So how come Draenor isn't assisting us?

[Anufis]

From an official standpoint we've already been told (if I remember correctly) that Blizz simply didn't want to continue the stories of the Draenor characters and shelve them for now, because they've had their time in the lime light and now it's time for other characters. Which I agree with, don't get me wrong, I have at times drank heavily and incurred head injury to forget WoD happened, HOWEVER...

...Y'rel, at the end of HFC, specifically tells Dhadgar that Draenor will stand with us against the Legion, and then seemingly proceeds to shove us through the portal back to Azeroth and mutter "I can't believe he bought that lol" under her breath. Or so it would seem, anyway.

From a lore perspective, if Azeroth is saved from the Legion and the Legion is sufficiently buggered by us (IE we manage to kill Kil'jaeden in the Nether or even severely damage Sargeras, who knows what happens on Argus later) then by default, Draenor's future is now secure as well. Draenor gains a future it was never meant to have, it and everything on it literally rips a new destiny out of the jaws of damnation. You'd think we'd see some brown Orcs, some Draenor Draenei, and some Arakkoa NPCs running around lending a hand.


TL;DR I find it odd Draenor is "brb rebuilding or whatever" when all of that rebuilding is completely moot should Azeroth fall to the Legion; the Legion isn't going to forgive and forget Archimonde's defeat there. Would it not be wise to at least send something through to Azeroth to help?

Legion is attacking all azeroth, not only broken isles. They might be somewhere in silithus battling infernals and boarding legion spaceships.

[Deleted]

I think it’s a shame that Yrel is no paladin class hall champion. After all we built her up. It’s really weird that none of the AU Draenei are interested in the MU ones, I mean, they do know they exist, but they haven’t had any contact (as far as we know) vice versa. MU ones should also be interested in adding AU ones to their strength or even moving to Draenor again, since they are still at the peak of Draenor civilization.

Azeroth facing “the biggest Legion invasion ever” should be enough reason for the Draenor people to help, since why would the Horde or Alliance choose to help Draenor again against whatever threat if they don’t help us?

[Eazy]

We were going back and forth canonically so no.

Yes, canonically they're all dead by now.

[steelballfc]

That expansion is best left forgotten.

Technically canon but ignored like Med'an

i'm just waiting for the day that Med'an show up in game with a cut-scene or something

this day would be glories.

[Kellorion]

There are some who show up in various class halls, but not too many. Most of them are languishing in their prison, err garrison, or Draenor.

Really?
whom, I don't think I've spotted any?

[Friendlyimmolation]

I think it’s a shame that Yrel is no paladin class hall champion. After all we built her up. It’s really weird that none of the AU Draenei are interested in the MU ones, I mean, they do know they exist, but they haven’t had any contact (as far as we know) vice versa. MU ones should also be interested in adding AU ones to their strength or even moving to Draenor again, since they are still at the peak of Draenor civilization.

Azeroth facing “the biggest Legion invasion ever” should be enough reason for the Draenor people to help, since why would the Horde or Alliance choose to help Draenor again against whatever threat if they don’t help us?

I would like to have Grom as a warrior hall champion, or Grom would walk through the portal, looking for demons and Odyn comes down, wide eyed, and frothing at the mouth. He points at Grom and starts screaming about valor. Grom charges him and one hits him just like he did with mannaroth and saves all warriors from his boring class hall.

[Zulkhan]

Of course, that played also a role, no one denies that. But having an Orcish world and his father never drinking demon-blood was Garrosh most beloved dream. And was as important as the revenge, if not, even more important. Because else he could let Gul'dan do his work...

If Garrosh let Gul'dan do his thing history would have simply repeated itself, the AU orcs of AU Draenor would have invaded AU Azeroth and so on. In this way though Garrosh could use the captured Shadow Council members to build a functioning Dark Portal but directed towards our Azeroth by using the hourglass' shard he possessed, which was connected to the place it came to be (indeed, MU Azeroth).

Of course Garrosh hated Gul'dan and the demons and wanted to see his own idealized Horde come to be with Grom as its Warchief but this equally shows Garrosh's selfishness on the matter. Not only he wanted to forge a Horde that would fit his personal vision and ideology (which, ironically enough, it wasn't different at all from the Horde envisioned by Gul'dan, it just lacked Mannoroth's blood and the support of the demons, partially compensated by the goblin hi-tech) but he also wanted it to act precisely as he desired. And since such Iron Horde had to act just like the Old Horde did, Garrosh had to lie and manipulate just as Gul'dan did in MU.

Garrosh knew that his father's destiny led to more than shame and corruption. He knew that Grom would have redeemed and sacrificed himself, leading to the birth of a new and rinvigorated Horde. Where's the "altruism" in Garrosh's actions, someone who knows how history eventually unfolded, when he prevented Grom to commit that mistake but dishonestly led him on the wrong path anyway? The Iron Horde was free from demon's control, "free" to follow Garrosh's vision, a vision tainted by lies and deception and that led them on the same destructive path Gul'dan led the Old Horde in our universe. Durotan and even Orgrim eventually conclude the Iron Horde would have destroyed Draenor and left nothing but ruin in its path. Just like Gul'dan's Horde.

Tragic enough, the whole reason Kilrogg betrayed Grom was because of the misguided direction Garrosh led him to, which was destructive if not outright suicidal, to the point that even accepting the Legion's offer looked more reasonable if Kilrogg wanted to ensure any degree of future for his clan. Grom was willing to follow that path until the bitter end because of the emotional investment he got from the half-assed vision Garrosh shown him, but Kilrogg had his own shamanistic vision showing him something else. Still, none of this would have probably happened if Garrosh decided to lead Grom on a better path.

Hell, the way Durotan describes Garrosh's influence on the orcish clans is blatantly reminiscent of the one Gul'dan employed on the MU Horde:

Garrosh came out of nowhere, and manipulated the clans as you would play a drum. It is good that he is finished. But, the damage is already done. It's like I don't recognize my own people anymore.

Come and tell me that what Durotan is describing isn't the exact same crap Gul'dan did in MU.

Garrosh betted on Orcish world on Azeroth, with his father as Warchief, slave of no one. Not of humans, not of dragons, not of demons.

Again, the talking about no masters pulling the strings proved to be nothing but sheer hypocrisy. What Garrosh said meant jackshit the moment he, quoting Durotan above, "manipulated the clans as you would play a drum".

Vol'jin and Darkspear being victims of Kargath and Shattered Hand, Siege of Stormwind/Iron Forge was only revealed revenge of Garrosh in the short-story. There wasn't a word about sieging Orgrimmar.

There was no mention about a siege of Stormwind either. He didn't have to make a detailed list of everything. Everyone but his loyalists and goblin mercaneries turned against him on Azeroth and the devs themselves said Garrosh's main goal was revenge.

I suspect Garrosh long term plan would be wiping out humans in eastern kingdom and fuse with Orgrimmar and kill Vol'jin/Darkspears.

No one in Orgrimmar would have accepted anything coming from Garrosh when the city and Durotar themselves turned against him. During the 5.3 event you saw the orcs of Razor Hill voicing nothing but sheer hatred for the Kor'kron, the Warrior trainer of the place saying Garrosh was shedding the blood of his warriors recklessly and understood why the Darkspear trolls were rebelling.

If Garrosh desired to "fuse" Orgrimmar with the Iron Horde the latter had to enslave the first or most likely kill them all, since, you know, most orcs hate enslavement and would rather die than giving up to an oppressor.

And therefore, it shows killing the shaman had nothing to do with killing Thrall/Orgrimmar. But just to make sure his father doesn't sees his glorious death, just the Fel Horde being demonic slaves.

It had to do with everything. With Grom feeling guilty about an hopeless future. A future that wouldn't have looked that hopeless if Garrosh shown his father both his ultimate sacrifice and the birth of the New Horde. That's clear as day.

It wasn't "needed to invade".

It was: "Why don't you invade something much bigger? *kuch* Azeroth *kuch*"

Except it was. The short-story is there telling you this.

I would like to have Grom as a warrior hall champion, or Grom would walk through the portal, looking for demons and Odyn comes down, wide eyed, and frothing at the mouth. He points at Grom and starts screaming about valor. Grom charges him and one hits him just like he did with mannaroth and saves all warriors from his boring class hall.

I remember how boredom is exactly what made me abandon my troll warrior in that shitty class hall.

[Dremall]

Really?
whom, I don't think I've spotted any?

The main one I was thinking of turned out to be her sister. Daleera Moonfang is the follower in Draenor, Delas Moonfang is the paladin follower in Legion. My mistake.

[Oneirophobia]

On the topic of "There is too much going on, Blizz can't fit it all in"

Yes, I realize that. They don't have to be integral to the storyline or anything, I just mean an NPC here or there in the class halls woulda sufficed. An Arakkoan druid here, a brown Orc there, Yrel AFK in the paladin class hall over there, yadda yadda.

Now that I think of it, the Draenei in the priest hall are wearing Auchenai gear... maybe they are from Draenor.



On the topic of rebuilding,
as I said, they won't have anything to rebuild if Azeroth falls. Preventing the Legion from taking Azeroth is pertinent to the survival of Draenor. If Azeroth falls, so too does Draenor.

[Myzou]

They're kinda recuperating? Their world just got ravaged. I imagine Khadgar and the H/A agreed to give them a break.

Yrel did say she would come if called. I imagine that will happen when we go to Argus.

Yrel isn't done. They never explained what Velen gave her at the end of shadowmoon.

[Lastlivingsoul]

Honest Opinion. You really want those Orcs near a buttload of Fel Magic again. The Front door wasn't even broken in before they started Chuggin Demon Blood.

Grommash would have, could have had an awesome rematch with Gul'Dan but Blizzard doesn't know how to use the Epic Voice that is Kevin Micheal Richardson.

Grommash 2018.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Honest Opinion. You really want those Orcs near a buttload of Fel Magic again. The Front door wasn't even broken in before they started Chuggin Demon Blood.

Grommash would have, could have had an awesome rematch with Gul'Dan but Blizzard doesn't know how to use the Epic Voice that is Kevin Micheal Richardson.

Grommash 2018.

Grom busts in and kidney shots Guldan, suplexes him into the ground, when he gets up hes kicked and spins around falling into Illidan's arms. night-hold cutscene ensues.

[Lastlivingsoul]

Grom busts in and kidney shots Guldan, suplexes him into the ground, when he gets up hes kicked and spins around falling into Illidan's arms....

"Illidan throw Gul'Dan back to Grommash and seizes Gul'Dan's waist flips him up over his shoulders with a brutal POWERBOMB!! and Gul'Dan goes down. Wait a minute, Illlidan is Climbing the Statue HE"S CLIMBING THE STATUE!! and leaps down on Guld'Dan!! OOOHHHHH!! With Diving Back Elbow Drop that could be heard in Highmountain Gul'Dan is down!!"
-My Cutscene

[Friendlyimmolation]

"Illidan throw Gul'Dan back to Grommash and seizes Gul'Dan's waist flips him up over his shoulders with a brutal POWERBOMB!! and Gul'Dan goes down. Wait a minute, Illlidan is Climbing the Statue HE"S CLIMBING THE STATUE!! and leaps down on Guld'Dan!! OOOHHHHH!! With Diving Back Elbow Drop that could be heard in Highmountain Gul'Dan is down!!"
-My Cutscene

"By god stop the match!"


*Grom grabs a chair*

[steelballfc]

I would like to have Grom as a warrior hall champion, or Grom would walk through the portal, looking for demons and Odyn comes down, wide eyed, and frothing at the mouth. He points at Grom and starts screaming about valor. Grom charges him and one hits him just like he did with mannaroth and saves all warriors from his boring class hall.

amen to that

- - - Updated - - -

"By god stop the match!"


*Grom grabs a chair*

* epic music entrance *

HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERE's the big the show * Magtherdon enter the show *

OMG WE have all thought he died, he is back for revenge.

[Wyrt]

Blizzard could easily solve it by saying they're dealing with Legion attacks as well and then have them(or at least Yrel and Durotan) show up for the big Argus invasion, but Blizzard's probably just going to ignore them entirely.

Years of waiting for draenei to get more development just for all that development to be washed away the moment the expansion ends since none of it was relevant to the real draenei.