory but hey WoD happened! xD

Nope. Paladins didn't exist until the second war against the orcs so there would be no order for Arthas to even join to become a paladin as there wouldn't have been an enemy driving its creation (no orc invasion of AU Azeroth). It would be hard to gage what Arthas (or anyone for that matter) became on AU Azeroth without the orc invasion because the wars reshaped all of Azeroth's races in some way to what we see in the MU. We do know that Arthas wouldn't be a paladin though because that organization needs the orc invasion to exist.

[Jngizu]

Wait, isn't AU Draenor still connected to us? Afaik once such a connection is made it's pretty hard to shut it off, destroying a portal isn't enough.

Yeah, I'm very curious about that too.

[dwbrown7680]

I really can't see them pursuing something like that after how WoD was recieved.

[Deleted]

As you may know already we are going to Argus... in some near point of the Xpac, HQ of the legion, and where supposedly the army of light is fighting against the burning legion..

So.. Turaylon sends a message about the status of the fight and they need our help, but what if the message also went into another AUs, the AU Draenor for example, where we defeated the legion, stopped the orc invasion to AU Azeroth, with that in mind and that Nerzhul never became LK, that AU Arthas got his full training becoming a Paladin fighting the demons and the scourge, never corrupted following only light, stronger than tirion or Uther, so this AU azeroth answer to the call of fighting the legion in Argus, as well as the Draenei and Orcs from AU Draenor?

Yeah sounds crazy, but.. with the New LK plotting and making weird things in Northrend.., this would be badass and see the full potential for an Older and Wiser Paladin arthas, along Muradin and Uther as a Team.

Just an opinion, or theory but hey WoD happened! xD

They're not gonna touch AU Azeroth. The whole AU Draenor thing was a failure. They bury that deep. They're not even gonna have AU Draenor characters like Yrel show up, now that the Legion attacked, that's how embarrassed they are of WoD

[Deleted]

He would have litterally no reason (no invasion happening means they probably never came into contact with the legion) or means to get there (no draenei or demon spacecraft).

And even if; that would be no redemption for the shitbag we knew as our universe Arthas.

[MikeBogina]

Grom on his bad day was never so universally despised like arthas at-least /shrug.

Im pretty sure Arthas is one of the most beloved Warcraft characters ever made. Arthas and WotLK hype was the highest blizzard ever got. Don't be an edgy illidan fan

[Friendlyimmolation]

Im pretty sure Arthas is one of the most beloved Warcraft characters ever made. Arthas and WotLK hype was the highest blizzard ever got. Don't be an edgy illidan fan

oh I hate illidan more than I do arthas. Arthas is written fairly well, doesnt mean hes loved. In universe he is hated with a passion

[Hisholyness]

Quite the opposite, Blizzard stated there was an AU version of Azeroth to match the AU Draenor, but that we weren't likely to see or explore it in any real way.

I still get the same question over and over again -- is there an alternate Azeroth to go with the alternate Draenor?
Yes!

Are we going to see it?
I would never say never, but it's not planned right now. (Source)

Our Azeroth was never made a world soul and AH azeroth WAS made into a world soul! But we have azeroth soul in all our heroes and plot shit happens and the world is saved. Thanks alternate universes!

[MikeBogina]

We know there is one world soul left.

We do? Links??

If we assume that the burning legion (since they knew about AU Draenor before we interfered) knows about AU Azeroth then that Azeroth does not house a world soul.

If we assume that the legion knows about AU Azeroth, then that Azeroth does not house a world soul... What? The Legion has always known of Azeroth before it knew of draenor. The Legion's actions on Draenor was a side project of Kil'jaedin's who had a vendetta against Velen, which Archimonde had constantly criticized.

Please explain how you came to the conclusion that there's no Would Soul on Azeroth, because of that.

It probably also won't exist much longer if it did.

Again, why makes you think this?

I doubt "All timelines are the prime" one.

You misquoted me good sir, I said "all timelines are the ones to protect the most, to those inhabitants".

Also it would make the words of Aman'thul completely pointless and factually wrong since he said "Know there is only one True timeline".

And across billions of timelines, Aman'thul said "This is not the true timeline". Firstly, when did he say that and? Secondly, he's no all knowing god, he's just really powerful. The only beings that would have that knowledge are the Void Lords and their light counterparts.

Saying all of them are just kind of ignores the lore and fabricates it because you want it that way.

First of all(again) I never once liked the multiverse they established. I prefer one universe with many possible ones that never happened. That's what we all believed it was for a very long time, until they said Draenor is in a real legit timeline universe and there's an endless amount of them. Then they said the One Legion transcends all universes, and that they're all connected to the Nether, the one nether.
Second, use some logic. There's one Nether and all the timelines are connected to it. All the demons' souls from all the universes merged together(1 Sargeras, 1 Archimonde, 1 KJ), yet they go to every universe to eradicate all life, to prevent the Void. Why wouldn't they just focus on the prime universe? Because all the universes matter.

Im not saying there's a prime timeline or not, but I am saying that all the universes matter. And if there's Titan/Old God life on azeroth, there's a World Soul.

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oh I hate illidan more than I do arthas. Arthas is written fairly well, doesnt mean hes loved. In universe he is hated with a passion

ohh lol, i thought you were talking about the fanbase. My bad.

Well then to talk about in universe, the people who matter the most, know the truth. I always believed that the whole "Dont tell anyone about what happened here" secret, also was impart to keep people from finding out that this monster they hated so much, their traitor prince was a victim himself. That's also why i think Tirion lied about seeing what was in Arthas' heart, so that everyone stayed focus on defeating him.

If they never bring our Arthas back, then I think an AU arthas showing up with an army would be cool. There's so many dead champions of the Alliance that we could avoid doppelgangers. Since the Draenei and Orcs probably have to flee Draenor now, it's probably safe to assume they'd end on Azeroth since they did in our timeline. And she could unite them and we could meet them on Argus

[Eon Drache]

And across billions of timelines, Aman'thul said "This is not the true timeline". Firstly, when did he say that and? Secondly, he's no all knowing god, he's just really powerful. The only beings that would have that knowledge are the Void Lords and their light counterparts.

I can't find the source for anything else atm.

Unto you is charged the great task of keeping the purity of time. Know that there is only one true timeline, though there are those who would have it otherwise. You must protect it. Without the truth of time as it is meant to unfold, more will be lost than you can possibly imagine. The fabric of reality will unravel. It is a heavy task--the base of all tasks of this world, for nothing can transpire without time. - Blessing of the Bronze Aspect by Aman'Thul

Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects Page 286