Why does Gul´dan mythic have to last over 15 minutes?

[Dracodraco]

Well, the lust debuff dropped as soon as you hit P2 and we used the "AFK platform" strat so that obviously had a bit to do with the length of time it took us to complete the encounter. That said, it was still a long ass fucking encounter.

Im 100% unsure what that has to do with what I just said xd. I was just pointing out that there was a P1 buff to shorten it.

[shaunika123]

First tier always has a 15+ min boss, its almost like a meme.
Cata Nef
MoP Sha
WoD The ogre guy
Legion Guldan

cata final boss was sinestra and that fight was like 6 minutes (and to this day my favourite final boss because of that)
it was still intense and fun

blackhand was also one of the best fights and it was like 8-9 minutes tops

you can make hard fights be short

it's just easier to make them long than to actually make them hard

[Relapses]

Im 100% unsure what that has to do with what I just said xd. I was just pointing out that there was a P1 buff to shorten it.

Dude who replied to me implied that Blizzard did something to make Sha of Fear Heroic a "shorter encounter," and I responded with an explanation of the way the guild I was in (which is where the video I linked is from) as to why it was still a pretty long fucking encounter even as late in T14 as one week before ToT was released.

[Deleted]

The stuff that's wrong with long encounters is something similar to Yogg P1.

When I look at Elisandre for example, the encounter has a 10m or something enrage to it... and tbh, it's a pretty busy fight and I don't feel bored by it at all.
Guldan on HC (for example) on the other hand is long and boring. Not much going on there and that's probably the only reason why a long fight might be bad.

15min Brutallus is, after all, pretty horrible. Not sure where Mythic Guldan fits into this with the extra phase and all.

[Deleted]

cata final boss was sinestra and that fight was like 6 minutes (and to this day my favourite final boss because of that)
it was still intense and fun

blackhand was also one of the best fights and it was like 8-9 minutes tops

you can make hard fights be short

it's just easier to make them long than to actually make them hard

cata final boss was sinestra what? deathwing was last boss of cata

- - - Updated - - -

The stuff that's wrong with long encounters is something similar to Yogg P1.

When I look at Elisandre for example, the encounter has a 10m or something enrage to it... and tbh, it's a pretty busy fight and I don't feel bored by it at all.
Guldan on HC (for example) on the other hand is long and boring. Not much going on there and that's probably the only reason why a long fight might be bad.

15min Brutallus is, after all, pretty horrible. Not sure where Mythic Guldan fits into this with the extra phase and all.

Im not bored on guldan , i like him more then elisande

[Deleted]

Im not bored on guldan , i like him more then elisande

I guess it depends on what role you play, I don't see how a DD can really enjoy him though (design wise). He's extremely bland, barely any movemet or awareness needed.

[Zyky]

First tier always has a 15+ min boss, its almost like a meme.
Cata Nef
MoP Sha
WoD The ogre guy
Legion Guldan

You don't mean always, you mean after Activision took over*

[shaunika123]

cata final boss was sinestra what? deathwing was last boss of cata

i obviously ment in the first tier, if you read what i was replying to you'd know that...

[Deleted]

It'll be a 10 minute fight next week due to the insane damage upgrades the majority of classes will be getting.

[Thage]

As @Nitros14 mentioned, historically bleeding-edge raid end bosses lasted between 15-25 minutes; it's only been a fairly recent trend as of WoD that they were pared down to 10-15 minutes on the highest difficulty setting. In response to complaints that EN felt too easy, Blizzard upped the challenge in Nighthold, including longer fights.

[Kayzza]

Nefarian often took 25 minutes in Blackwing Lair. Four Horsemen was 20-25 minutes.

Cool but on those fights you could lose people and still kill it. Nowadays 15 minute endfights are usually done once you lose 1-2 people + all br's. Not to mention wayyyy harder and less forgiving mechanics.

[Deleted]

You don't mean always, you mean after Activision took over*

Activision and Blizzard merged in 2007. If your reference made any sense you'd have 15 minute bosses every tier, but we don't, we have them generally once, maybe twice per tier, and it's always on the lore ridden bosses as well. Not to mention most guilds are killing it around 14min now.

[ComputerNerd]

Because it creates long boring fights that accomplish more in consuming time than anything else. I think 8-12 minutes is quite long enough for an endboss, and you can fit in a lot of mechanics with that time frame without it dragging out forever like for example Iron Maidens in Blackrock Foundry.

Why that arbitrary duration.
Why 8 instead of 7 or 9.
That is an inherent problem in stating that a specific number is bad, while another with not a lot of difference is good.

[Bigbazz]

Why that arbitrary duration.
Why 8 instead of 7 or 9.
That is an inherent problem in stating that a specific number is bad, while another with not a lot of difference is good.

You're purposely trying to turn this into an argument of semantics despite fully understanding the wavelength of my post?

[Zyky]

Activision and Blizzard merged in 2007. There have been enough short and long bosses since then.

You're bringing up a point that isn't being discussed. The specific point made was "First tier always has a 15+ min boss, its almost like a meme.". Also you're wrong about the year they merged. They merged in 2008, right before Wrath released, which means Cata was the first, first tier they worked on.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

You're bringing up a point that isn't being discussed. The specific point made was "First tier always has a 15+ min boss, its almost like a meme.". Also you're wrong about the year they merged. They merged in 2008, right before Wrath released, which means Cata was the first, first tier they worked on.

Doesn't really matter there is no correlation between activision merge and some big change in development.

[ComputerNerd]

You're purposely trying to turn this into an argument of semantics despite fully understanding the wavelength of my post?

It is important when someone defines something as too long, too big, too small etc with an arbitrary number as the reason.
Because it sucks as an argument.
There are other long encounters not receiving that same criticism, at least not from this same person.
And that is because there is not something simply wrong with it in their eyes just because of the duration, but that is what they focus on.
What makes some encounters of a similar duration more appealing to you, and what makes them unappealing.
While personal and subjective, THAT is what should be the point instead of whining it is too long.
Because of past example, that is proven to be utterly false.

[Bigbazz]

It is important when someone defines something as too long, too big, too small etc with an arbitrary number as the reason.
Because it sucks as an argument.
There are other long encounters not receiving that same criticism, at least not from this same person.
And that is because there is not something simply wrong with it in their eyes just because of the duration, but that is what they focus on.

So an irrelevant argument of semantics then, got it. I do refer you to my first post and the example of Iron Maidens though.

[Deleted]

Doing a google search on this and people are saying some of the old raid boss fights could last up to 30 minutes, so 15 minutes could be seen as a walk in the park plus the fact that you are beating the snot out of Illidan in the last part of that fight..

Longest fight I ever did was my first Illidan kill. Around 22-23 minutes I think?

[Zyky]

Doesn't really matter there is no correlation between activision merge and some big change in development.

You're dense huh? There's a reason that every expansion that they directly influenced AKA Cata-Legion, has caused more and more sub declines. Blizzard wants to say "they don't effect anything" and "players quit because they get older" but the reality is Activision directly influences every path the game makes. There are players who are of all age groups, of all family types, age has nothing to do with it. Its the fact that they just can't produce a great concept anymore.