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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Trying to squeeze the penniless for a few extra pennies isn't as novel as one might expect.
    they are penniless because they choose to be social parasites by choosing to not remain employed.
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Dragonheart View Post
    So, they want to tax people for not having money...
    No, they want to tax people who do not pay taxes. Do you see the difference here? The law does not ask wether you have money or have a job. It has a single criteria - have you paid taxes during last 183 days? If not - you pay a fine of $230 next year and can continue as you like, tax free. Until the next year that is.
    Last edited by Gaaz; 2017-03-26 at 03:45 PM.

  3. #63
    Elemental Lord Lady Dragonheart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaaz View Post
    No, they want to tax people who do not pay taxes. Do you see the difference here? The law does not ask wether you have money or have a job. It has a single criteria - have you paid taxes during last 183 days? If not - you pay a fine of $230 next year and can continue as you like, tax free. Until the next year that is.
    That's the same thing, though, since you're taxed for working.

    Essentially, you'd be taxing the homeless, disabled, and retired that don't own their own homes.
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  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    they are penniless because they choose to be social parasites by choosing to not remain employed.
    To be clear, is your stance that they owe the government money simply by virtue of having been born there? If that is the case, I have a couple follow-up questions, but I'll hold them pending whether I'm understanding you correctly or not.

  5. #65
    In positive news for Belarus, this is the first time in like a decade they managed to reach international news. Also, in regards to the last line of the article. Yes, Lukashenka was seeking to improve ties with the West and lessen the country's dependence on Russia (in part to play the Polish government like the bunch of gullible retards they are). It is no longer the case for a few weeks at least. He got what he wanted, Belorussian pendulum swung back to Russia. And, for example, the common maneuvers that until recently were a "threat to Belorussian sovereignty" or some nonsense like that are now peaceful cooperation with their beloved neighbor.


    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    This is counterproductive from a policy perspective.

    More importantly, it's deeply immoral. No one owes the state their labor. Scott Alexander writes about this more eloquently than I ever could in this post; I really recommend the whole thing, but this taste summarizes what I think:

    Point being that modern society is really hard on some people and the solution is not to bludgeon those people.
    It also runs against some of the position of taxation.
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    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    The uninsured penalty is fine. They should have just done a better job of making sure there was financial support for people who couldn't afford insurance, though the lack of support was largely the fault of Republican state governments being obstinate assbutts and rejecting the medicaid expansion out of spite. The point wasn't to tax people for being poor, but to keep people from cheating the system and ignoring the mandate.
    It's a pretty terrible, convoluted system. If the goal is to provide people healthcare, it's much more efficient to simply provide them healthcare than it is to provide tax credits to go buy health insurance.

    I realize this wasn't an option because of political considerations, but it's pretty obvious that what passed was basically a giant handout for insurance companies and medical providers.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    Pretty sure the US has laws against that, but sure.
    Citizenship-based taxation is a travesty, and precisely why I chose to live off the wilds long ago. Americans who were born and raised in the US will have to pay taxes to Uncle Sam for their entire lives, even if they are permanently residing and earning their income elsewhere. Why haven't we marched on the White House yet?

    The old man, who owns the internet café that I am currently using, understands how I feel and never asks me for an ID card when I come in to log on and post on MMOC. I know that the way taxes are handled in the land of the free is a grave injustice which all Americans can sympathize with, whether they want to admit it or not.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Dragonheart View Post
    That's the same thing, though, since you're taxed for working.

    Essentially, you'd be taxing the homeless, disabled, and retired that don't own their own homes.
    Nope. You are taxed for working only if you are either officially employed, or you own a registered company. Self employed people in Belarus are not taxed for the most part. So are people with unemployment benefits. In effect this law makes it identical to the US counterpart - you do pay taxes out of your unemployment benefits in vast majotity of states. So if you recieve unemployment benefits (disabled, retired etc.) in Belarus, you will now have to pay taxes like everyone else. If you pay them already - nothing is changed. The only people that have it different are people that are self employed and do not pay any tax at all.

  9. #69
    Couldn't they come up with some kind of bonus instead, like if you did what was expected of you like rehabilitation, schooling and seeking jobs, generally doing what the government told you to you would get a "carrot"? No undocumented leave should be part of it to.

  10. #70
    Legendary! Vargur's Avatar
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    Take a look at Belarus, it's the future of countries outside of the EU and in Russia's sphere of influence.
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  11. #71
    Banned JohnBrown1917's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dittoooo View Post
    Citizenship-based taxation is a travesty, and precisely why I chose to live off the wilds long ago. Americans who were born and raised in the US will have to pay taxes to Uncle Sam for their entire lives, even if they are permanently residing and earning their income elsewhere. Why haven't we marched on the White House yet?

    The old man, who owns the internet café that I am currently using, understands how I feel and never asks me for an ID card when I come in to log on and post on MMOC. I know that the way taxes are handled in the land of the free is a grave injustice which all Americans can sympathize with, whether they want to admit it or not.
    Oh, now I get it, you're one of those Sovereign citizens who thinks he can ignore laws.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    they are penniless because they choose to be social parasites by choosing to not remain employed.
    choose

    That's one big fat assumption you got going on there, an extremely dumb one that said.





    Completely abhorrent, good thing Belarus is, and will continue to be as irrelevant as it comes these days.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    To be clear, is your stance that they owe the government money simply by virtue of having been born there? If that is the case, I have a couple follow-up questions, but I'll hold them pending whether I'm understanding you correctly or not.
    isn't that how the U.S. gets to tax people nearly half their income? simply because we live here?
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargur View Post
    Take a look at Belarus, it's the future of countries outside of the EU and in Russia's sphere of influence.
    Do they not pay taxes "inside" the EU?

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Xekus View Post
    choose

    That's one big fat assumption you got going on there, an extremely dumb one that said.





    Completely abhorrent, good thing Belarus is, and will continue to be as irrelevant as it comes these days.
    a quadriplegic amputee can work at a phone center. so yes choose.
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    isn't that how the U.S. gets to tax people nearly half their income? simply because we live here?
    This is very different from claiming that people owe the state money simply by being alive.

  17. #77
    Deleted
    Belarus doing mass arrests today : protesters, local/foreign journalists, politicians, foreign observers.

    The last European dictatorship is running scared. inb4uprising.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    This is very different from claiming that people owe the state money simply by being alive.
    How is it? Even if you are completely unemployed for the year you are required to file your income taxes.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Are you going to force that company to take expensive measures to enable that person to perform their job and/or provide charity in the form of ongoing employment for a substandard employee should it simply not prove feasible?
    U.S. employers are required by law to not discriminate against disabled people.
    And I am assuming disabled people are the only leg that someone on here would have to stand on when claiming that social parasites did not choose to remain unemployed.
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  19. #79
    forcing people to work = slavery
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinra1 View Post
    black people have no power, privilege they cannot be racist since they were oppressed
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodakane View Post
    Men are NOT suffering societal hardships due to being male. That doesn't exist in most 1st world countries.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    Oh, now I get it, you're one of those Sovereign citizens who thinks he can ignore laws.
    I'm just an awake defender of what it means to be American, and someone who is not particularly excited at the thought of our draconian taxation system being absent from every other mass of land in the world. Well, except for Eritrea, which is probably one of those countries where taking a dump in the streets in a cultural thing.

    Meh, what do I know about patriotism. I only lost a whole goddamn ear to a shrapnel blast in Irak, while you were watching shows that involved twelve year old cat-like children wiggling their butts in a sauna.

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