Federal Government versus State Legaliztion

[Ghostpanther]

No State law can trump Federal law and for good reasons. The issue with pot being legal in some states is only one because so far the Federal authorities have not tried to enforce the Federal Law. If it is a law, it should be enforced or the law changed.

[Kellhound]

Federal law will win out if the Feds decide to push it. Federal law almost always beats state law, and this is not one of those areas the states can win.

[zEmini]

Federal law will win out if the Feds decide to push it. Federal law almost always beats state law, and this is not one of those areas the states can win.

Then the federal government is going against the voters of that state then. Sounds like tyranny to me honestly.

And being a libertarian I follow the "live and let live" philosophy. It isn't anyone's business what people do with their own bodies just like it isn't anyone's business what they do in the bedroom or at the alter. Anyone who disagrees is pretty much a fascist.

[Ghostpanther]

Then the federal government is going against the voters of that state then. Sounds like tyranny to me honestly.

And being a libertarian I follow the "live and let live" philosophy. It isn't anyone's business what people do with their own bodies just like it isn't anyone's business what they do in the bedroom or at the alter. Anyone who disagrees is pretty much a fascist.

Federal law is drafted by congress, who is made up of elected officials from each state. So no, they are not going against the voters, but are actually following the Constitutional process. If a law is felt to be unjust or needs to be changed, there is a process for doing that. But one of them is not for a state to give the finger to the feds.

[I Push Buttons]

Then the federal government is going against the voters of that state then. Sounds like tyranny to me honestly.

And being a libertarian I follow the "live and let live" philosophy. It isn't anyone's business what people do with their own bodies just like it isn't anyone's business what they do in the bedroom or at the alter. Anyone who disagrees is pretty much a fascist.

So thinking people shouldn't drink and drive and passing laws to that end makes one a fascist?

[Theodarzna]

In practical terms I am unsure what they Federal government can do without state level cooperation. Especially in California which has a huge population. The Feds could go for massive raids and spectacular punishments but that is likely going to be a headache for them.

In Practical terms I don't think the Feds can do much.

[Ghostpanther]

In practical terms I am unsure what they Federal government can do without state level cooperation. Especially in California which has a huge population. The Feds could go for massive raids and spectacular punishments but that is likely going to be a headache for them.

In Practical terms I don't think the Feds can do much.

They can do a lot. Not a invasion of the state with federal troops however ( that would only happen as a last straw, desperate scenario ) Lol! But they have several ways to deal with them, that would get their attention pretty fast. Money wields a lot of power.

[Theodarzna]

They can do a lot. Not a invasion of the state with federal troops however ( that would only happen as a last straw, desperate scenario ) Lol! But they have several ways to deal with them, that would get their attention pretty fast. Money wields a lot of power.

I am unsure if Marijuana policy is the hill the GOP wants to fight over.

[zEmini]

So thinking people shouldn't drink and drive and passing laws to that end makes one a fascist?

There is a massive difference with personal use versus endangering others.

[Alydael]

[QUOTE=Nixx;45089626]I think at a certain point, as in depending on the type of drug, you could make a reasonable case that the expected value is sufficiently negative and impacting more than just the individual that the public has a justifiable interest in preventing its use, but even in those case I think drugs should be more of a public health issue than a criminal justice one. For instance, we wouldn't want people to decide cooking meth in their kitchen is super fun, given the extremely hazardous nature of production and it's pretty easy to lay out a scenario where it might rather frequently inadvertently impact people who decided not to cook meth in their kitchen in pretty severe ways. Not being a hardcore libertarian, I find it rather unreasonable that said people are likely to find a lot of comfort in a bag full of money paid in restitution for damages suffered.

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Well we have spent billions (yes billions) trying to stop people from getting high. Guess what? It didn't work and there are more people using than ever. As for the negative impact of drugs- all that stuff is already happening- although it is illegal to do so. So, making it illegal and trying to stop it with billions of dollars (wow, how many families could that have fed?) hasn't worked at all and has resulted in actually more people using.

Why should we keep using a policy that very obviously is not working?

[Kujako]

Why should we keep using a policy that very obviously is not working? After all, murders still happen despite being illegal, and we've spent billions (yes, billions) trying to stop people from committing them.

But did we start going after murderers specifically to get an excuse to arrest hippies and jazz musicians?

[Alydael]

Why should we keep using a policy that very obviously is not working? After all, murders still happen despite being illegal, and we've spent billions (yes, billions) trying to stop people from committing them.

Yeah, except for the fact that murderers kill people. Drug addicts are only harming themselves. It's their body- if they want to do that, it is their right.

Also, if our policy to prevent murder was actually leading to more murders (like how our anti-drug policy lead to more people using) I would suggest changing our policy on murder prevention.

In both places drugs are legal, usage went down. In portugal (i think) all drugs are legal. After an initial uptick- usage levels dropped. The same thing in Amsterdam.

Why is this?

Once you make drugs legal- they aren't "underground" or "cool" anymore. There are many that start just for that reason. So, I would hypothesize, the more illegal and underground you make them- the more people will want to try them to seem "cool" and "rebellious."

Legalize them, put them in a pharmacy. Make it so you need a card to buy them and have restrictions on the card (such as: you need to have a job, etc). Clean it up, take the money out of hands of criminals and cartels. Tax it- actually make money on the deal. Free up those anti- drug billions to do better things (like feed the hungry). they don't seem so "cool" and "rebellious" at that point, do they?

You will never stop people from using drugs- it has never worked and it is a completely wasteful endeavor.

[Deleted]

Federal government trumps state government.

Federal law trumps state law.

The states that have begun to legalize marijuana are in violation of federal law and could theoretically be forced to stop doing so and we could see people being criminally convicted for it.

[Kujako]

Federal government trumps state government.

Federal law trumps state law.

So it has it painted gold and made in china?

[Deleted]

So it has it painted gold and made in china?

'Trumps' has become my favorite word.

[Total Crica]

Federal government trumps state government.

Federal law trumps state law.

The states that have begun to legalize marijuana are in violation of federal law and could theoretically be forced to stop doing so and we could see people being criminally convicted for it.

Convicted of doing what though?

Are any states having maryjane crimes happening since those states legalized it?

Are people selling maryjane to kids in those states like they do alcohol?

Are people driving while high on maryjane and causing accidents in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people showing up to work while high on maryjane and causing accidents in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people committing murders/suicides while high on maryjane in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people robbing/damaging other people/businesses/property while high on maryjane in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

What crimes are people committing while high on maryjane that the feds would need to show up to these states and arrest them for?

[Jonnusthegreat]

All drugs should be legal. Criminals should be severely punished.

And in this (and most) cases, the federal government supercedes state government.

[Damajin]

Federal government is shit.
Drug users, sellers and profiteers are shit.

I really have no side in this fight.

[Deleted]

Convicted of doing what though?

Are any states having maryjane crimes happening since those states legalized it?

Are people selling maryjane to kids in those states like they do alcohol?

Are people driving while high on maryjane and causing accidents in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people showing up to work while high on maryjane and causing accidents in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people committing murders/suicides while high on maryjane in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

Are people robbing/damaging other people/businesses/property while high on maryjane in those states like they do when drunk on alcohol?

What crimes are people committing while high on maryjane that the feds would need to show up to these states and arrest them for?

What part of the word theoretically don't you understand?

And it's not about what they do under the influence of it. Possessing and distributing it are criminal offenses, that's enough reason why they might press charges.

[Total Crica]

What part of the word theoretically don't you understand?

Are people doing those things when high on maryjane in states that have legalized it?

Are people "theoretically" going to do any of those things when high on maryjane in states that have legalized it?

People ARE doing those things when drunk on alcohol and yet drinking alcohol isn't a federal crime.