Poll: Should the Pledge of Allegiance be removed from schools?

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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Akaihiryuu View Post
    160 years, not 60. It was a Cold War thing, to produce propoganda to make people hate the Russians more I guess. By portraying the Soviets as "evil communist athiests" (even they were none of those things). They weren't communist in any sense of the word, and they were more religious than the US was.

    Lesson: Don't believe anything the government tells you. The vast majority of it is lies.
    No, 60 years. 62, to be exact. The Pledge was written in 1892, "under God" was added in 1954. And I am well aware of why it was added, to distinguish us from the heathen Commies, Cold War propaganda.

    What I was actually asking was for the person I quoted to explain to me why, if traditional Christian values were so core to the country, "under God" was not included when the Pledge was first written.

    Also, fun fact, the Pledge was written by a socialist. Cold War propaganda indeed.

  2. #142
    Make it an optional once a month thing. Having it every day is a waste of time.

    And remove "Under god" from it. This isn't a christian nation.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Taftvalue View Post
    No and the school prayer needs to return. Atheists can go sit in the corner.
    5 years and 18k posts wasted on shitposting. What a waste of life.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Souls View Post

    Students in U.S. schools stand up and recite this together at the beginning of each school day. It is usually followed by a moment of silence.
    Um this isn't even remotely true. I think maybe one time in middle school they did it over the intercom.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Allybeboba View Post
    Pretty hard for a lot of other countries to fathom that the US has had a single contiguous government for over 240 years. Longer than all the European countries.
    Depends on whether or not you consider Iceland a European nation.

  6. #146
    Elemental Lord Templar 331's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Safol View Post
    Again, loyalty isn't faith. At best, you can argue that it is somewhat based in trust of your fellow national, but even then, it's a compilation of several things.

    I said loyalty is based on faith, not that it is faith. And you're hanging up on a word while misunderstand the meaning of the phrase. If you want to change out "loyalty" and "faith" in my post go right ahead.


    Tell me again, how ensuring loyalty is a negative thing.

    Depends on how you go about it. Forcing children to pledge their loyalty is wrong since they have no means of critical thinking. You can tell them once a year a fat man in a red suit goes around and delivers presents to good little kids and they'd believe it. Or at worst you could do like all other fascist regimes have done and murdered people who weren't loyal.

    The "right" way of ensuring loyalty would be to not give them a reason to be disloyal in the first place. Like not selling out it's citizens to corporate interests......

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Pledge of Allegiance is a loyalty oath aimed at the Southern man.

    "One nation", not two nations.
    "Indivisible", means you can't split it up.

    "With liberty and justice for all", we'll treat you fairly if you agree.

    Some say the US Civil war was one of the bloodiest conflicts in human history, the pledge is just a small thing meant to keep war from happening again.

    I'm amazed at the people who don't realize what it is.
    Erm, who says that? It pales in death count as well treatment of enemy soldiers.

    Bloodiest in American History sure.. But Human? No.

  8. #148
    Elemental Lord Templar 331's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt4pack View Post
    Um this isn't even remotely true. I think maybe one time in middle school they did it over the intercom.
    I did it everyday for 13 years and was forced to do it or face punishment.

    Southerners tend to bleed red, white, and blue.....

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Howner View Post
    http://constitutionus.com/

    Find ONE reference in here to God or Christianity, i dare you. Because CTRL + F finds nothing. Sorry you dont like it.
    Nine days after first US Constitutional Congress convened, on April 9, 1989, they voted to appoint chaplains for the House and Senate. And the people who voted for that? They were the exact same people who wrote and voted approval for the First Amendment. Sorry you don't like it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    Make it an optional once a month thing. Having it every day is a waste of time.

    And remove "Under god" from it. This isn't a christian nation.
    "God" is not only a Christian concept.

  10. #150
    Elemental Lord Templar 331's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeka View Post
    Nine days after first US Constitutional Congress convened, on April 9, 1989, they voted to appoint chaplains for the House and Senate. And the people who voted for that? They were the exact same people who wrote and voted approval for the First Amendment. Sorry you don't like it.
    You might want to check your date there.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapla...epresentatives

    Also this is in line with the Constitution since this doesn't reference any religion and gives congress power to create officers.

  11. #151
    The Lightbringer Clone's Avatar
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    I didn't recite the pledge and nobody gave me shit about it. I did stand up to be polite though. There were also people that didn't stand to be edgy and nobody gave them shit about it either.

  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nexx226 View Post
    I wonder how many people this is true for are from the south.
    I grew up and live in Houston, it's been twelve years since I graduated from high school though, so not sure if that's still the case.

  13. #153
    Immortal Poopymonster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nexx226 View Post
    I wonder how many people this is true for are from the south.
    Or from rural xenophobic shitholes in the north. As an atheist in a small town in Michigan, you kept that shit quiet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    Quit using other posters as levels of crazy. That is not ok


    If you look, you can see the straw man walking a red herring up a slippery slope coming to join this conversation.

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Allybeboba View Post
    Is that a bad thing to be proud of your country?
    i said its not bad, its to make children feel proud (but seem a little christian brainwashing as well )

  15. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    A verbal pledge every day does seem a bit annoying though, I think it was done once a week when I was in grade school.
    Indeed, even soldiers give their oath only once :P (at least here).

    But in principle I see nothing wrong with pledging loyalty to the country which enables you to live there in the first place, and to its values. The US isn't a dictatorship, regardless of what those delusional Trump haters are screaming about.

  16. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Templar 331 View Post
    I said loyalty is based on faith, not that it is faith. And you're hanging up on a word while misunderstand the meaning of the phrase. If you want to change out "loyalty" and "faith" in my post go right ahead.





    Depends on how you go about it. Forcing children to pledge their loyalty is wrong since they have no means of critical thinking. You can tell them once a year a fat man in a red suit goes around and delivers presents to good little kids and they'd believe it. Or at worst you could do like all other fascist regimes have done and murdered people who weren't loyal.

    The "right" way of ensuring loyalty would be to not give them a reason to be disloyal in the first place. Like not selling out it's citizens to corporate interests......
    Loyalty to the father/motherland above most all, it's an extension of your family. It's not faith, it's civic duty.

    Would you call it "blind faith" and not """right""" when the red army halted the nazis at Stalingrad, holding together only because they all were working towards a singular goal, undying loyalty to this goal is what won them the war.
    Last edited by mmocbf3af6dcb2; 2017-03-25 at 11:32 PM.

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeka View Post

    "God" is not only a Christian concept.
    No, but the "under god" in the pledge is a direct reference to the christian god.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by mariovsgoku View Post
    Our country was formed as a christian country "under god". It is a part of our history. Sorry you don't like it.
    Oh look at this


    The Treaty of Tripoli

    Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen (Muslims); and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan (Mohammedan) nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.
    Oohhh ooooowww the facts...they burn!
    Quote Originally Posted by lakers01 View Post
    Those damn liberal colleges! Can you believe they brainwash people into thinking murder is wrong! And don't get me started with all that critical thinking bullshit!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    I'm being trickled on from above. Wait that's not money.

  19. #159
    Elemental Lord Templar 331's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Safol View Post
    Loyalty to the father/motherland above most all, it's an extension of your family. It's not faith, it's civic duty.

    Would you call it "blind faith" and not """right""" when the red army halted the nazis at Stalingrad, holding together only because they all were working towards a singular goal, undying loyalty to this goal is what won them the war.
    I'm not a WW2 buff but wasn't Stalin's plan "throw as many bodies at the enemy as it takes"? Along with other atrocities he committed kind of proves my point against blind loyalty.

    But your point of defending your country against invaders is valid as long as it's not your country doing the invading first, as was the case for the Nazis.

  20. #160
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Templar 331 View Post
    I'm not a WW2 buff but wasn't Stalin's plan "throw as many bodies at the enemy as it takes"? Along with other atrocities he committed kind of proves my point against blind loyalty.

    But your point of defending your country against invaders is valid as long as it's not your country doing the invading first, as was the case for the Nazis.
    Okay, but the US are not the nazis. I don't see why you keep making this connection, it's irrelevant.

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