Spellblade Aluriel Nerf

[Tiberria]

Some stats:

Heroic : around 75% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H. Spellblade
Mythic : around 15% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M. Spellblade

Definitely seems an issue needed fixing based on the maths...

Your numbers are skewed, because Nighthold is not a linear instance after the first 3 bosses; you have the choice of going to any of 5 different bosses next. Therefore, obviously a decent percentage of guilds reaching 3/10 are choosing to go to one of the other bosses first. It's a faulty assumption to classify a guild that is 3/10 and working on Krosus or that killed Krosus and is 4/10 and working on Botanist as "stuck on Spellblade.

Guilds that are stuck on Elisande or Gui'dan are a larger percentage in all reality than on Spellblade.

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More detailed maths to highlight how much of stumbling block Spellblade is:

Comparison (H:M ratio x 5)
Heroic : around 75% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H. Spellblade
Mythic : around 15% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M. Spellblade

Comparison (H:M ratio x 1.3)
Heroic : around 99% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H.Chronomatic Anomaly
Mythic : around 75% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M.Chronomatic Anomaly

Comparison (H:M ratio x 1.5)
Heroic : around 98% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H.Trilliax
Mythic : around 66% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M.Trilliax

Again, 100% irrelevant and skewed facts, because Skorpion > Anomaly > Trilliax is linear, and then bosses 4-8 are non linear.

You can't take completion on 3 linear bosses and then compare that completion to one of the 5 options in a spot in the instance where you have that choice. Of course, having 5 different paths to go will affect the completion percentage. Saying it's apples to apples is just providing alternate facts.

[Emerald Archer]

He's not comparing it to Skorpyron. He's comparing Skorpyron HC to Skorpyron Mythic and Spellblade HC to Spellblade Mythic. So you're wrong.

What. Can you reread his post. He's comparing how many have killed Mythic Skorp, to how many have killed mythic spellblade.

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My guild went for alurielle as 4th boss because we didnt have enough players (dps players) to go for krosus. The fact the boss is smack there in the middle, one might think it is one of the next group of bosses to tackle. This group is krosus / alurielle / tich / botanist. I and many others I guess expected a difficulty to go crescendo.

3 easy bosses
4 medium to hard bosses
rest hard to real hard bosses.


in the pool of 4 I feel, and I might be wrong, that blizzard made them harder than necessary. They should have lowered the difficulty there. the side issue is that this skewed difficulty progression has cost them many players. I dont know if anyone noticed by many guilds folded and many players quit, yet again.

lack of progress is not a good thing for anyone.

Just because your raid team went spellblade first, does not make that the norm. The vast majority of raids went to other bosses. Krosus was for teams with high dps, then botanist was for teams with less dps, and tich was with teams who had compositions which could cheese the strats. Then Spellblade was for team with godly healers / stupid raid teams.

[Deja Thoris]

Spellblade was nerfed because the fight was too hard, and because there needed to be an easier fight that lead to the 5th, as the difficulty spike was too high. His point was correct, but comparing Mythic skorp to mythic spellblade, is the same as saying "well this many people killed heroic botanist, and only this many have killed mythic spellblade" like what. And spellblade is one of the last mythic bosses of the optional, that people do.

His way of proving it isn't elegant or perfect but it is an decent indicator. I'm not even sure how you are disputing this - but then again its MMO Champion, somebody has to kick up a fuss about everything here.

Boss 1 - 1,000,000 kills
Boss 2 - 900,000 kills
Boss 3 - 800,000 kills
Boss 4 - 5 kills

Him: "Hmm, Large decline in first boss kills to 4th boss. Tuning issue?"
You: "Lol, that ratio means nothing!"

Fucking, seriously

[Deleted]

What. Can you reread his post. He's comparing how many have killed Mythic Skorp, to how many have killed mythic spellblade.

Definately, but he's not comparing them in difficulty, but your reply was regarding how much easier of a boss Skorpyron is compared to Spellblade. If you were to make a graph that shows the increase in difficutly between a boss at its heroic difficulty compared to its mythic difficulty, that graph should be an exponentially increasing line where say the difference in difficulty between Skorp HC and Skorp M is maybe 5 times harder, then CA M should be maybe 6 times harder than CA HC and so on. The issue is that that line goes through the roof when you get to Spellblade where the M version is astronomically harder than the HC version: a wall.

[Emerald Archer]

His way of proving it isn't elegant or perfect but it is an decent indicator. I'm not even sure how you are disputing this - but then again its MMO Champion, somebody has to kick up a fuss about everything here.

Boss 1 - 1,000,000 kills
Boss 2 - 900,000 kills
Boss 3 - 800,000 kills
Boss 4 - 5 kills

Him: "Hmm, Large decline in first boss kills to 4th boss. Tuning issue?"
You: "Lol, that ratio means nothing!"

Fucking, seriously

But Boss 1 is being compared to boss 4, when in reality it should be compared to 4 different bosses. Yes there is a large difficulty spike, but it isn't as large a spike as people are implying. It's great that Spellblade got nerfed, now it will be a good 4th boss and make the difficulty jump a lot softer. I'm all for it. But just the information being used, is a bit stupid. Not sure why everyones feeling the need to defend that. Fact is, it's a shitty source that just happens to be correct. But it is correct.

You're bitching that I'm disagreeing with his source of info, but agreeing with him. You're literally kicking up just as much of a fuss as I am.

[DeadSwordz]

More detailed maths to highlight how much of stumbling block Spellblade is:

Comparison (H:M ratio x 5)
Heroic : around 75% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H. Spellblade
Mythic : around 15% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M. Spellblade

Comparison (H:M ratio x 1.3)
Heroic : around 99% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H.Chronomatic Anomaly
Mythic : around 75% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M.Chronomatic Anomaly

Comparison (H:M ratio x 1.5)
Heroic : around 98% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H.Trilliax
Mythic : around 66% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M.Trilliax

Heroic : around 42% of raids that have killed H.Skorpyron have killed H.Guldan
Mythic : around 1% of raids that have killed M.Skorpyron have killed M.Guldan

just some detailed math to highlight how much of a stumbling block guldan is

[Deleted]

My guess is that at least the Star Augur nerf was mainly to pre-empt the issues that will happen when they disable these Weakauras that use nameplates to convey information to others. Clearly that guy will get harder with 7.2. Assuming 7.2 will hit next week (or latest week after), the timing seems about right.

[Myztikrice]

Messing up conjunction wipes you regardless of whether the boss has 10% less health or not. I don't see them being related at all.

[Saverem]

This is for last week: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...y=1&source=130

This is for this week: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...y=1&source=106

She lost almost 300 million HP, and is the only boss I've seen so far that's been nerfed. Thoughts?

Edit: Star Augur also nerfed.

Kill from last week: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...es&hostility=1

A wipe from this week: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ty=1&source=84

500mil hp loss.

My guess is that they're going to start slowly nerfing the bosses until ToS comes out to give the stragglers a chance to catch up a bit towards the end.

I suspect they'll be nerfing Krosus/Botanist/Tich/Elisande within a few weeks and then nerfing Gul'dan to cap it off.

[Aphrel]

Elisande was ages ago, and that was kinda of a reworking of the fight rather than a nerf, the fight now forces ppl to bring more healers, ppl were 2 healing it before (and kinda had to). They did the same with Star Augur, now they just nerfed it hard tough.

I dont know what your definition of a nerf is but to me its a nerf if a fight is easier afterwards. Both augur and elisande qualifys.

[Magicpot]

But Boss 1 is being compared to boss 4, when in reality it should be compared to 4 different bosses. Yes there is a large difficulty spike, but it isn't as large a spike as people are implying. It's great that Spellblade got nerfed, now it will be a good 4th boss and make the difficulty jump a lot softer. I'm all for it. But just the information being used, is a bit stupid. Not sure why everyones feeling the need to defend that. Fact is, it's a shitty source that just happens to be correct. But it is correct.

You're bitching that I'm disagreeing with his source of info, but agreeing with him. You're literally kicking up just as much of a fuss as I am.

I don't like difficulty spikes. Blizzard saw how well EN mythic performed in terms of how many people engaged in it and how many people enjoyed it. That some of the .001% er guilds found it to easy is irrelevant at that point.

If they want to keep people motivated in raiding, mythic difficulty ACROSS THE BOARD FOR ALL BOSSES needs to be brough down only just above heroic.

[DakonBlackblade]

I dont know what your definition of a nerf is but to me its a nerf if a fight is easier afterwards. Both augur and elisande qualifys.

Only the fight didn't become easier the boss HP was lowered while its damage was increase. The overall boss damage output increased a shitom, after the changes you are unable to do it with 2 healers cause you' d just not have enought HPS (which is waht Blizzard wanted), so the DPS check got lowered while the heal check increased, its a remodeling of the figth not a nerf. Some ppl will find it easier, some harder, it depends on what players you have/quality of your healers etc.

[MrExcelion]

My guess is that at least the Star Augur nerf was mainly to pre-empt the issues that will happen when they disable these Weakauras that use nameplates to convey information to others. Clearly that guy will get harder with 7.2. Assuming 7.2 will hit next week (or latest week after), the timing seems about right.

Those were my thoughts too

[Spotnick]

if you haven't kill them yet before nerfs, then you need blizzard help to do it

That is always a ridiculous statement. Assuming people who raid less need nerfs to kill bosses. I'd be ok with your statement if everybody was doing 12+ hours a week.

Plus, the progressive nerfs should be available soon with 7.2 as we farm more AP and have new traits.

[Teaon]

That is always a ridiculous statement. Assuming people who raid less need nerfs to kill bosses. I'd be ok with your statement if everybody was doing 12+ hours a week.

Plus, the progressive nerfs should be available soon with 7.2 as we farm more AP and have new traits.

part of the hardcore raid is the time commitment, so if you cannot have the time to do it, yeah you need the nerf to finish it in time.

[Emerald Archer]

I don't like difficulty spikes. Blizzard saw how well EN mythic performed in terms of how many people engaged in it and how many people enjoyed it. That some of the .001% er guilds found it to easy is irrelevant at that point.

If they want to keep people motivated in raiding, mythic difficulty ACROSS THE BOARD FOR ALL BOSSES needs to be brough down only just above heroic.

EN and the first 3 NH mythic bosses were undertuned. Mythic isn't for "The masses" it's for "The few" Willing to dedicate their time and be hardcore about downing bosses. Heroic is for the masses, the casual.

The mentality of "Lets make everything good for everyone so everyone can experience everything and be happy" is poor. Because then people who are more skilled, people who have more time to put in, suddenly get nothing back from that.

[Dracodraco]

Messing up conjunction wipes you regardless of whether the boss has 10% less health or not. I don't see them being related at all.

But all dps checks now being laughably easy to meet means that people can be less focused on keeping up their output during conjunctions, and focus 100% on doing the mechanic rather than trying to do it while pressing buttons.

Sure, messing it up wipes you - but don't act like a sizeable HP nerf doesn't help handle the mechanic by virtue of relaxing everything enough for you to focus on it.

[Relapses]

Nerfs were justified. Completion rates have been skewed by a poorly designed difficulty curve and the nonsensical, borderline psychopathic design of the current Artifact Weapon paragon trait. I'm fine with difficulty jumps in instances but I hope Blizzard has at least learned from this tier and will not make them occur after the third boss in the future.

[Magicpot]

EN and the first 3 NH mythic bosses were undertuned. Mythic isn't for "The masses" it's for "The few" Willing to dedicate their time and be hardcore about downing bosses. Heroic is for the masses, the casual.

The mentality of "Lets make everything good for everyone so everyone can experience everything and be happy" is poor. Because then people who are more skilled, people who have more time to put in, suddenly get nothing back from that.

There's your problem. It should be for the masses. The masses pay the bills. It's high time to stop catering to small and insignificant parts of the playerbase.

People who are more skilled and have more time put in are completly irrelevant in comparison to the masses, so don't give me that.

[Emerald Archer]

There's your problem. It should be for the masses. The masses pay the bills. It's high time to stop catering to small and insignificant parts of the playerbase.

People who are more skilled and have more time put in are completly irrelevant in comparison to the masses, so don't give me that.

You don't get it, you're looking at it as purely a business. Fact is, people at Blizzard have said, they design their game how they want it to be, if people stopped subbing, it would suck but they wouldn't go against their beliefs.

Who gives a shit if the masses pay the bills, if the game you make is no longer good? All content being easy.. that's what you want, and that's the joke here.

The game is an MMO, and already caters to the masses plenty, it just has an extra difficulty added on for the better players. You're heavily catered to already. Mythic is just the bonus for players who aren't shit.